Apologies I did not make myself clear, but appreciate the reply. I know about holding the control key, the figures were given as an example. Old cine films suffer from large colouration degrades which need compensation so lets talk small numbers, say I want to change 0.02 degrees from 359.99 to 0.01 degrees anticlockwise or 0.01 to 359.99 clockwise on one of the wheels between two scenes. Vegas pro sees this as going anticlockwise all the way from 0.01 to 359.99 in other words all frames between the two correction points see a fast change of 359.98 degrees!

I wasn't aware of the arrow keys thanks for the tip!

Very interesting find. I don't think the color corrector has been developed for many years and may not be in the future.

Can you try it in the color grading panel's 3 way color corrector and see if that works better for your usage?

Andreas, thanks for clarifying.

I can confirm that this bug does not occur in Vegas Pro 18, the transition from 359 to 1 is seamless. So it must have been introduced later.

If you will include the word [BUG] in the thread title, your report will get noticed by the right people.

@andreas-georgiou. No, no, You instead should be using the Color Grading Panel 3 way color corrector. This was a fairly new feature specifically designed for more advanced, accurate and professional approach to color grading and color correction.

I can see a reason to use this Fx is the ability to keyframe it which may be necessary if the degradation of the source material isn't constant (otherwise it's more challenging to do a bunch of overlapped CGP adjustment events).

Thank you all for the good suggestions, Roger S is correct, cine films 60+ year old suffer dye degradation which results in very frequent colour variations in addition to overall significant loss of white balance. I am in the process of having these digitised but the raw footage lucks contrast (histogram variations, some quite great variations) as there were no automatic light meter controls on clockwork operated little gem silent 8mm camcorders and the settings were hit and miss based on suggestions on the film box. Results were only available weeks after having to send the films out for processing, on receipt had to set up a projector to view them in a dark room etc. Those were the days unlike today we can shoot 4k@60fps on a smart phone with auto exposure colour correction and stabilisation done for us by the phone or other modern camera gear and not only view but also edit and share the results too nearly instantly. Goes to show my age hehe.

So back to the current discussion, the issue is a bug and i will try to report it as kindly Mark-Y suggested.

I have used white balance fx as a first pass which is doing a good job and not slowing the preview down-another benefit. this then leaves me with keyframe correcting exposure etc. with minimal use of colour corrections.

We have reproduced the problem. Yes...something definitely has changed. We will add this to our bug database. Thank you for reporting this problem.

Vegas Derek Great news thank you for looking into this, so efficiently, very impressed, tempted to upgrade!

@andreas-georgiou

cine films 60+ year old suffer dye degradation which results in very frequent colour variations in addition to overall significant loss of white balance. I am in the process of having these digitised but the raw footage lucks contrast (histogram variations, some quite great variations)

If you would like to post some of your tests in a new thread, I've recently been through just this for my brother's memorial videos.

I also have the unique advantage of having been trained as a QA field engineer at Technicolor about the time Kodachrome was being phased out.

If you like my work, I will be happy to share some pointers and start a discussion by PM. Some of the most common problems are tungsten and daylight film shot under the wrong lighting, and burned out re-exposure lamps on the old KII processors.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=174CQkkdnBBcCeBOAbM5TR0Muv6lSuApJ&usp=drive_fs

mark-y, great work! amazing clarity I could even say better than minidv footage.

Mine unfortunately are really bad, 1- the small bearing in the claw mechanism was worn resulting in vertical jitter (tried Topaz video AI which seems to cope wellish in stabilising but introduces loss of detail, video enhance sharpens some areas but introduces some other artifacts)

2-not sure what has caused a lot of light flashes and red edge overexposure on some frames (perhaps the door of the camcorder wasn't completely lightproof, or if memory serves me right we had to open the door and flip the reel?)

3-Average white balance constantly drifts around including exposure widely varying from scene to scene.

4- Digitising studio did a reasonable job but left a bluish overcast which is easy to correct.

I would be grateful for any advise/pointers, I could upload a couple of examples from best to worst, let me know how and where.

VEGASDerek, since the team are on to the colour corrector FX, two more bugs

1-When I size the bottom pane showing all the lines/Curves and carry on working as soon I select back or CTL+Z the pane resizes to the default size which is a pain having to resize every time, please correct. (ideally it should automatically resize to display all the enabled lines/curves when Animate is activated for each control)

2- When synch timeline to cursor is enabled, the timeline of the colour corrector FX correctly moves when the cursor is dragged etc. also correctly moves when frame forward/backward are pressed and correctly tracks when they are kept depressed. Fails to animate during playback so not able to see where the position is in relation to the image on the preview window. Only jumps when pause or stop are pressed.

I have a lot of space on Google Drive. If you send me your email in a PM, I'll create a folder for you.

The transition in quality from Kodachrome I to KII about 1961 is really noticeable when I looked at my reel again.

Mark-y Interesting observation!, I find it interesting that my old clockwork palm size camcorder with a turret of three fixed focal length lenses produced much better (when it worked) results on Regular 8mm film than the later Bolex 580 super 8mm zoom lens. But at least the auto exposure saved a lot of what would otherwise have been wasted expensive films.

The current generation of videographers and media generators have no idea how difficult it was those days. What does amaze me is how film manufacturers managed to keep such tight control on film sensitivity and quality. I presume that's where guys like you came in!

Our job was putting out brush fires. pH checks every two hours, densitometer control strips every four, and film jams that all the consumer got back was a free roll of film and a "sorry 'bout that" note. The chem mix and storage room was a really dangerous place.

andreas, I'll respond publicly so others may see my suggestion, which is to directly contact and read posts by @johnmeyer on the VideoHelp forum where he is still active, his older video restorations on his Youtube Channel and his posts in this Vegas forum.

I'll give the color a shot on your reels, but they don't look like Kodachrome, and the damage / jitters is above my pay scale. The strong blue / yellow bias is concerning.

John and I have known each other more than twenty years, he is a retired hp engineer, and he kind of wrote the book on these difficult restorations. Do include us in your discussions, it's still a fascinating subject.

Your reversal film is essentially lacking a Green chroma channel, not really enough to work with.

Topaz has already got AI bit depth upfilling working in their still image products, and I am quite excited about it. However, I think it will be some time before it shows up in their video products, the roadblock being enormous processing time.

Look what I'm already doing with some old Kodachrome I slides in Topaz Gigapixel, essentially breathing life into a deficient red chroma channel.

Thank you very much for the useful info and links. No need to worry about colour correcting the footage as I have painfully spend time with vegas colour corrector (hours). The white balance fx also automatically works well but very strange controls and as usually buggy, the dropper for picking say grey 1- must take such a small (a pixel size ?) sample on a noisy/grainy image very difficult to get an actual grey sample, I think they should have an option to define an area for the dropper to take average sample.

2-the controls are very strange should have option to use the same type of wheels and colour correction controls we are all familiar with (save them coding new functions too) rather than controls that don’t seem to do the job in white balancing the image!

Topaz video AI I find very good at stabilising full image without cropping unlike Vegas, even copes with the jittering! Unfortunately it results in the addition of slight blur ones to an already blurry video (one filter occasionally results in the faces becoming clear with teeth very sharply defined which look very odd in an otherwise blurry frame.

I find Topaz video AI does a reasonable job in de interlacing and cleaning my vhs, svhs, and DV videos and I might spend the money when I get to restoring those I think. Perhaps move to another threat in this forum

so my current challenge is to