Hi Craftech,

Since I will carry all the equipment, they must be small and not heavy as possible.

A friend of mine uses a Sennheiser MKH-416 Super-Cardioid Short Shotgun Condenser Interference Tube Microphone. He likes it a lot. I'd like to know how better (if it really...) is this Sennheiser model compared to cheaper mics such as Audio-Technica AT4071A.

The question about using batery or not is not an issue since I will use a portable mixer with phanton power. But in this case, I'm also in doublt. When I compare prices, I realize that portable mixers with 2 or 3 channels are extremely cheaper than the ones with 4 (or more) channels even if they are made by the same manufacters.

For the field recorder I plan to pay under $ 1,400. Do you think Fostex FR-2 - 2 CHANNEL Compact Flash, for example, is a good option?

Mini-discs recorders are often cheaper than DATs, but DATs usually sound better. I've seen the Sony PCM-M1 Portable DAT Walkman Field Recorder.

Do you recommend any others?

Thanks,

Lawrence S

The MKH-416 is very nice, but nearly as expensive as a Sanken CS-3e which sounds a little bit better and avoids problems with off-axis sound coloration.

AT4073a is about $500 and is perhaps the best shotgun under $1K (although I have seen MKH-416s go on eBay for $1K).

SoundDevices makes great location mixers, the 302 is tops...

The Fostex FR-2 is REAL nice for recording, but a bit pricey at $1300+...

Marantz PMD670 is about $700 and works very well also, although I found its micpres too noisy for my taste (although better than any consumer gear), and it's not as sturdy as the FR-2. Still worth the money.

If you want a wonderful mixer/recorder, look at SoundDevices 722 or 744T. Not cheap but really really wonderful.

DATs are nice, but a pain to have to capture in realtime afterwards. Also not much left that is still manufactured...

The little Sony DAT I think has lots of transport problems and I've heard some really horrid audio from it, might have something to do with how it was used though. For a really small recorder think PowerCore.
If you've got a 2 channel recorder like the PowerCore or FR-2 why do you want a mixer? The FR-2 will supply phantom power for your mics and it's got record level controls etc. One less thing to buy and carry.
Bob.

Hi Bob,

I noticed that the FR-2 uses an uncompressed, BWF File Format. How can I import BWF file format into my PC and work in Vegas without using the analog output of the FR-2? Does Vegas recognize the BWF File Format?

Thanks,

Lawrence S

I'm assuming you already own Vegas since you're posting here. If size and portability is a major factor then consider this option.

Purchase a Laptop and use Vegas as your recorder and mixer. Then you can connect a USB pre-amp to the laptop, which will be able to provide phantom power to the mics. I recommend the the "USBpre" by Sound Devices. www.sounddevices.com. It is a small 24bit preamp, which has dual mic/line inputs. It is powered by your USB port, so you don't need any other power except plugging it into your laptop USB's port and plugging your laptop into an AC outlet, or running it off of the laptops battery if an outlet is not available. So it's very versatil and everything can easily fit into a laptop carrying case. Vegas can also allow you monitor what you are recording through input monitoring options, or the USBpre also has a headphone jack you can plug headphones into. M-audio also makes some lesser inexpensive USB pre amps, but I haven't used them and am unsure of their quality and how well they work with Vegas.

As far as mic recommendations, condenser mics, especially ones with tubes are not ideal for field recording. Yes, you will get good quality sound with this mic, but you also risk seriously damaging the mic, because condenser mics are not particuallarly rugged and should be mounted in a stationary position to avoid damage and should not be subject to severe climate changes. Drop this mic once and you can consider it a good option for the trash can or an expensive paper weight. A better choice for onsite field recording is a high quality dynamic microphone. Dynamic microphones are much more rugged than condenser mics, and do not require phantom power either. The Shure Beta 58 or SM58 are good choices, but you mention a shotgun mic, and sorry I don't have a suggestion for that, but would still recommend a dynamic one if available.

Here's a brand new portable hard disc recorder with lots of features. A bit pricey, but worth a look:
Edirol R-4

I don't think Vegas can handle the BWF format directly. All BWF is though is muxed .WAV. There's a freeware utility around that'll convert easily enough. Possibly as the BWF from the FR-2 is only stereo then Vegas will handle it just fine, it's the more than 2 channel BWF files that trip up Vegas. This is pretty silly as BWF is the standard format for multichannel film and video audio, maybe next release.
Bob.

Very very subjective topic...

My choice would be:

-Portable mixer: Sound Devices 302 (you double that you got 6 ins 4 outs and it's lighter and cheaper than one 442)
-Shotgun mic : Neumann 81i (or: Sennheiser MKH 60 as an alternative)
-Portable recorder : oh boy, many options here but I'd try the 744 by Sound Devices since what I tried from this company so far is... simply terrific! (302 and 442 mixers are killers for the price)" I know HHB makes a "pro" MiniDisc recorder. I used rented Fostex PD4 for these last years but if I'd buy, I'd go with SoundDevices. 4 tracks, a LOT lighter and cheaper.
-Phones: I love my Sony's MDR 7506 (even more subjective than the whole rest...some swear by Beyer's, some by Sennheiser's, etc)

On a budget, my priority would go with the mic first (it will last for life) and mixer (because: the preamps). And I'd get Neumann 81i/SoundDevices302 combo for sure. Rock steady and good price.

IF by "long distance recording" you mean that your subject will be far from the cam, get a wireless diversity mic kit. Or a very long cable so you can try to hide (if possible) your mic the closer you can to the subject(s). Depends of your framing...
The wireless will save your butt if you do a lot of very wide shots.

Oooh thanks RednRoll the USBpre is what I've been looking to get for my laptop!

I would get a short shotgun. Either the AKG CK8 or CK98 and use it no more than a foot from the subject's mouth.
Assuming you realize that "synch" is a problem using a double system for recording audio for video I would recommend either the Tascam portable DAT, the Maranz portable MD recorder, or the Maranz portable CD recorder.
What kind of a camera are you using? Perhaps a modification would be worthwhile to resolve synch issues and allow high quality audio recording in the camera.
I would recommend the Marenius MM-3100 portable mono field mixer, or the Marenius MM-4210 portable stereo field mixer. They are incredibly good and reasonably priced compared to a Shure FP-33.

John

"Oooh thanks RednRoll the USBpre is what I've been looking to get for my laptop!"

Or get an M-Audio FW410 for a lot less. I paid $350 (I think retail is $499).
It uses Firewire instead of USB, which is good because there is far less latency. The FW410 also has monitoring of the recorded signal so you really really know what got stored on your laptop.

I'm a big fan of SoundDevices, but the specs for the USBpre indicate that it may suck up to 0.5A from the USB port, I don't think that just any laptop can supply that.

"Shotgun mic for long distance recording."

I think you should know that shotguns don't work the way many think over a distance. Their benefit is side rejection, and they take quite a bit of skill to use.

If you're spending real money, get a Sanken CS-3e. It has unique benefits, primarily no coloration of sound over a 40-45 deg. microphone angle, and a much better rejection of low frequencies from the side. It can pick up good audio when other mikes can't. The secret is using three elements instead of one element with interference tubes. Oh, it also sounds flat out wonderful.

For long distance recording of bird song, a parabolic microphone is appropriate. This type is very directional at higher frequencies, but it doesn't work all that well for human voice.

For long distance recording of voice, the right tool is a hyperbolic horn microphone. This somewhat resembles the horn on early non-amplified "gramophones", and you probably have to build it yourself (fortunately this is easy). It has good gain in the human voice range.

Zaxcom's Digital wireless mic system costs nearly $4,000 but offers the next best sound quality after a $50 XLR cable. Everything else is a compromise.
:O)

Yip,
the 410 rocks. Last week I had to shoot a guy playing an electric piano and singing. 410 handled both the recording of mic and instrument inputs as well as providing local mix for his foldback.
I was going to buy a mixer to go with th 410 until I realised the 410 had everything I needed in it.
I recorded at 24/48 which even the old 900MHz P3 laptop handled, well once I killed off al the uStuff junk running in the background.
For monitoring you also get 2 sets of cans outputs, what more could you ask for.
Oh and the box can be powered from a 6 pin f/wire socket or if you've only got a laptop it comes with a universal (110-240V) adaptor) However it wouldn't take much time to throw together an adaptor to run it off say a small motorcylce battery for full portability.
Now I'll admit it probably doesn't have the same sound as a boutique mic pre but compared to what's in say a PD170 it's so far ahead you'll wonder why you stuck with camera audio.

As for sync, well I just got the perfomer to clap at the start and end of each number.
Bob.

I too, would highly recommend Firewire over USB any day. Power, latency, monitoring....Firewire is easier, and has it's own resource so it's not a shifting target like USB is.

I know there are a lot of better firewire options, but what interests me about the USBpre is that it doesn't seem on paper at least to try to function as an external sound card.

My hesitation with using a firewire box on my laptop is that I only want to use it strictly for recording now and then, otherwise I want to switch back to onboard sound/speakers. I haven't tried this yet, but I don't want it to be a headache to switch back and forth disabling one system to use the other.

BTW Spot, despite some other cards I was considering for one of my computers, I took your advice (on another thread) and ordered the Echo 3G. Was a nice price and just the features I needed, have yet to install.

Echo will be releasing there own firewire box any day now, that should be interesting too.

So RednRoll, have you had any unfavorable results from your USBpre?

To complement:

http://www.parabs.com/be2.htm

.. .parabolic thingys used mostly in sports and wildlife. Never tried but like said up here, it surely only records in mid-highs and highs. To be used with a lavallier omni mic mounted.

There's many options .
On a field job, for example, I would never rely on a computer to record. I'd get a recorder. Sturdy, compact and built for it. but it's all a question of budget and what you plan to do with the equipment (in fact, what do you plan to do? record animals?humans? fiction? documentary? news? bands in arenas? soaps? Will you always have access to AC or will you be in the middle of nowhere with batteries?)

"So RednRoll, have you had any unfavorable results from your USBpre?"

It's worked like a charm. Of course firewire is faster, but the USBpre is USB2.0 compatible, and for 2 channels of audio this is plenty fast. I wasn't aware that a Firewire connection also contained a power source for a device also, but then again my laptop doesn't have a firewire port on it, and I know ALL laptops have USB ports on them, so this is also another consideration for a firewire setup. The USBpre is power hungry for the USB power, so if you are planning on running other USB devices on the same USB port as the USBpre then this most likely won't work, especially if you're using the USBpre's phantom power. It's very easy to switch between using the USBpre and my onboard soundcard using Vegas, as they're both available within Vegas so switching between 2 monitoring systems is easy and having 2 sound devices installed are not a problem.

The USBpre is almost perfect for my setup, but there are a couple improvements I wish it had.

1. ASIO/Wave driver limitation. The USBpre forces you to install either the ASIO driver or the Wave driver, you currently can't install both on your system and use the host app to switch between which one you would like to use.
2. Balanced outputs. The USBpre has balanced inputs, but has unbalanced outputs, I wish it had a set of Balanced outputs, because sometimes I run signals from Sound Forge out to another device with Balanced inputs but this is perfect for sending the outs to an external amp with unbalanced inputs for a monitoring setup. Also it does have s/pdif I/O so this opens other options.

3. Option of connecting external power source. The USBpre powers itself from the USBpre power, but as I mentioned before it uses all of the power, and sometimes I connect an external keyboard to the same USB port and this will disable the device because not enough power is supplied to the USBpre. This is easily worked around by using either a USB hub or having 2 USB ports available on the laptop.

Other than that the USBpre is perfect, no latency issues and great A/D converters and very durable with easy portability.

You can soleve the power issue with a USB hub, many of them let you feed power in from a wall wart or uou could easily come up with a way to run it off battery.

I'll admit I've had a really nasty isssue with the 410 and Windoz audio. Windows doesn't seem to understand having two audio devices very well so whne I first installed the 410 drivers etc on the laptop and tested it all worked really great, 24/48 off my NT1A sounded beautiful.

Packed up my kit and went off to to recording, result was distoted and useless garbage. Big embarrasement, ended up recording straight to PD 150 (YUCK).
Anyways when I got back home, same problem. I resolved the issue by disabling the SoundMax device in Control Panel. Next on site recording job, same garbage recordings, and guess what, SoundMax is turned back on. At least this time I knew how to fix it.

Bob.

Looking for a compact mp3 player to give as a christmas gift, I ran into this product that maybe could be used for field recording.
Any of you guys have feedback about this one? There's a 1/8" line in jack with the adaptor. this ain't XLR but maybe could be usefull / good alternative to MiniDisc for some of us anyway, no?

http://eng.cowon.com/product/iAUDIOM3/about.html

In this class. the iRiver recorder/players seem to be the best. They can record to high bitrate MP3 or even to WAV, and seem to have acceptable preamps.