help with 16mm film

barneybenbarker wrote on 11/1/2007, 12:16 AM

hi. finished cutting a 16mm film offline using dv timecoded reference media in vegas. Now I need to rent a beta deck, and storage to do an "online session" to conform my vegas veg file to the digi beta sorce masters, and spit out clean digi beta master for delivery.

First of all is this going to be possible using vegas 8??

AJA Xena card works with vegas.

Q: which video template in project properties should i use for digi beta?

Then this next part is something I just can't get my head around the process of... " getting the Master Digi Beta Clips into vegas. By using time code from my reference material in the Vegas Timeline"....

Q: How... what is the process for capturing just the events used in my project? Would I use the info in the "Edit Details" window and capture manually the in's and out's (clip by clip, tape by tape" or is there a way to automate the capture. In other words " How do I get my Source digi beta into vegas"

Q: then once i've captured all the targeted digi-beta source material. would I just open my veg. project file? - and all the new digi beta source material will open into the vegas time line??? ... along with and including any transitions, and sound effects???? ... Is this Correct???

Cause that would be great....! i hoping

This would be my first time attempting to do this, so i'm alittle above my station here, but if it's possible to get a clean digi-beta cut using vegas. then I'll be using vegas for a long while.

thank you for any input

all the best

bbb

Comments

farss wrote on 11/1/2007, 3:05 AM

1) Are you certain they AJA cards now work with V8?
Really good news if they do but so far I haven't read any confirmation that they're working.

2) What you're really trying ot achieve is doing an "online" with Vegas. I'm far from certain if this is achievable. You can get an EDL out of Vegas and do an online elsewhere or use 3rd part products to get better cross platform transfer of your project.

3) Assuming the Xena card is working and getting you a 10bit file I think you might have had an easier time of it if you'd just captured your DB masters into Vegas. From them you can create DV proxies and edit them and them easily swap the files and presto, 10bit on the T/L. This is much the same as how Gearshift works with HDV. Thing is though these days you don't need anything out of the ordinary to edit 10bit on the Vegas T/L anyway so you can avoid the whole offline/online dance.

4) All is not lost though, you should still be able to get there but I suspect it's going to be more work than you'd have liked. Worst case you can manually capture the parts of the DB footage you need and manually line them up on the T/L by eyeballing the TC, just drop the TC FX onto the media in the Project Media to get it displayed on the T/L. Realistically you might find it easier to just capture all the DB tapes, workout the offsets and replace the media.
As far as I know the core problem to some extent is Vegas uses time into file not T/C from the tape to define the media in the project.
So if you can capture the DB tapes so the file starts at the exact same frame as the DV proxy file when you replace the media all will line up 100%. You'll need enough disk space though but that's pretty cheap these days. So there's a way to get there.

Hopefully I'm completely wrong and someone else will chime in with a better solution for you.

Bob.

barneybenbarker wrote on 11/1/2007, 3:48 AM

""Assuming the Xena card is working and getting you a 10bit file I think you might have had an easier time of it if you'd just captured your DB masters into Vegas. From them you can create DV proxies and edit them and them easily swap the files and presto""

is this possible? how would I create "dv Proxies" and then "swap the files after editing ""
Because that sounds like it would work. and would be great when starting on a new project . I just don't know how to do those two things? I would really like to know how to do that.

at this point with this show i guess i could log the in's and out 's by hand creating a physical list then manually capture the db masters with the sdi card. Will that work??

And so say that is done and those clips are now all on my drives. Will my vegas veg. project file be able to open them in the time line ??

there must be a way to this. I'm sure there is answer out there - to do a "Digi beta work flow '" sorta speak, using sony vegas 8.

all the best

bbb

farss wrote on 11/1/2007, 6:30 AM

1) Capture DB tapes, drop into Vegas project and render as DV into a different folder. You now have DV proxies. If you've got oodles of tapes get Peachrocks Veggie Toolkit. It'll batch the whole thing for you.

2) Edit DV proxies. When done you can one of two things;
2a) Swap the folder names between the one with the DV proxies and the one with the DB masters.
2b) In Project Media R-Click each media file in turn and select Replace. Replace with DB master files.

3) If you capture the DB tapes to new files with your project in the current state yes Vegas will open them but you want them to match what's on the timeline without having to pretty much rebuild your project. Here's the problem, I've left off the frames part of the TC to save me some typing:

Say you have a tape with 5:00 of video and the TC runs from 0:00 to 5:00. You capture from 1:00 to 5:00 and drop that onto the timeline at 0:00 and trim it so it's only 1:00 long.
So what's in your project is from the original tape from 1:00 to 2:00 except Vegas in it's project stores this as inpoint 0:00 out 1:00 because Vegas doesn't care about time code in the media, it uses time into the file.
So now you look at your edit list and capture from the same tape from 0:00 to 1:00 and it is not the same piece of video as you have on your timeline. You've not even captured the part of the tape that's on the timeline!

All is not lost but it's a little more work. What you need to do is get the exact same file into a different folder. The Vidcap file contains the in and out points of what you captured originally except as far as I know there's no way to directly use that to capture over SDI. Or as often happens, you loose that file.

So here's a workaround.

1) you need to find out the first frame TC of each file in your project.
2) Then you capture from your DB tapes from exactly the same TC into a different folder. Keeping the same file names like Tape001 etc would help avoid confusion.
3) Now using the methods I outlines above you swap the media files in your project..

That's it, everything is intact, your FXs etc, the whole deal. It's a bit of work but it will work. There might be easier ways but this is the best one I can come up with that I'm 99.99% certain will work.

Bob.

barneybenbarker wrote on 11/1/2007, 8:27 PM

Hey farss,

thank you for your input. It was very helpful. I can now see my way a little more clearly.

I appreciate it..

all the best

bbb