Large, complex projects using Video Factory

billwsw wrote on 1/6/2003, 1:08 PM
I need to assimilate ~20 minutes of digital video from 25 different soccer games into one final ~60 video. This will represent an entire season of soccer for a High School team on one final deliverable (format TBD). My challenge is taking the ~20 per game of raw video, editing it down to 2-3 minutes of "highlights" per game, and then assembling these "highlights" into the final product at the end of the season. What is the most efficient way to manage this amount of data and store it using Video Factory? In the interest of conserving disk space, I need to edit down the ~20 minutes each game into the 2-3 minutes of "highlights." Do I do this in the media pool (using preview), and/or on the timeline using cuts and other editing? How can I discard (erase from my hard drive) the 17-18 minutes of video that does not represent the "highlights?" Any suggestions and/or tips on efficiently working on a project of this size would be appreciated. Any suggestions regarding the best format to save the final deliverable would also be appreciated. What about taking the final ~60 minute project and converting it to VHS format video..............any suggestions here?

Thanks, BillW

Comments

IanG wrote on 1/6/2003, 1:53 PM
Bill, as the unofficial video diarist of my son's football team, you have my sympathy! I'm not sure what the best answer is though. I suppose you could produce your 2-3 minute highlight, render it as an avi, discard the original footage and then repeat the process. Eventualy you edit the 25 clips together. Problem is, you might want to produce a few minutes of the best goals, best saves, worst misses (if no one's nose is going to get put out of joint). What about shots of the spectators, officials etc.? The chronology's going to get very confused! I think the best approach might be to work out a story board, paying particular attention to making sure all the players get some screen time, and then start the tedious process of reviewing all those stored tapes. I'd normaly recommend using Scenalyzer's tape index feature, but it's very difficult to tell one scene from another, especialy when the "good bits" might be just a second or two long. I think you'll have to make a lot of notes!

As for the format, you can't please everyone all the time! I'd be inclined to get as many on VCD as possible (cheap and quick), but you'll still have people who need CD-RW and others who don't have a DVD player at all. The good news is that people will usualy be very grateful for whatever you can give them!

Good luck with whatever you decide on!

Ian G.
ralphied wrote on 1/6/2003, 9:24 PM
Bill,

I just completed a "highlights" video of my son's high school football season. I made it specifically for me. If you try to create a special version for every other player on the team, you'll go nuts trying to keep track of everything. You could, however, limit your work to producing two highlights -- one for just you, and another encompassing all the big plays regardless of who made them. This approach is very doable.

You first need to have a goal in mind before doing any editing. In other words, are you going to save just you child's big plays, all big plays, etc.? I will tell you that it is better to be generous with the amount of video you keep, because it's much easier to keep trimming down instead of going back to the original footage and picking something up that you have second thoughts about including.

Here's how I do it: Work with each game tape separately. Edit the entire game by going through it from start to finish. Keep the scenes you want or think you want. Again, to be on the safe side, be generous with what you keep, you can always fine-tune later. Then, render the edited video to a new DV .AVI file. I give it a file name, like 'Game 1_Highlights'. You can then delete the "complete" game original footage from your hard drive. If you have enough hard drive space for ALL of the rendered "highlight" videos, that's great -- keep them on the hard drive. (At only 2 to 3 minutes per game, these files will be very small -- only about 500 - 600 MB.) If your really pressed for space, you can write the "highlight" version back to tape on your DV camcorder. (This is a good thing to do anyway in case your system crashes. DV tape is the cheapest backup medium there is for video work.) Repeat the above procedure for each game. After you've gone through editing all of the games and creating separate "highlight" videos, create a new VF project in which you work with all of these "highlight" videos. With this "entire season" project, you can do further fine-tuning, especially getting the total time to where you want it to be, and adding any transitions between games, titles, special effects, music (this is especially fun to add), etc. Once you get the "entire season" project where you want it, render the project to a single DV .AVI file. I name it something like, 'Entire Season_Highlights'.

I always write the final season highlight video back to DV tape for permanent storage. This gives you the opportunity to always go back and read it into VF and do further editing.

It is also a great way to make VHS copies for everyone. Simply put the DV tape in your camcorder, connect it to the VCR with a cable that should have come with the camcorder, press the REC button on the VCR, and then the play button on the camcorder. You get a great VHS copy everytime and you don't need the computer.

Personally, if I invest the amount of time that it takes to do something like an entire season highlight tape correctly, there is absolutely no way I'm junking it up by putting it on VCD or even SVCD. It goes only on DVD or VHS (VHS tape are much better than VCD especially for soccer game where there's so much motion.) I had about a 50/50 split of people who wanted it on DVD versus VHS tape.

I use Ulead DVD Movie Factory to author the DVDs. With DVD, you can create menus and/or chapter points that makes it easy to go directly to a particular game or great play.

I hope the above helps. Good luck with your video editing adventure. I know I got a lot of good comments from the people I gave tapes to. When I told them the program I use to do all the editing is only $60, they couldn't believe it. They thought I had thousands of dollars invested.

Ralph
IanG wrote on 1/7/2003, 2:58 AM
>(VHS tape are much better than VCD especially for soccer game where there's so much motion.)

Interesting! I guess VCR and DVD player quality/compatibility may be an issue, but my results have been the opposite of that. I guess you have to see what works best for you.

Ian G.

ralphied wrote on 1/7/2003, 9:15 AM
Ian,

I have never had any VCD look decent when played back on my DVD player connected to my TV or the DVD player on my computer. They're always very blocky and pixelated looking. Yet, I've seen others like yourself state how good they are. What are you doing that I'm missing? Are you using special encoding software or the standard encoder that comes with VF? I would love to use VCD if the quality was anywhere near acceptable, but my experience has been that it's not even close.

I would really appreciate any insight.

Ralph.
Former user wrote on 1/7/2003, 10:04 AM
I agree with Ralph. VCD is acceptable but it is half resolution. VHS is full frame full resolution. It will look better with movement.

The advantage of VCD though is you can make copies without anymore quality loss, whereas, as we all know, vhs will lose very quickly.

Dave T2
PaulT1 wrote on 1/7/2003, 11:37 AM
If your prime interest is saving disk space then in my opinion the only way to do it is during the capturing process.
Preview the original takes and capture only the highlites you are interested in. You can always go back to capture and add (insert)some more scenes in order to fill the 60 minutes.
pfeiferp wrote on 1/7/2003, 1:03 PM
I agree with PaulT1....

I use my camcorder to watch each tape and note start and end time for clips I want to keep. I then capture only those clips and name them carefully for later editing.

It's great to have some idea about the strucuture of the highlite film. The last one I did used "defense" "special teams" "bloopers" "offense" and "scenes". My labeling scheme included D, ST, B, O, and S for each captured clip. Each section was a separate project and movie. I stored them all back to back on DV tape...and took the tape to a copy shop to make VHS copies for everyone. As others have said, the players and their families LOVED their tapes.


Although it is a good idea to capture more than you know you will use...I have to force myself to KEEP IT SHORT. I aim for 30 minutes or less.


IanG wrote on 1/7/2003, 2:54 PM
Ralph, no, I'm not doing anything special*. I use Nero to convert to MPEG-1 on the fly, and TMPGEnc to produce MPEG-2. I've tried using quite expensive CD-Rs and very cheap ones, but haven't seen any difference. By contrast, I've found the quality of VHS tapes has a clear effect - new tapes are very much better.

For a while, before it finaly turned its toes up, my old DVD player gave very poor results with home made VCDs, although it was fine with commercial ones and DVDs. My new one (very cheap, from the local supermarket) gives great results with everything! That said, I've just noticed you're also getting poor results on your PC, so it probably isn't the player.

* I may be doing something special(ish). I always turn off the buffer under-run protection and write at a low speed. I started doing this when I was having my own VCD problems and the habit's stuck.

Ian G.
J_Mac wrote on 1/7/2003, 8:12 PM
I,ve been reading (and not contributing)the forum for quite awhile and have used many suggestions, hints, and advice regularly. This is a topic that is near and dear to my heart, so I signed up after all this time. I have done soccer video for a number of years and the number one thing I've learned is to keep a paper log of all the action on a game tape, with counter numbers, action description, player name and number, opponents name, weather, date, time of day and lighting, and field conditions. Although this may seem onerous the first or second film, when you are down to the final film and the final scene, and your hard drive decides to go south for the winter, you,ll be glad you have a log to easily rebuild your data. Out of my 8 tapes this has happened to me 6 times, each for a different cause. This log will provide you with other taping themes beyond the present project and can save you time in production on the next tape with a new theme. You can customize to a particular player, a particular action (goals, falling, passing, trapping, etc.) a particular team, etc.. I agree on the assessment of Vcd over VHS, but use VHS regularly because of the problems my folks have playing Vcd's. Another solution for taping to a VCR is to use the ADS Technologies TV Elite XGA. This cool little tool mounts to your monitor feed from your PC and splits the output to analog and digital outputs. One (digital) completes to your monitor and the other (analog) to your VCR input. I have mine plugged into an analog Radio Shack AV switch box and have it run to my VCR, living room TV, and Sony camera. You must run the sound separatly from your sound card. The TV Elite is an external box and uses no PC slots. It merely hooks up to your monitor feed. Finally use MPeg for Vcd and AVI for VHS. Good Luck! Don't forget, write it down! John