Yeah, I bet it is that good. I just don't know how to do it.

I could probably figure it out with a lot of trial and error, or get a friend over that has perfect pitch to help, but I bet there is a formula.

I found this on Wikipedia:
the pitch ratio between any two successive notes of the scale is exactly the twelfth root of two (or about 1.05946)

Using that number and knowing what the scale the Vegas dialog uses, it seems like it should be a simple mathematical formula to raise or lower the key one chromatic note at a time until the desired key is achieved? Right?

Maybe I should post this question in the Acid forum.

Thanks,

Kirk

Changing the pitch is changing the key. They are identical. Half (chromatic) steps are just about 6% change, and full steps are just about 12%. The actual formual is the twelth root of 2 raised to the power of the number of chromatic steps.

Place the audio clip on the timeline, then hold down the Ctrl key while you stretch the end of the clip to the right to lower the pitch, or squish it to the left to raise it. Afterwards right-mouse-button on the clip to bring up the properties and check "lock to stretch".

Here's a table of percentage values:

+ octave: 200%
+ 6 steps: 188.8%
+ 5.5 steps: 178.2%
+ 5 steps: 168.2%
+ 4.5 steps: 158.7%
+4 steps: 149.8%
+3.5 steps: 141.4%
+3 steps: 133.5%
+2 steps: 126.0%
+1.5 steps: 118.9%
+1 step: 112.2%
+ 0.5 step: 105.9%
original: 100%
- 0.5 step: 94.4%
- 1 step: 89.1%
- 1.5 steps: 84.1%
- 2 steps: 79.4%
- 3 steps: 74.9%
- 3.5 steps: 70.7%
- 4 steps: 66.7%
- 4.5 steps: 63.0%
- 5 steps: 59.5%
- 5.5 steps: 56.1%
- 6 steps: 53.0%
- octave: 50%


I'll also add that if you have Vegas 7 (and maybe 6, i don't remember), you can use the + and - keys on an audio event to raise or lower the pitch (key) by half steps.

- and= key to lower and raise, and the SHIFT and - or = to lower or raise by 12.

Dave T2

OK, getting closer, but I still don't get it.

I didn't want to change the length of the song, only the pitch. I was trying to do it under properties / pitch shift. When I get there, pitch change is set to 0.00000

If I try the + or - key it goes up by 1.00000 or down by -1.00000 each time. I am not a musician, but that sure sounds like more than one whole step.

So, how can I get the percentages entered and keep the song length the same.

Kirk

Each number (1 or -1) is one step. An octave is 12 steps.

Use Chiens percentages and the - or = key to adjust.

Dave T2

I believe there is a checkbox in the plugin that will allow you to keep the same length...not sure what it is called, and could be thinking of time stretch in Cubase, as I use both, and can't check now, but pretty sure that it is in Vegas.
mm0

So a key change from say C# to A would be -4?

C# - C - B - A# - A
0 -1 -2 -3 -4

Where would you enter the percentages? Or would you figure the length of the song and calculate the new length based on the percentage to get the pitch that was needed?

Thanks,

Kirk

C# to A would be -2.5 steps. Way confusing, i know. A full step is usually 2 chromatic steps, except between mi-fa and ti-do, in which case those two full steps are only a single chromatic step.

Remember, length doesn't come into it - it's purely pitch you're changing, not length.

Pitch is changed at Event level, and you can select many or all events together then use the -/_ and =/+ keys to move down or up in semitones.

Yes, you are correct. starting at C#, -4 would take you down to A.

But - there is a limit to how far you can shift sounds, either voice or instruments, without making them sound "different" or somewhat artificial.

For fine tuning, Vegas can also pitch shift in cents (hundredths of a tone) by using Ctrl/- or +, but you need a good ear to use this accurately. It can flatter some singers by putting some awful notes back on key, assuming they were consistently out in the first place!

The pitch change was brought about in Vegas 5

Musically, and very pedantically speaking, raising or lowering the pitch as Vegas does it is not the same as changing key because of what is know as "Temper"; the subtle way the 12 key divisions are split within the octave. So while raising a tune in C by 2 steps or 126% will make the root C will become D, the charterer of the tune will still have a C character and not a key of D character. To compare key characters as a result of temper listen to JS Bach's "The Well Tempered Clavichord."

You Guys are immense !! - Wow!

MH_Stevens,

That does not, however, make changing keys a useless endeavor. ;)

I'll also be pedantic and point out that any musician for whom that matters, probably doesn't need to have the key changed!

I don't understand Temper, but remember reading in my one music theory class that the modern western key division is different than it was in Bach's time. Something about separating the keys mathematically so that every key signature sounds good on every instrument. Where the 3rds, 5ths, 7ths, etc would be tuned differently if you were playing in only the one key.

Did I remember that right?

I listened to the Well Tempered Clavichord on you tube and most were piano recordings. The clavichord does sound slightly different compared to the piano, and I don't mean the color of the sound, it seems that the notes sound ever so slightly out of tune compared to the piano, but not dissonant in a bad way.

Here is a guy playing the Clavichord:

and the piano:


Interesting.

Kirk

Kirk:
What you say is correct. There are many versions of temper and the modern concert temper is not the one used by Bach. For some recordings of the "Well Tempered Clavichord" the piano (which is used today most often) is retempered to Bach's version.

GLENN:
I did not mean to imply that using Vegas or ACID to change pitch is wrong - I do it all the time. I was just, as I said, being pedantic and adding interest.

"C# to A would be -2.5 steps. Way confusing, i know. A full step is usually 2 chromatic steps, except between mi-fa and ti-do, in which case those two full steps are only a single chromatic step."
____________________________________________________

The confusion here lies in the fact that you are mixing the MAJOR scale with the CHROMATIC scale. A full step (or whole tone) is ALWAYS equivalent to two (2) half steps (or half tones or semi-tones), no matter what the key or scale.

The CHROMATIC scale is comprised of twelve (12) semitones whereas the MAJOR scale is comprised of eight (8) notes from the ROOT to the OCTAVE of the Chromatic scale in the following divisions (or intervals); WHOLE STEP - WHOLE STEP - HALF STEP - WHOLE STEP - WHOLE STEP - WHOLE STEP - HALF STEP.

Since the percentage chart in the previous post leaves out step 2.5 in both the positive and negative direction it is inaccurate past steps +2 and -2.

Blues

P.S. mi-fa and ti-do are only references to the 3rd-4th and 7th-8th notes respectively of the Major scale.