End of DV file missing picture

tvdias wrote on 9/5/2002, 1:04 PM
Scenario:

Capture video in Premiere 6.0 using stop motion from S8 Workprinter-8
Slow frame rate by 60% from default 29.97 FPS to 18 FPS using Premiere 6.0
(Note: tried to do this in VV 3.0, but I get bad combing on any fast motion which is problem #1)

Render the 18 FPS version from Premiere 6.0 to DV format AVI

Import the above created file to VV 3.0

The last minute or two of the AVI file consist of black frames, rather than the image that is on the original. This is problem #2.

I tested the AVI file, importing it on several other editors and playing it on several other file players: The result: The image is present on every other editor and AVI file playback software EXCEPT VV 3.0.

Has anyone got any hints or does VV flat out have problems with this scenario?

Vern Dias

Comments

SonyEPM wrote on 9/5/2002, 3:35 PM
try setting options>prefs>use microsoft DV codec, to ON (checked). Still a problem?
tvdias wrote on 9/5/2002, 7:46 PM
Yes, still a problem.
SonyDennis wrote on 9/6/2002, 8:06 AM
Off-topic, but what's with the "bad combing" you're getting in VV? Are you sure it's not the expected and desired interlaced artifacts of interlaced video?
///d@
tvdias wrote on 9/6/2002, 8:43 AM
The "bad combing" occurs when I change the playback rate in the properties of a clip to something like 60%. As far as expecting this, I don't have the problem when I use Premiere to do the same thing, so it looks like the algorithms that VV uses for this function are not optimal. This combing only occurs during motion and it looks like a deinterlacing problem or a problem with not identifying or matching the fields properly when creating the interpolated frames.

Vern
SonyDennis wrote on 9/6/2002, 9:41 AM
Everyone else who's done it has claimed Vegas to be superior to the other methods. Make sure the media properties for your source video are set right (probably lower field first), turn on the resampling switch on the event, pick your prefered deinterlace method (project properties, advanced; I prefer interpolate) and render away. Vegas deinterlaces 60i to 60p, frame blends to your new field rate, and does field rendering on output. The only thing better are methods that use motion estimation, and they take longer and cost more.
///d@
tvdias wrote on 9/6/2002, 10:24 AM
OK, that's much better, I will use VV to resample from now on.

Thanks again for the great customer support.

Vern
tvdias wrote on 9/7/2002, 11:02 AM
I guess I spoke too soon.

The resampled clip is fine UNTIL I import it back into VV, then the combing shows up.

At this point, I'm not sure what to do, other than go back to doing my entire project in Premiere 6, which is a shame since I like the UI in VV better.

Vern
SonyDennis wrote on 9/9/2002, 12:24 PM
Interlaced video shows combing artifacts in still-frame mode or during playback on a progressive monitor. Are you sure you're not interpreting something normal as a bug?
///d@
tvdias wrote on 9/10/2002, 8:44 AM
Once more:

When I play the video in the VV editing session after frame rate modification is applied to the clip, it looks fine with no combing visible in the preview window.

When it is rendered out to an AVI and that AVI is imported into a new VV editing session, THEN the combing is present.

Vern Dias
SonyDennis wrote on 9/11/2002, 1:58 PM
Vern:

Set project properties to "NTSC DV". Set Video Preview quality to "Best" and right-click in the display and turn ON "Display at Project Size". Now, it the "combing" visible before you render? If so, it's supposed to be, it's interlaced video.

It sounds like you either don't have the media's "field order" property set right, or you're rendering to interlaced, and then setting it's media property to "progressive".

It's hard to imagine what you are seeing using only text. Please email a screenshot of the combing to drdropout@sonicfoundry.com and reference this thread. He'll forward it me and I'll take a look at it and tell you what I see.

///d@
tvdias wrote on 9/20/2002, 8:14 AM
OK, email sent. Please remember, before you tell me that what I am seeing is "Normal" that VV is the only product that I use that has this issue.

I can do the exact same thing with either Premier 6 or Studio 7 and not have these issues. So I get to choose between a great user interface and poor image quality and a poor user interface that renders a great quality image.

Also, I still want to know why this is happening in the first place that forces me to use the VV playback rate change, cause this is what started this thread, and there has been NO response to this, my original question:

Scenario:

Render the 18 FPS version from Premiere 6.0 to DV format AVI

Import the above created file to VV 3.0

The last minute or two of the AVI file consist of black frames, rather than the image that is on the original. This is problem #2.

I tested the AVI file, importing it on several other editors and playing it on several other file players: The result: The image is present on every other editor and AVI file playback software EXCEPT VV 3.0.

Has anyone got any hints or does VV flat out have problems with this scenario?

Thanks for any and all help.