Need help with redering 1680x1050

Stevos758 wrote on 10/21/2013, 9:41 AM
I have recently purchased Movie studio 11 and fraps. I can't seem to get a good quality video out of vegas. My fraps videos all look great when viewed. As soon as I render in vegas they quality goes down. even more when I send to youtube,

here is a recent test I did.
HD internet 1980 x 1080 30fps


HD internet 1980 x 1080 60fps


HD internet 1728x1080 30fps


I tried using the highest HD internet settings at 1080P I also tred a custom setting of 1728x1080 to match my ratio of 1680x1050.

I am a newb when it comes to this stuff so walk me through step by step if you know what I'm missing.

Comments

musicvid10 wrote on 10/21/2013, 10:14 AM
Post the complete fraps video properties using MediaInfo from Sourceforge.
Also tell us what you are seeing specifically that is "lower quality" in Vegas. Remember, we haven't seen your source, so nothing to compare.
Stevos758 wrote on 10/21/2013, 10:38 AM
General
Complete name : D:\Fraps\arma3 2013-10-20 19-41-43-08.avi
Format : AVI
Format/Info : Audio Video Interleave
Format profile : OpenDML
File size : 85.1 GiB
Duration : 20mn 5s
Overall bit rate : 606 Mbps

Video
ID : 0
Format : Fraps
Codec ID : FPS1
Duration : 20mn 5s
Bit rate : 605 Mbps
Width : 1 680 pixels
Height : 1 050 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:10
Frame rate : 60.000 fps
Color space : YUV
Bit depth : 8 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 5.714
Stream size : 84.9 GiB (100%)

Audio
ID : 1
Format : PCM
Format settings, Endianness : Little
Format settings, Sign : Signed
Codec ID : 1
Duration : 20mn 5s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 411.2 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 44.1 KHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 203 MiB (0%)
Alignment : Aligned on interleaves
Interleave, duration : 999 ms (59.96 video frames)



It seems to be all pixel like. Does it look ok to you? Maybe I am just being picky.

below is the vegas output.

General
Complete name : D:\Vegas\pvptest3.mp4
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID : mp42
File size : 179 MiB
Duration : 1mn 9s
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 21.7 Mbps
Encoded date : UTC 2013-10-21 14:12:12
Tagged date : UTC 2013-10-21 14:12:12

Video
ID : 2
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.2
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 2 frames
Format settings, GOP : M=2, N=15
Muxing mode : Container profile=Main@4.0
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 1mn 9s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 21.6 Mbps
Maximum bit rate : 26.0 Mbps
Width : 1 728 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:10
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 29.970 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.386
Stream size : 178 MiB (99%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2013-10-21 14:12:12
Tagged date : UTC 2013-10-21 14:12:12

Audio
ID : 1
Format : AAC
Format/Info : Advanced Audio Codec
Format profile : LC
Codec ID : 40
Duration : 1mn 9s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 128 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : Front: L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Compression mode : Lossy
Delay relative to video : 33ms
Stream size : 1.05 MiB (1%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2013-10-21 14:12:12
Tagged date : UTC 2013-10-21 14:12:12


musicvid10 wrote on 10/21/2013, 11:22 AM
One thing you should do is set the render frame rate at exactly 30fps (not 29.97) progressive, and set all your timeline events to "Disable Resample." That will eliminate interframe blurring, of which there is a lot in your samples.

Your other settings are actually pretty good for doing the work in Vegas.

Another way that many prefer is to render in Handbrake. The forums at Fraps are full of good ideas on how to do this. One way adapts a video tutorial I helped to produce for Vegas users.

Since Youtube reduces the bitrate on all video, it will never look as good as what you upload to their servers. There are some techniques, however, to make the most of what YT is able to offer.

Experiment, and let us know how it turns out. You are on the right track.
Stevos758 wrote on 10/21/2013, 12:14 PM
Ok. I tried changing the FPS in properties and my render settings to 30FPS. I also did the disable resample. I now get an unkown error when trying to render?

How do I set to 30 FPS?
musicvid10 wrote on 10/21/2013, 12:24 PM
Type in "30" in the render custom settings, these are different than the project settings.
Project settings should "Match Media Settings." Search that exact phrase.
Render MP4, not AVCHD or Bluray, as those are fixed formats.
Post a screenshot of your video render template if you run into more problems.
Warper wrote on 10/21/2013, 2:42 PM
Stevos758
1) Set no more than 30 fps in fraps*. Youtube will not show more than 30.000 fps anyway. If you are not comfortable in-game with this fps you can turn off lock framerate and v-sync in fraps settings.
2) Tweak project settings in Vegas to set up exactly your fps in fraps, exacly your resolution and pixel aspect ratio 1,000. Youtube help system suggests to upload video in natural resolution. For the most part it works better that way. And fps is no question. Set up exact fps of frapsed video, 30.000 is not the same as 29.972. This way you will not need disable resampling and will lose 0 frames on resampling errors*
3) Use 8-bit project (gamma 2,222), best picture quality and deinterlace method blend fields. The latter one is just safeguard, you don't really need for pure progressive material, but if you occasionally put some interlaced material like your face through video camera it might be handy.
4) Eliminate ghosting if you detect it. You should not see it unless game produces one and even in this case shoot ghosting at once - it's worst thing for compression. Disable motion blur in game if you can.
5) Correct picture levels. Use Color Levels filter with preset Computer RGB to studio RGB, apply it to every event, or better track or simpler as output FX. It changes picture and in small preview window you'll see wrong colours, but if you use regular Vegas codecs, small preview doesn't show what you'll get in the end. To see what you'll get after vegas mpeg codecs, set up full preview window for studio rgb colour and open your video in full screen preview. Generally picture loses some darkest colours (in shadows evething becomes pitch black), some brightest colours and as whole looks washed out.
6) Use mainconcept AVC/AAC with Internet HD 1080p preset as a base for tweaks. Press Render as, selct preset and press Custom button. Set up exactly your resolution, exactly your framerate, field order none (progressive) and raise bitrate up to 20M average 28M peak. Select rendering mode using CPU only.
Now save your setting under new name (select preset name, type something then press diskette button to the right). If you get errors in render, set resolution to x*1080. Sometimes mainconcept avc refuses to render custom resolutions. If it doesn't work, try setting resolution to 1920*1080. If it still doesn't work you have something different wrong.

With this settings you should get good picture in local movie player. It might freeze sometimes, but that's ok. If it doesn't look good here, let us know - it shouldn't.
Now try to upload your video to youtube. If you are lucky, your video will look good enough. It will never be perfect with current youtube bitrate limits, but more or less it will be better than your examples.

Hope this will help.

P.S.
* You may use slow motion, in this case 60 fps might look good in fraps. You mey need "disable resample" here to avoid ghosting.
* You may avoid letterboxing cropping some part of you game picture or stretching or a bit of both. Try it in pan/crop window. I prefer to stretch video to 1920*1080, but my resolution (size of window) is closer to it than yours.
musicvid10 wrote on 10/21/2013, 2:55 PM
Great details, I wasn't going to address the levels issue yet until he got some experience.

Going from 60p source to 30p output requires "disable resample," otherwise Vegas will try to blend frames, blurring the motion.
I agree, capturing 30fps is the best choice.

With Youtube, excessive bitrates do not increase delivery quality, and take a lot longer to render and upload. For his 1080p game capture, 14-16 Mbps ABR is about optimal on the speed vs. quality axis, perhaps less with Handbrake.

Fast Start (Web Optimized) should be enabled when rendering the video for upload. Doing so cuts the upload / processing time in half, because the two can occur simultaneously, rather than consecutively.

Thanks for filling in some details.
Warper wrote on 10/21/2013, 3:33 PM
musicvid10
I have a simple math for my average bitrate: 10 minutes video fits in 2Gb :)
musicvid10 wrote on 10/21/2013, 7:36 PM
That's about 4.5 Mbps, ok for 720p, but might be a bit slim for 1080p, depending on the amount of motion detail.
Warper wrote on 10/22/2013, 3:00 AM
No, that's not so bad. It's about 3,3 Mbytes/sec (20 000 000 000 bytes / 600 seconds) or 26,6 Mbit/s including audio and container overhead. And we set bitrate in megabits in rendering settings.
musicvid10 wrote on 10/22/2013, 8:23 AM
My mistake, thanks for sharing.
Stevos758 wrote on 10/23/2013, 9:13 AM
Thanks! I will try this with my next video. Here is my most recent. It seems a bit better. i have upped my resolution to 1728x1080p from 1680x1050p. I have a new monitor on the way.... 21:9 so I should have the correct 1080p resolutions to work with now.