Hey Marketing!

Riktar wrote on 2/15/2002, 10:26 AM
I want a familar interface! This is by know means a rip on Vegas but if they are going to try and grab customers away from Ulead and Premiere they would be well served to mirror the interface.

I have been using MSPro fro a few years now and trying to break into Vegas Video can be like trying something with your left hand that your right hand has been doing for years!

Specifically the motion paths. MSPro is VERY easy to figure out once you dive into it. I can't say the same for Vegas.

The output from Vegas is so good it just kills me that I have to go into MSPro to make a motion path, render the footage out uncompressed, and then import it into Vegas Video for the final render.

I wish Sonic Foundry would sell the very nice codec they developed as a standalone product. I would be more than willing to pony up the bucks to rid myself of the MS (YUCK) DV Codec.

I have not given up on trying to learn this software. Maybe time and trying will show that I come to prefer the interface of Vegas Video 3 but my initial reaction is,,,, "Hey I have been speaking english for my whole life, why should I learn how to speak another language just to get my point across?"

And from a marketing standpoint that is someting to consider!

Comments

edna6284 wrote on 2/15/2002, 10:58 AM
Stop yer griping. SF can't just emulate UI any way they wish. Macromedia got sued by Adobe for that.

And besides, if they did that they'd be saying, "We're trying to be like [company x] because what they've come up with is better."

SF has a user-friendly interface. One of the simplest on the market. If you can't figure it out, what does that say?

bcbarnes wrote on 2/15/2002, 11:06 AM
One of the biggest compliments I hear about VV3 is how much nicer the interface is. I applaud SF for taking a different path, and not just building a "me too" UI.
Riktar wrote on 2/15/2002, 11:42 AM
It says that things are different and unfamiliar to me. And SF CAN emulate aspects of it without being sued. Premiere and MediaStudio share alot of similarities. I don't recall hearing about pending court cases between those 2.

Ford, Chevy, and the rest share a familar interface in their autos. Or, better yet, try driving a right handed english auto. Let's see how clunky you look shifting that.

I don't think Sonic Foundry is in any danger of being labeled a copycat. The quality of the output using their DV Codec speaks for itself.

It never ceases to amaze me how some people will read a message, focus solely on what they disagree with, and completely ignore the remainder or the post. Or the overall theme.

The interface comment was A SUGGESTION! Not a COMPLAINT. If Sonic Foundry agrees fine. If they don't, fine. It's their product, not mine. But since I am the one who shelled out the money for it I will continue to post my suggestions.

Before you bring out your pitchfork and torch to attack my comment you should consider reading the WHOLE post. If you can't understand it, what does that say about you?

And why would you assume I can't figure it out?
Riktar wrote on 2/15/2002, 11:47 AM
To each their own. I am sure that someone who has never used NLE software prior to trying Vegas Video would quite possibly find it intuitive.

I would just prefer not having to unlearn what has become comfortable for me. That's all.

The biggest compliment (That I am in total agreement with) is the quality of the final product based on their better than great DV codec.

That is why (As I stated) I am still working with the software.
wvg wrote on 2/15/2002, 12:26 PM
Oh no... another pointless rant. Personally I think Vegas has one of the slickest groups of tools and features of any video editor regardless of cost. I dare say others will try to copy some of what SoFo has come up with in easy of use. By contrast in my never humble opinion Ulead's offering and Premiere have clumsy unfriendly interfaces not very well thought out, leaving the user to guss what does what. Vegas is much more intutive. Vegas is one of those rare applications when you can sit down and use it right away without much thinking while at the same time learn more advanced features, frequently just by experimenting. You're complaining it isn't as clumsy as Premiere? Geez... that's amusing.

As far as learning something new, what's the problem? I use at least a dozen top drawer applications, Photoshop, Flash, Poser, etc.. Each has a different interface and I have absolutely zero problem using them. I dare say I'm "expert" at each as well as others. Practice makes perfect. LOL!

No, I'm not attacking you. Just amused at your comments. Maybe you should look for a DOS based video editor. Lots of luck.
Riktar wrote on 2/15/2002, 1:52 PM
Jeez you people are unbelieveable! Everyone is treating this as a cut on Vegas. Read the whole post! Get out a frigging dictionary and TRY to understand the difference between suggestion and complaint!

And in terms of "never humble opinions" what do you find so clumsy about MSPro? I have no problems going into the software and doing ANYTHING I wish to my clips. It must be a matter of perspective.

If I could find a better DV CODEC than the one that Microsoft (Pure garbage) puts out I probably would be content with what I am using.

Since Vegas looked interesting enough I thought I would give it a go. And while I am very satisfied with the output of my projects, the interface is something that I am wishing was a little more familiar. I am going to continue to try and work on the ins and out of the program.

I never realized that posting a suggestion that causes disagreement with a group could result in such flurry of immature and useless replies.

May you all find better comments to any postings you make in the future that goes against the norm.
tserface wrote on 2/15/2002, 2:03 PM
I tried ULead and Adobe and a few others and I settled on Vegas because of the interface. It is definitely different than the others, but I think that is a major advantage. I was inclined to go with ULead since I am a fan of some of their other software, but the multi module approach just didn't do it for me. The rendering times were a real drag as well and I love how Vegas can show you the preview before it is actually rendered.

If I were you I'd just read through the manual and learn the interface differences and switch over. You sound like you've been doing this for a while so it shouldn't be all that difficult to switch. You do have the right to suggest changes to SF (lots of people do here), but, frankly, if they change the interface to work like ULead's, I'd complain. I'd complain even more if it worked like Premier, but that's a whole different story.

:)

Tom
bcbarnes wrote on 2/15/2002, 2:06 PM
Riktar - I read the whole post, and I stick by my comment. Yes, you are right, motor cars have a common user interface. The interface that has been developed over how many years? NLE systems are new, and folks that implement them and use them are still trying to figure out what the best interface is. The first one you use isn't necessarily the best - it's just familiar. The "interface" that is used by linear editing folks is well known and tested - but I don't think we want that as an interface analogy for our NLE software.

I'm not attacking you or attempting to tell you that you are in any way wrong. You are entitled to your opinions. All I'm doing is trying to insure that the SF marketing folks hear both sides of the story - yours and mine.
wvg wrote on 2/15/2002, 2:13 PM
Maybe you should take a chill pill. I read every word you said. Twice. Because the first time I didn't believe anyone would get so worked up over something so minor. Your complaint is you are having trouble using the interface and you think it would be easier for you if it was more like Premiere. That's the heart of your "complaint".

Be honest, you are complaining, not making a suggestion. I could very easily turn around your words and ask you what YOU find so hard about using Vegas Video. I don't know if there is a full moon or what, but this past week or so it seems the forums are having a lot of garbage posts with people ranting about what they don't like and trying to tell SoFo how to run the company.

My beef is THAT IS OUT OF ORDER and beyond the scope of the forums which are meant for peer to peer discussion ON HOW TO USE THE APPLICATION. Calm down, spent a couple minutes searching this site and you'll find a web based form for making suggestions on what features you would like and I'm sure if you have tips on how SoFo can be more profitable, they will read that too. The point is the forums aren't the place for every Tom, Dick and Harry to bitch about his hang-ups, pet peeves and minor annoyances. Get it? I don't think so, but I wish you and others would. My point is the noise level in the forums is getting way too high and that does diminish the usefuless of the forums.

What really gets my dander up is you have an option to use a trial version of Vegas Video for a full 30 day period. You have plenty of time to decide if or not you like the interface. If you don't, then PLEASE try another application. Trying to get SoFo to change the inteface to meet your idea of what works will surely result in others complaining they did like what SoFo did and how dare they change things to please you.
jbl wrote on 2/15/2002, 2:22 PM
Isn't it a matter of "horses for courses"?
There is no such thing as perfection for all.
For me the trade of of ease-of-use & intuitiveness against industry norm (i.e. VV to Premiere) is no contest: SF has it every time.
My particular interest is audio with video; and, as a long-time user of SForge the switch to VV was logical and painless. I did persevere with Prem and it (together with a mountain of other stuff including a Pinnacle DV500) is sitting unused in a cupboard.

For me it's hats-off to SF and their non-conformist approach without being too idiosyncratic!
If you like the product and want to improve the original concept then buy and participate. But if you want to change the fundamental product and the underlying philosophy it is not for you then look elswhere.

BTW. I imagine that other respondants too have reacted to the tone as much as the content of the mails. Visiting the forum for me is to see if there are any points that can assist me or if I can help anyone else. Not to dis' others (including MS!). We all have things to learn - don't we?
jcrain wrote on 2/15/2002, 4:23 PM
dont listen to wvg. apparently he thinks he works for SF and takes any suggestions or comments to heart. a legend in his own mind.

several words come to mind for wvg. none of which i can post here
wvg wrote on 2/15/2002, 4:57 PM
Complain if you must, but complain outside of the forum. What part of that don't you understand? This forum isn't designed to give marketing suggestions to SoFo. To begin with I didn't seem them ask for any, did anyone?

This forum isn't to make suggestions for improvements to Vegas Video either. There is a web based suggestion form to cover that. Nor does anyone care if YOU don't like the interface. If you have trouble doing something in VV then ask. Lot of people will try to help you. If you have a way to do something smarter, simpler, better using VV, then tell us. Otherwise you're out of order no matter how much you think otherwise.
RichR wrote on 2/15/2002, 6:09 PM
I use Vegas, Speed Razor, and Video Toaster. All 3 have different interfaces, and Vegas to me was the most intuitive. I like it. Give it some more time and I think you will too.
Riktar wrote on 2/15/2002, 7:33 PM
To tserface, bcbarnes, jcrain, jbl, GG, and RichR,

Thanks for the words of encouragement. I am trying in my spare time to learn the ins and outs of this software. After using MSPro for 2 years it is a bit awkward. I do realize, and have noted in other posts on different forums that it would be interesting to see how fast someone who was completely new to NLE would take to the different interfaces that the NLE packages offer.

The fact that Sonic Foundry is following the same interface styling of its audio products makes perfect sense and since I have never used it, it never occured to me that they would follow (obviously) the same tact so as not to confuse their existing base of customers.

While I have done some of my recent projects with Vegas (Quite well as a matter of fact) I was running into some frustation in areas not normally associated with basic cuts, fades and transitions. The challenge of doing moving overlays and 2/3D Paths across multiple clips is what is giving me the most grief.

Speaking of the timeline, The way clips are placed and the fact that crossfades are automatic (Unless I choose otherwise) is a feature that has grown on me. Anyway,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

My printer just finished spitting out the 368th or so, and final (Whew) page of the manual. While it is probably going to take me the rest of my spare time this weekend to bind it all together I am going to dig in next week. Should provide for some alternate reading material when I am, uh, that is to say, "sitting" by myself.

Thanks again to all for the encouragement.

Riktar
pwppch wrote on 2/15/2002, 10:52 PM
wvg:

Lighten up man! These forums are for what ever the users want them to be for.

Complaints, rants, suggestions, comments, tips - even self promotion. As long as we don't find it offensive or down right rude, live and let live man.

Peter