I agree with what Spot said - also check out some of my posts on the same issue. I personally love the conversion that VV does to 24p.

Would it work well with Canon frame mode thinking of shooting video completley in frame mode but I have heard some problems while using the conversion and frame mode?

I can't say with the Canon - but somewhere, either over on DMN or here, there was some mention of Canon and how they handle this differently (?) than the norm. Do a search. Also did you read the SoFo white paper on 24p? Lots of good info in that.

Sorry for my ignorance here, but I'm a little confused about:
"SoFo white paper on 24p"
-is this something that you can read when you download an update of Vegas?
Also, you people are saying vegas does as good a job converting 60i to 24p as something like magic bullet, are you? That would rock the house!

I would not go with the frame mode thing with the canon. There's something about how you lose a lot of resolution that way. CHeck dvfilmmaker.com about it.

Exactly Musman thats my point.. DO I need magic bullet.. Folks here that have replied to this post say Vegas can 1. Deinterlace 2. apply subtle blurs color corrections, tweaks etc.... 3. Render to 24P

So I ask Do I need Magic Bullet? How much better will it get?? 995$ better?

>>>So I ask Do I need Magic Bullet? How much better will it get?? 995$ better?<<<

MB offers a lot more color correction that is specific to a "film look." What kind of work are you going to do? That should be the main issue. VV can do wonderful things but if all you are going to do is "ilm look" than you would be better off getting MB. The new version is faster I understand but I also understand it only works on P4's. You also need AE to use it so there is a "major" investment going out here to get it.

I don't think anyone can really answer the question "So I ask Do I need Magic Bullet?" other than yourself. If you are doing wedding videos you probably do not need it. If you are doing student projects, school sports events, your families home movies and so on - you probably would not need it. If you are doing feature films, short films and anyting else to be put onto film - you may need it. If you are doing high end music videos for Mtv, VH1, CMT, Much/Fuse and so on you may need it. (The Cher video was one of the first projects the Orphange used magic bullet on I believe) I personally look at Magic Bullet as a color correction suite. Yes it does other things but would you spend that much money to add a letterbox? Would you spend that much moeny just to do 4:3 > 16:9? Would you spend that much money to do 24p conversions? if so than MB is a good thing, if not than it may not be. I found I liked ReelSmart Twixtor better than the conversion in MB - but other people think MB is better. I can do letterbox in many NLE's - I certianly don't need MB to add black bars for me. I love the looks that Digital Film Lab gives me. But...if you only want one plug-in that "does it all" than MB could be right for you.

Now - one important thing to remember - most times **it in = **it out. MB ain't gonna make really really poorly shot video to look like Days of Heaven or Picnic at Hanging Rock. It probably won't even make it look like Last House on the Left. Which goes back to what I said above - what are you going to use it for? Will your end justify the cost of new software and possibly a new system?

And about the white paper - go to the VV 4 Manual Downloads - it is listed there as "24p White Paper."

Please don't anyone think Im trying to rain on their parade but I see a worrying trend in this forum. Someone wants to create a blizzard, another fill a room with smoke and just about everyone want to make their video look like it was shot on film.

There are ways to do these things and no doubt those who've asked have got very good and ingeneous replies and hopefully ended up with something that looked half decent.

Could I offer a bold alternative?

Try shooting in a blizzard or get some fake snow and a fan, fill a room with smoke from a smoke machine or dare I suggest it shoot on film. I've got my tongue half in my cheek, at least on that last one but a bit of imagination in what happens in front of the camera can make the world of difference.

I know this isn't always possible, I know we (me included) can't afford to shoot on film but I just want to counter the idea that anything can be done in post. Sure many things can, to do them really well may be much more expensive tha doing it right to start with and still not look as good. Not only that but doing it in production can be a hell of a lot more fun to boot, at least you get to have some fun trying things in the real world with real people.

I've spent a bit of time over the last few weeks trying to help people fix up things that got screwed up during a shoot due to either lack of the most simple planning or checking of gear. Its rather depressing work, sure you feel good if you can pull it off for them but then you think of all the effort that could have been saved if it was done right in the first place.

To get back to the topic, and this has been said many times before, the 'film look' is far more than just 24p, its far more than just gamma, its far more than just lighting, its also scripts, cast, music to name but a few.

If you can't manage those at the very least start with a good idea / story. If you've got that the audience will forgive you the rest, without it the rest will not save you.

I feel better now and shall get off my soapbox.....

Lemme have that soapbox a second.

I have a DVX100 which was used to shoot the first 1/3 of a feature in progress, using a very weak Tiffen filter and the 24p/cine-gamma setting. My DP is excellent with lighting and the interplay between f-stops and shutter speed (moral: read everything you can find on lighting and film camera settings), so the result has literally made people stop in their tracks with mouths open, and ask me "how did you afford to shoot this on film?" Combine Vegas 4.0d's plugins with the DVX100 and you're ready for a film festival--put it through DVD-Architect, still in 24p with Dolby stereo sound, and submit it.

Next.