OT: Boom pole & shotgun recommend?

Jessariah67 wrote on 5/4/2009, 11:32 AM
Hey all,

I'm gonna be working on a documentary that will involve following people around on the fly. This is something I haven't really done (to this level) in the past, so I'm sorting through audio issues. There will be three "talents" we're following with one camera (Canon XH-A1). After thinking about it, I've decided to put a shotgun mic on the camera ( so I have "good) wild sound) and boom another shotgun into the other channel in the camera.

I currently own a Sennheiser ME66. I really like it, but wanted to see what others are in love with on the lower-professional level. Also, any recoomends on decent boom poles would be appreciated.

Thanks for any help.

KH

Comments

UlfLaursen wrote on 5/4/2009, 11:55 AM
I have a Røde NTG2 and like it

http://www.rodemic.com/microphone.php?product=NTG-2

If you will only use it with phantom power, you can get the NTG1

I have an old sennheiser MKE80 and this one is ok too, but I have never compared the two.

/Ulf
essami wrote on 5/4/2009, 1:13 PM
I have the Rode NTG2 as well and I like it.

Sami
richard-courtney wrote on 5/4/2009, 1:20 PM
As far as boom poles, I broke down and bought a http://www.pro-audio-warehouse.com/keg-88cc.htmlK-Tek Avalon Traveler[/link]
because it fits in a travel bag. It has a coiled XLR inside and a male connector
on the end of the 7 foot pole when extended and is very lightweight.

You will want a shock mount and "dead cat".

I made mine from plastic plumbing parts and rubber O-rings and the wife made
the dead cat cover from fake fur material she bought at the local sewing shop.
farss wrote on 5/4/2009, 2:17 PM
For boom poles I prefer Loon Audio over K-Tek.
Mics, I have a Sanken CS-1 on my camera in a K-Tek mount, Nice combo as the mic is good value and it's small and light. The CS-3 is better, at a price.

Rode make great mics and they're made down here. Their products can't be beat for the price.

Regardless keep in mind that shotguns only work as well as the people using them. The phased array ones are better than the plain interference tube varieties but always, if they're not aimed right or if the speakers moves through the 'beam' it can sound funky.

Bob.
Serena wrote on 5/4/2009, 3:53 PM
I've been pleased with a Lightwave G5 cabled News Pole, which is carbon fibre with no metal parts, light and compact.
richard-amirault wrote on 5/5/2009, 2:13 PM
There will be three "talents" we're following with one camera (Canon XH-A1). After thinking about it, I've decided to put a shotgun mic on the camera ( so I have "good) wild sound) and boom another shotgun into the other channel in the camera.

Did you consider running the boom pole mic into a seperate digital recorder (dual system sound)? It may be easier for you as it will eliminate the cord from the boom pole mic to the camera .. as you are "... following people around on the fly."
Jessariah67 wrote on 5/5/2009, 3:18 PM
Good recommends and advice. Thanks.

K
FuTz wrote on 5/6/2009, 5:32 AM
A Sanken CS3e (insist on the "e": lower noise floor vs older version) with rf traps into your conectors. Or simly put those on your cable:

http://www.neutrik.com/fl/en/audio/204_1603252336/EMC-XLR_Series_productlist.aspx

Loon boom poles rock. I use one daily and ditched my VdB as soon as I tried it a year ago.
Jeff9329 wrote on 5/6/2009, 1:13 PM
The boom operator is going to need a mixer or at least a breakout box and a set of 7506s in order to monitor and/or ride the levels.

What you really need is a SD-302 mixer to take your audio to the next level. This will give you 3 inputs so you can mix some wireless feeds (future maybe?) also.

If you describe your shooting locations a little more, we can help out on the mic reccomendation. I.E. inside, outside, noisy, windy, boom operator skill (handling noise), etc.
Jessariah67 wrote on 5/6/2009, 6:57 PM
We're gonna be in flea markets - so all of the above in terms of issues.
farss wrote on 5/6/2009, 8:24 PM
"We're gonna be in flea markets "

OK, so anything wired is probably out of the question, too much risk to people and kit.

1) Sanken CS-1 or CS-3e mic.
2) K-Tek shock mount for mic. They're the only people who make the right mount for these mics.
3) Rycote Fluffy (dead cat). Get the one that fits the mic.
4) Sennheiser SKP500 Plug-In Transmitter and matching receiver or similar from Lectrosonics.
5) Loon Audio pole with Basemate and wing:http://www.loonaudio.com/basemate_detail.php.

Bob.
Jeff9329 wrote on 5/7/2009, 10:54 AM
For this application, I would probably go wireless and rent if you can't buy the equipment or hire a sound guy with his own kit.

Sure, you could just boom one mic directly into the camera, but it's not going to be broadcast worthy sound at all.

I don't see any inexpensive way to get good sound in this application. A cheaper but difficult and post intensive option is to record the boom mic to a good digital recorder with a limiter in 24b/48khz. The 24b signal allows a lot of lattitude in post for level control and levels compression. You can also monitor and ride the levels directly off the digital recorder.

Bob's idea is okay but Im not clear how you would monitor or ride the levels.

I would post your original question in "All Things Audio" on DVinfo.com for another opinion. Most guys on there are sound only gurus.
farss wrote on 5/7/2009, 2:21 PM
"Bob's idea is okay but Im not clear how you would monitor or ride the levels."

That's going to have to be the job of the camera operator. It leaves the boom op to concentrate solely on positioning the mic. Agree it would be better if he could hear how well he's doing and it might be possible to give him monitoring but I was trying to avoid any loose cables that could get snagged keeping in mind this sounds like it'll be shot it crowded places with lots of 'stuff'' that could snag cables.
One can get a mic preamp with monitoring that fits into the end of a boom pole. You can also get wireless transmitters with back channels for boom / talent from Zaxcom. Costs keep going up though.

As for recording 24bit, not so certain in this scenario if it gains you anything, the ambient noise level and the noise floor from the mic preamps and wireless link would be above the inherent noise floor of 16bit digital. Having said that avoiding the compression (mp2) used in HDV could be a good thing. Not certain how this cam does audio.

Much cheaper and better solution would be a hand held wireless mic. This assumes it'd be OK to have the mic in shot. Then you get the mic much, much closer to the sound source. No matter how much money you throw at this problem you'll never get great sound using an out of shot mic when you can't yell "Quiet on the set". There's also probably no opportunity to slate shots and ending up with lots of wild audio to sync up in post without slates is going to be a lot of work if double heading

Bob.
Jeff9329 wrote on 5/7/2009, 4:45 PM
Bob:

Yep, on all counts.

To the OP:

B&H is having a good sale now.
Patryk Rebisz wrote on 5/8/2009, 8:49 AM
I'm shooting a reality show for Bravo TV right now where we follow a latitude of characters and the boom is the last resort. Basically if someone who we didn't have time to mic pops in one of the sound men opens his boom.

So to answer the original posters question. Forget the boom pole and the shotgun mic and hire a professional. A good sound guy can be had for $250-300/day and he comes with about $12,000+ worth of gear and wealth of experience.