Color Grading - HSL or HSV

gorGaram wrote on 9/2/2024, 3:14 AM

Wiki:
"the central vertical axis comprises the neutral, achromatic, or gray colors ranging, from top to bottom, white at lightness 1 (value 1) to black at lightness 0 (value 0)."
The current adjustment does not match the model HSL
It's more like HSV
I ask - we use the HSL or HSV model?
UPD: version 21 works in HSL correct.

Comments

alifftudm95 wrote on 9/2/2024, 9:56 AM

Are you referring to the Color Grading Panel in VEGAS Pro?

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gorGaram wrote on 9/2/2024, 10:25 AM

Are you referring to the Color Grading Panel in VEGAS Pro?

Yes.

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RogerS wrote on 9/2/2024, 6:12 PM

How did you come to this conclusion and can you share an example of it not working as expected?

Are you working in HDR?

gorGaram wrote on 9/3/2024, 1:16 AM

...

Are you working in HDR?

No.

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X

VideoCard: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16Gb

Memory: 128Gb

OS: Windows 10 (1809)

Drive C: (SSD-500Gb) - ONLY system

Drive D: (HDD 4Tb) - ProrgamFiles and Temp
Drive E: (HDD 4Tb) - Work drive

Vegas Pro: 20.411, 21.315, 22.122

gorGaram wrote on 9/3/2024, 1:18 AM

Vegas Pro 21.0.315:

Vegas Pro 22.0.93:

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X

VideoCard: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16Gb

Memory: 128Gb

OS: Windows 10 (1809)

Drive C: (SSD-500Gb) - ONLY system

Drive D: (HDD 4Tb) - ProrgamFiles and Temp
Drive E: (HDD 4Tb) - Work drive

Vegas Pro: 20.411, 21.315, 22.122

alifftudm95 wrote on 9/3/2024, 3:23 AM

Vegas Pro 21.0.315:

Vegas Pro 22.0.93:

Both result look similar? Am I missing something?

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Monitor: Asus ProArt PA279CV 4K HDR (Bought on 30 August 2023)

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gorGaram wrote on 9/3/2024, 3:54 AM

sample:

VP22:

VP21:

If someone doesn't care, they don't have to worry.

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X

VideoCard: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16Gb

Memory: 128Gb

OS: Windows 10 (1809)

Drive C: (SSD-500Gb) - ONLY system

Drive D: (HDD 4Tb) - ProrgamFiles and Temp
Drive E: (HDD 4Tb) - Work drive

Vegas Pro: 20.411, 21.315, 22.122

Wolfgang S. wrote on 9/3/2024, 5:40 AM

Luminance 2 results in an overexposure in both cases anyway. But it is also correct that 2 seems to result in VP21 in total clipping, but not in VP22.

But I wonder if it matters really?

Last changed by Wolfgang S. on 9/3/2024, 6:01 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

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HDR monitor: ProArt Monitor PA32 UCG-K 1600 nits, Atomos Sumo

Others: Edius NX (Canopus NX)-card in an old XP-System. Edius 4.6 and other systems

alifftudm95 wrote on 9/3/2024, 11:42 AM

sample:

VP22:

VP21:

If someone doesn't care, they don't have to worry.

Ok now I can see the problem. CGP in VEGAS is far from perfect in reproducing color.

Have u tried VEGAS HSL Adjust OFX Plugin instead see if it reproduce correctly?

Last changed by alifftudm95 on 9/3/2024, 11:42 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

Editor and Colorist (Kinda) from Malaysia

MYPOST Member

Laptop

MacBook Pro M4 Max

16 Core CPU and 40 Core GPU

64GB Memory

2TB Internal SSD Storage

Anti-Glare 4K HDR Screen

 

PC DEKSTOP

CPU: Ryzen 9 5900x

GPU: RTX3090 24GB

RAM: 64GB 3200MHZ

MOBO: X570-E

Storage:

C DRIVE NVME M.2 1TB SSD GEN 4

D DRIVE NVME M.2 2TB SSD GEN 4

E DRIVE SATA SSD 2TB

F DRIVE SATA SSD 2TB

G DRIVE HDD 1TB

Monitor: Asus ProArt PA279CV 4K HDR (Bought on 30 August 2023)

Monitor: BenQ PD2700U 4K HDR (RIP on 30 August 2023)

 

 

 

gorGaram wrote on 9/3/2024, 11:52 AM

Have u tried VEGAS HSL Adjust OFX Plugin instead see if it reproduce correctly?

Yes. It work like VP21
But the question is about the correctness of the work of colorgrading.

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X

VideoCard: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16Gb

Memory: 128Gb

OS: Windows 10 (1809)

Drive C: (SSD-500Gb) - ONLY system

Drive D: (HDD 4Tb) - ProrgamFiles and Temp
Drive E: (HDD 4Tb) - Work drive

Vegas Pro: 20.411, 21.315, 22.122

alifftudm95 wrote on 9/3/2024, 12:09 PM

Both are in VP22

 

CGP HSL Luminance result:

Saturated

OFX HSL Luminance result:

More white/Highlight

So its a bug then, hopefully can be fixed on next update release.

Editor and Colorist (Kinda) from Malaysia

MYPOST Member

Laptop

MacBook Pro M4 Max

16 Core CPU and 40 Core GPU

64GB Memory

2TB Internal SSD Storage

Anti-Glare 4K HDR Screen

 

PC DEKSTOP

CPU: Ryzen 9 5900x

GPU: RTX3090 24GB

RAM: 64GB 3200MHZ

MOBO: X570-E

Storage:

C DRIVE NVME M.2 1TB SSD GEN 4

D DRIVE NVME M.2 2TB SSD GEN 4

E DRIVE SATA SSD 2TB

F DRIVE SATA SSD 2TB

G DRIVE HDD 1TB

Monitor: Asus ProArt PA279CV 4K HDR (Bought on 30 August 2023)

Monitor: BenQ PD2700U 4K HDR (RIP on 30 August 2023)

 

 

 

gorGaram wrote on 9/3/2024, 12:13 PM

We'll see. Do the developers write here that this has been taken into work and will be fixed? If it's just a user forum, then they don't have to.

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X

VideoCard: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16Gb

Memory: 128Gb

OS: Windows 10 (1809)

Drive C: (SSD-500Gb) - ONLY system

Drive D: (HDD 4Tb) - ProrgamFiles and Temp
Drive E: (HDD 4Tb) - Work drive

Vegas Pro: 20.411, 21.315, 22.122

fr0sty wrote on 9/6/2024, 3:52 PM

The development team has been made aware of this bug and is working on it.

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fr0sty wrote on 9/6/2024, 6:55 PM

if you want a true Luminance adjustment in Color Grading, use the "Hue vs. Luminance" curve, and create a curve with a single point. Moving that point vertically will revise the Luminance values of all Hues in the image.

Systems:

Desktop

AMD Ryzen 7 1800x 8 core 16 thread at stock speed

64GB 3000mhz DDR4

Geforce RTX 3090

Windows 10

Laptop:

ASUS Zenbook Pro Duo 32GB (9980HK CPU, RTX 2060 GPU, dual 4K touch screens, main one OLED HDR)

gorGaram wrote on 9/7/2024, 1:59 AM

if you want a true Luminance adjustment in Color Grading, use the "Hue vs. Luminance" curve, and create a curve with a single point. Moving that point vertically will revise the Luminance values of all Hues in the image.

The question is not about that
and about the fact that the current settings are not working correctly

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X

VideoCard: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16Gb

Memory: 128Gb

OS: Windows 10 (1809)

Drive C: (SSD-500Gb) - ONLY system

Drive D: (HDD 4Tb) - ProrgamFiles and Temp
Drive E: (HDD 4Tb) - Work drive

Vegas Pro: 20.411, 21.315, 22.122

Wolfgang S. wrote on 9/7/2024, 2:31 AM

I still do not see that the current settings do not work correctly.

Desktop: PC AMD 3960X, 24x3,8 Mhz * RTX 3080 Ti (12 GB)* Blackmagic Extreme 4K 12G * QNAP Max8 10 Gb Lan * Resolve Studio 18 * Edius X* Blackmagic Pocket 6K/6K Pro, EVA1, FS7

Laptop: ProArt Studiobook 16 OLED * internal HDR preview * i9 12900H with i-GPU Iris XE * 32 GB Ram) * Geforce RTX 3070 TI 8GB * internal HDR preview on the laptop monitor * Blackmagic Ultrastudio 4K mini

HDR monitor: ProArt Monitor PA32 UCG-K 1600 nits, Atomos Sumo

Others: Edius NX (Canopus NX)-card in an old XP-System. Edius 4.6 and other systems

gorGaram wrote on 9/7/2024, 3:00 AM

This is a model HSL:

tell me what any color should be at maximum L?
 

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X

VideoCard: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16Gb

Memory: 128Gb

OS: Windows 10 (1809)

Drive C: (SSD-500Gb) - ONLY system

Drive D: (HDD 4Tb) - ProrgamFiles and Temp
Drive E: (HDD 4Tb) - Work drive

Vegas Pro: 20.411, 21.315, 22.122

Robert Johnston wrote on 9/7/2024, 3:08 AM

@Wolfgang S. Are not luminance values of -2 to +2 just gains, not the L value (0 to 1 scale), the OP may be confusing? It depends on what actual luminance value you start with, if it's high to start with, you'll blow it out very early with the slider.

Intel Core i7 10700K CPU @ 3.80GHz (to 4.65GHz), NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2060 SUPER 8GBytes. Memory 32 GBytes DDR4. Also Intel UHD Graphics 630. Mainboard: Dell Inc. PCI-Express 3.0 (8.0 GT/s) Comet Lake. Bench CPU Multi Thread: 5500.5 per CPU-Z.

Vegas Pro 21.0 (Build 108) with Mocha Vegas

Windows 11 not pro

gorGaram wrote on 9/7/2024, 3:14 AM

Just watch the video at the beginning of this topic. Do you see the difference?

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X

VideoCard: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16Gb

Memory: 128Gb

OS: Windows 10 (1809)

Drive C: (SSD-500Gb) - ONLY system

Drive D: (HDD 4Tb) - ProrgamFiles and Temp
Drive E: (HDD 4Tb) - Work drive

Vegas Pro: 20.411, 21.315, 22.122

gorGaram wrote on 9/7/2024, 3:18 AM

@Wolfgang S. Are not luminance values of -2 to +2 just gains, not the L value (0 to 1 scale), the OP may be confusing? It depends on what actual luminance value you start with, if it's high to start with, you'll blow it out very early with the slider.

Should I guess for myself what this 2 means?
According to the HSL color model, L cannot be greater than 1. What does this 2 mean?

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X

VideoCard: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16Gb

Memory: 128Gb

OS: Windows 10 (1809)

Drive C: (SSD-500Gb) - ONLY system

Drive D: (HDD 4Tb) - ProrgamFiles and Temp
Drive E: (HDD 4Tb) - Work drive

Vegas Pro: 20.411, 21.315, 22.122

Wolfgang S. wrote on 9/7/2024, 3:01 PM

I do not know either, what 2 means. Could be explored by using test-charts maybe.

Desktop: PC AMD 3960X, 24x3,8 Mhz * RTX 3080 Ti (12 GB)* Blackmagic Extreme 4K 12G * QNAP Max8 10 Gb Lan * Resolve Studio 18 * Edius X* Blackmagic Pocket 6K/6K Pro, EVA1, FS7

Laptop: ProArt Studiobook 16 OLED * internal HDR preview * i9 12900H with i-GPU Iris XE * 32 GB Ram) * Geforce RTX 3070 TI 8GB * internal HDR preview on the laptop monitor * Blackmagic Ultrastudio 4K mini

HDR monitor: ProArt Monitor PA32 UCG-K 1600 nits, Atomos Sumo

Others: Edius NX (Canopus NX)-card in an old XP-System. Edius 4.6 and other systems

Robert Johnston wrote on 9/7/2024, 5:42 PM

I can tell you what 1 means. It means no change. In the 2 direction means brighter, in the 0 direction means darker.

Intel Core i7 10700K CPU @ 3.80GHz (to 4.65GHz), NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2060 SUPER 8GBytes. Memory 32 GBytes DDR4. Also Intel UHD Graphics 630. Mainboard: Dell Inc. PCI-Express 3.0 (8.0 GT/s) Comet Lake. Bench CPU Multi Thread: 5500.5 per CPU-Z.

Vegas Pro 21.0 (Build 108) with Mocha Vegas

Windows 11 not pro

fr0sty wrote on 9/7/2024, 8:31 PM

I still do not see that the current settings do not work correctly.

Watch the video they posted... in VP21, when luminance is cranked to the max, the whole screen goes white. In 22, it does not. This was confirmed as a bug.

Systems:

Desktop

AMD Ryzen 7 1800x 8 core 16 thread at stock speed

64GB 3000mhz DDR4

Geforce RTX 3090

Windows 10

Laptop:

ASUS Zenbook Pro Duo 32GB (9980HK CPU, RTX 2060 GPU, dual 4K touch screens, main one OLED HDR)

fr0sty wrote on 9/7/2024, 8:33 PM

if you want a true Luminance adjustment in Color Grading, use the "Hue vs. Luminance" curve, and create a curve with a single point. Moving that point vertically will revise the Luminance values of all Hues in the image.

The question is not about that
and about the fact that the current settings are not working correctly

I'm aware of that, but the developer that confirmed to me this issue you point out is a bug mentioned that as a workaround until this could be fixed.

Systems:

Desktop

AMD Ryzen 7 1800x 8 core 16 thread at stock speed

64GB 3000mhz DDR4

Geforce RTX 3090

Windows 10

Laptop:

ASUS Zenbook Pro Duo 32GB (9980HK CPU, RTX 2060 GPU, dual 4K touch screens, main one OLED HDR)