This explains a lot, John, thanks. I might as well ask, is this also the case with 30p? I'm guessing 60i is probably "good to go" in Vegas?

I've done some "googling" and think I've found some recipes to solve this. They look rather convoluted, but they'll work.

Thanks,

Joe

As a followup to this, in case anyone else is in the same boat...

I have downloaded the 14 day trial of CineForm Neo HD. It is absolutely fantastic! It has completely solved my 24p issues with the Canon HF10.

My workflow now is: run all my Canon MTS files through HDLink (the conversion utility that is the main interface with Neo HD) and I select the remove pulldown in order to do the inverse telecine. Now, this works perfectly and "fixes" the file making it a true 24p file. I then bring the converted files which are AVI's into Vegas.

Not only does this actually WORK, but as a side benefit, the issues of speed in both editing and rendering are completely eliminated! It's just like editing and working with a non-AVCHD file (since it IS a non-AVCHD file!)

The only drawback to this is the rather high price of Cineform Neo HD. The HDV version is slightly less expensive. In any case, it IS the solution I've been looking for. I just wish it was cheaper.

Joe

Joe,
I have the same camera, and live in the PAL side of the globe. What about you and your camera? Thanks a lot for this post! I need the same, and will definitely look into the CineForm application.

Ingvarai

Pretty sure it is just the same as the DVX-100 where the 24P and/or 30P is wrapped in a 29.97 file so it will always show up as 29.97 no matter what you shoot on that camera and you do not need to do anything fancy it post. Correct me if I'm wrong but I think the pulldown is done in the camera.

Ingvar:

If you live in PAL land and you have a PAL camcorder, I doubt you need it. You have 25p native and 50i native. Why would you need 24p pull down?

Hey guys,

I cannot speak for the PAL side of things...I do understand that perhaps it is not necessary to do the pulldown, but I don't know for sure. In the NTSC world where I live, it is *absolutely* necessary.

As for the DVX-100, I am also not so sure. I do know that with the Panasonic HDC-SD9, 24p is handled differently than in the Canon cameras. For example, I did not need to do anything special with the SD9 as I do with the HF10. This, of course, is due to the "unusual" way that Canon encodes 24p. Quite frankly, I don't know why Canon simply can't include a utility to do this, but I suspect that 99% of the people who by the HF10/100 are simply plugging them into a TV and viewing that way.

Now, of course, if you simply play back your camera over a TV, you are fine, no need to do anything. BUT, for NTSC world, at least, in order to process true 24p from the Canon inside of an NLE, it is necessary, because Canon uses telecine to encode the 24 progressive inside of a 60 interlaced stream. Basically, with the Canon HF10/100 (and other cameras as well, but for sure with the HF10/100, HV20/30, etc. this is how Canon encodes it and it is necessary to do the inverse telecine in order to work with the true 24p. And, yes, it absolutely LOOKS different! Also, I was getting a LOT of crashes in Vegas when I was working with 24p if I did not remove the pulldown. It is now solid as a rock!

Please check out Eugenia's excellent article on this here:

http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2007/07/13/canon-hv20-24p-pulldown/

She is speaking specifically regarding the HV20, but the 24p encoding is handled the same in many Canon cameras, including the HF10/100 and, I suspect, the new HF11 (which is only available in Japan at the moment.)

Also, check out: www.cineform.com for more information on this.

I am just learning all of this myself, so if I have said something in the above monologue, please feel free to correct me.

Joe