Loss of Audio Track

Don Savage wrote on 2/20/2007, 2:27 PM

This is my first attempt at creating a DVD from a DV video camera. When I transferred a file into Windows XP, it created the following file:

clip001.avi

When I click on its properties, it shows:

Video: 00:02:22.909, 29.970 fps interlaced, 720x480x24, DV
Audio: 00:02:24.000, 44,100 Hz, 16 Bit, Stereo, Uncompressed

When I drag this file to the video track, the Quick Start Manual says the “associated audio track is automatically inserted into a separate audio track below the video track”. Well, the video track does appear correctly, but the audio track changes to a white area with three flat horizontal black lines, and no audio is present when you play the project (but the “mixer” area does show two green bars that show about “30"). I am sure it is not set to “mute”. Any ideas on what I am doing wrong. Thanks very much for your help.

Comments

Chienworks wrote on 2/20/2007, 4:01 PM

44,100Hz is a little weird. Audio from DV is usually 48,000 Hz. I wonder if your audio track is corrupted. If you play the file in media player do you hear the sound?

Tim L wrote on 2/20/2007, 5:11 PM

Does the file play okay in Windows Media Player? (or any other player?)

How did you upload the file to your computer? USB or Firewire? (and what kind of camera?)

If you used USB, you might have the Type1 AVI vs. Type2 AVI problem. Vegas and Vegas Movie Studio only work with Type2, which creates a separate audio stream (or something) in the avi file itself which makes it nice for editing. Type1 doesn't create this extra stream -- the audio is there (in the file) but not in a format where Vegas can find it.

If you captured with Vegas' capture application, everything should be okay (i.e. Type 2). If you captured with Windows Movie Maker, or some utility that came with your camera, you might have ended up with a Type 1 avi. If the file plays with sound in Windows Media Player, but you have no sound in Vegas, then this is likely the case.

Tim L

Don Savage wrote on 2/21/2007, 1:08 PM

Thanks very much for your response. Yesterday, I was able to play the video and auto on the computer...I thought, "great I don't have to import it again". But, I don't remember which program I was using. When I try to recreate that today, I haven't been able to.

Don Savage wrote on 2/21/2007, 1:17 PM

Tim L...Also, thank you for your fast response.

1) As per response above, I did play it once on the computer, but couldn't recreate that success while gathering info to respond to your questions.

2) I used a USB connection to load the file from a Panasonic PV-GS300

3) Hope it fits...here are the properties from the file:
General
Name: Tape 1 - Clip 001.avi
Folder: C:\Documents and Settings\Library User\My Documents
Type: Video for Windows
Size: 528.39 MB (541,075,968 bytes)
Created: Thursday, July 27, 2006, 11:09:43 AM
Modified: Thursday, July 27, 2006, 11:12:24 AM
Accessed: Wednesday, February 21, 2007, 2:23:16 PM
Attributes: Archive

Streams
Video: 00:02:22.909, 29.970 fps interlaced, 720x480x24, DV
Audio: 00:02:24.000, 44,100 Hz, 16 Bit, Stereo, Uncompressed

Capture
Tape Name: Tape 1
Recorded: 0 0
Version: 4.0
Comment:
Rating:
Statistics:
Captured frames: 4272
Dropped frames: 0
Data rate: 3.430385

ACID information
ACID chunk: no
Stretch chunk: no
Stretch list: no
Stretch info2: no
Beat markers: no
Detected beats: no

Other metadata
Regions/markers: no
Command markers: no

Media manager
Media tags: no

Plug-In
Name: aviplug.dll
Folder: C:\Program Files\Sony\Vegas Movie Studio 6.0\FileIO Plug-Ins\aviplug
Version: Version 1.2 (Build 4069)
Company: Madison Media Software, Inc.

Again, thanks for you help. The project I'm working on is capturing the oral histories from older folks on a small Bahamian island, describing activities that are falling from the culture, like boat building, sponging and rock farming.

Chienworks wrote on 2/21/2007, 2:39 PM

Don't use USB. Get a firewire cable and use that instead.

Tim L wrote on 2/21/2007, 4:54 PM

Here are couple quick links to info about Type 1 vs Type 2.

http://www.digitalvideoclub.com/techinfo/avi.php

http://media.pana3ccduser.com/wiki/index.php?No%20Audio%20after%20Capture

Both refer to free utilities that can convert Type 1 to Type 2 (which is what you need). I'm sure there are other utilties available as well. This might save you from having to recapture footage you already have on your computer. (But I have no personal experience using any of these utilities.)

By the way, you may want to check out the rest of the pana3ccduser.com website -- a very good resource for panasonic users (I'm there a lot and don't even have a panasonic camera...)

As chienworks recommends, use Firewire (also called IEEE-1394, or called iLink by Sony) for capture with Vegas/VMS, and you shouldn't have to go through this again.

Tim L

Don Savage wrote on 2/22/2007, 7:20 AM

Chineworks....As I've said, I'm really new to the video world. I heard about "firewire", but when I was told that USB would also work, I didn't look into it any further. Do I have to purchse some type of video card that has "firewire" capability? I'm using a Dell Dimension 2400 desktop for my editing.

Thanks again for your timely help.

Don Savage

Don Savage wrote on 2/22/2007, 7:24 AM

Tim L.....Thanks very much for the info. The web sites you sent me to look great...they seem to exactely describe my problem and how to fix it. Will try it out as soon as I can.

I did learn my lesson. My first test tape was about 30 minutes long....and the rendering took quite a while. The 2 minute tape I tried for the second attempt was the file I have been sending you information on. I think I'll start from scratch with a new filming and trp to make it through the process.

Again, your help has been fantastic....I really appreciate it.

Don Savage

MSmart wrote on 2/22/2007, 2:36 PM

Tim, Don's cam is a GS300 so I don't think AVI type is an issue. But using USB vs Firewire definately is not advised.

Don, one thing to consider on your cam, what Audio bit-rate setting is used, 12-bit or 16-bit? If 12, change it to 16, you'll get better sound. 12-bit is typically used for doing voiceovers directly on the cam. Just a thought.

Chienworks wrote on 2/22/2007, 3:56 PM

Don, if you don't have a firewire port in your computer then you can pick one quite cheaply. Most anything made in the last couple of years should work fine. If you're not sure how recent it is, make sure it lists "OHCI compliant" on the packaging. I've ordered both an internal PCI card and a PCMCIA card from Newegg.com and paid about $10 each for them. Both work perfectly.

Don Savage wrote on 2/24/2007, 12:45 PM

MSmart....I think you are right about the AVI type. I download the AVI Type 1 to AVI Type 2 converesion program...sent it the file in question...and it said it was already Type 2.

I haven't had time to run an end-to-end test again...but thanks to all for your help to this point....I'm afraid I may need to turn to you all again before I finally have a successful process.

Don

Tim L wrote on 2/24/2007, 3:16 PM

Darn it, Don, I thought we had it for sure... USB capture, no audio, classic Type1-Type2 symptoms!

Okay, lets got back to Kelly's (Chienworks) observation: audio is 44.1 KHz.

According to the "DV" entry at wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dv):
Audio
DV allows either 2 digital audio channels (usually stereo) at 16 bit resolution and 48 kHz sampling rate, or 4 digital audio channels at 12 bit resolution and 32 kHz sampling rate. For professional or broadcast applications, 48 kHz is used almost exclusively. In addition, the DV spec includes the ability to record audio at 44.1 kHz (the same sampling rate used for CD audio), although in practice this option is rarely used.

And regarding MSmart's suggestion to check for 2-channel 16bit audio (preferred) vs. 4-channel 12-bit audio: It doesn't appear your camera is in 12-bit mode, as the Wikipedia article also indicates that 12-bit audio will be 32 KHz. (Oh, and now I also notice that your earlier posting specifically shows 16-bit as well.)

So, I don't know where that leaves us, except to say that something is unusual about the audio stream.

Did you capture the clip using Sony's capture program (from VMS), or did you use some other utility? Something that came with your camcorder, or Windows Movie Maker or something?

Tim L

Don Savage wrote on 3/1/2007, 8:23 AM

Tim...Thanks for your interest. I've had to take a break to work on a few other projects at the Library. I used the Sony Vegas capture program. While it was transfering, I believe I could both see the video and hear the audio. The thing I find strange is that when I drop the video track in place, the audio track does change, but just to the three horizontal lines. So, it knows it has something audio, but just does not handle it properly. Will try to take another clip throught the process in the next day or two. Thanks again.