DVD-R ,, at least a thousand made with DVDA , sony burners ,Verbatim media , no label ,either they are working or my clients dont give a @#$%

MMmmmm. Using DVDA, I have tried several types of media?
AO5 burner. All play fine on computers and DVD players I own, but have seen with my own eyes not playing on others.

Atleast the the format will be obsolete in a few years!

I author in TMPGenc DVD Author (or whatever it's called) then burn with Nero. I've never had a complaint/return. Also, I print on them too (Ridata DVD+R Inkjet printables).
My cost per disk (printing, case, case cover, DVD, & using some krylon spray to seal the print job) runs about $1.45 PER DISC. After I add on ~$1.5 for other wear & tear things (DVD printer, HD, DVD burner), it's close to $3.

You know what helps? Spend the extra $15-20 on a warenty from Circuit City, Office Max, etc. whe nyou buy hardware. Then, if it dies in the warenty period, you get a free replacement or your $ back in a gift card (it just happened to me with my HP burner. I got my $205 back, got a burner with another 2 year warenty & blew the last $30 on a game since I oculdn'tget anything else I wanted for $30).

I am told the white "print on" DVD-r are better than labels but the cost and extra time does not add up either.

Hmm.... 10-15% returns... what does that cost? I don't know if the labels are your problem... but I am not sure where you get your idea that it costs a lot more than labels to print onto DVD-R's? The printable DVD's really don't cost that much. The printers don't cost that much. The cost per DVD for ink doesn't cost that much. It also looks more professional than labels (so my clients say).

Also - how does it take extra time to print directly onto the DVD's? Surely printing labels and placing these onto the DVD's (accurately) takes time too? How many DVD's do you typically create in this way anyway?

Your return rate is way too high.

Here's what matters.

1. Media. Use only brand-name media (Maxell, TDK, Sony, Verbatim).

2. Use DVD-R rather than DVD+R (this only makes a difference for playback on really old players).

3. Some say that you should keep the average bitrate to below 7,000 kbps. I do not subscribe to this theory, but if I were having the problems you are having, I would certainly try to keep the bitrate down.

4. The burner can matter. I have had amazing success with my Pioneer A04 (or is it A05, I can't remember).

5. Do NOT use stick on labels. If they are off-center, it might cause a problem. It also might degrade them faster over time, although that is more of a concern with CD-s where the reflective layer is only a few microns under the label. DVD's are different, and I don't think it is as much of a problem.

Cost as in I do not have a printer that can print directly on the disks.

I make about 300-500 copies of some title or another a year. Most batches are in the 40-50 copy range.

I am not sure if the labels are the problem, again I never have a problem playing my own disks in my puter or stand alone player?

I am not really sure why they fail, skip or stop half way through on others equipment. My latest batch of blanks came from "diskmakers" I bought their high quality stock which I am told is what they use for all their low volume "burned" work.

I am not realy sure what to do to correct the problem.

At this point, I've burned over 500 DVD-R disks for my clients. Several years ago when I began, I had numerous problems. As soon as I began using my CinemaCraft/Maestro/Nero/RitekG04 combination, the problems went away completely.

I repeat: not a single return attributable to the disks since standardizing on the above-mentioned combination. I've had three instances of play failure: one on an X-box that didn't like most disks, and two on very old (burned-disk-hostile) DVD players. Nothing else.

I attribute the reliability primarily to the G04 disks combined with the Pioneer burner. I also think Nero is a very stable burning program.

For every one of these disks I have used Meritline glossy full-face adhesive labels, printed with an Epson C80 inkjet printer with Durabrite pigment ink (no smearing/running/fading). The labels look terrific and if done properly cause absolutely no problems that I can discern. Some day I'll switch to white DVD blanks, but not until I can get similar results.

All disks were burned at the 4x speed, the maximum rated speed of the media. Now that I have a Pioneer 8x burner, I will switch exclusively to 8x burning as soon as my current stockpile of 4x G04 blanks runs out. At places such as www.meritline.com the 4x disks are about $.35 each, and the 8x disks are around $.45--a trivial cost difference.

In your case, I would suggest doing a small batch with Ritek media and the Nero program. I would not use an average bitrate higher than 8Mb/sec, and a peak bitrate higher than 9Mb/sec. Keep the blank disk as clean as possible until burning; any junk on the bottom will create a defect. The DVD format has very robust error-correction, but better to not need it in the first place.

If you still get lots of problems, try someone else's machine. Perhaps there is something wrong with your burner.

I also use the Pioneer burner, DVD-R is also what I use.

Bit rates are also within safe limits usually I max at 7000 and drop the average rate down for max quality depending on the program legnth.

Cost as in I do not have a printer that can print directly on the disks.

Cost - as in - add up the cost. Add up the cost in retrurns for one thing.

You'll find you can easily afford the cost of a $99 or less Epson Photo R200.

I can't say that there is an inexpensive disc that will work on all DVD players. I tried the Beall's, recommended by Meritline, that use to have a statement saying that Government agencies (Nasa & others) used them because of their high reliability and 100 year shelf life. (I never bought the 100 yr shelf life statement), my theory on those is that what I got is not the same thing the government agencies get. After reading numerous posts at different forums, I'm now trying Ritek (Ridata DVD-Rs), but it's too early to give you my report on those. But either of those brands were between .50 and .60 cents each, when bought by the hundred. The Beall had a huge printable area, but I've had two people (1-Sony and 1-Panasonic) that had problems playing them. The Ridata's have a normal size printable area and look promising. Oddly, my Toshiba and Akai DVD players have not come across a brand they won't play. If I never bought any more ink for my Epson R200 and threw it away, my cost of printing per disc, including the price of the printer is .75 cents. (I will be looking for cheap ink substitutes) And if you really want to be cheap, you can just put lettering on the disc and no pictures. I use the Pioneer A05 to burn and DVD-A, although, I may use TMPGEnc to mpg2 encode from time to time. I've also used a clear acrylic enamel by Dupli-Color ($5. a can) to get a nice sheen on top of the printing. (haven't figuered out exact cost per disc, but let's say about a dime more.)

Let me add our own recent tale of woe:
I've recently authored about 200 DVDs and from those several thousand copies have been sold. Until my last one we'd had ONE complaint, copies were made in tower type duplicator and ink jet printed.
The last one we did 50% of the clienst complained and they all had exactly the same problem, at one part of the DVD the player would skip and then stop. Start from the next chapter and not a problem. Now the only thing I can think of is that at that point the show goes into blackout, camera gain goes right up and so does the noise. Result from encoder is max bitrate for a while. I'm going to try a new encode after deliberately fading to solid black at that point and setting max bit rate a little lower.
And as always the DVDs play fine on the cheapo players, it's the expensive ones that can't cope.
Bob.

Don't automatically assume it's your DVDs that are at fault - at least, not always. I switched to DVD distribution a year ago and, while I can't claim to have burned hundreds, I have certainly have turned out well over one hundred in the time with not one failure. I use the Main Concept encoder with DA 2 and always go to the makimum bit rate (9800), so that is not a problem (for me).

I know several other people using other software (U-Lead, Pinnacle, etc) which I'm sure is fine and they have very variable results with no known reason. It may be that farss hits it on the head - the cheap players cope, it's the expensive ones that don't.

I used to use stick-on labels but they were always a worry. I have seen people run into trouble with them, even if they are a fraction off centre. And, of course, if they start to lift .... Printed labels are not so expensive. I purchased a Canon i860/65 printer and even here down-under it was less than $300and has come down since. Last weekend I found a spindle of 50 printable DVDs, name brand, for $34. The printed label quality is beautiful.

Your's is a world-wide problem but it may not be your fault.

As many do, I use quality media, DVD-R format. I use both printed labels and printable disks, and haven't really had a failure of either yet. The key issue in my mind is to make sure that the max bit rate isn't too high, as that can cause a cheap or old player to fail at odd times. A really bad DVD NEVER plays. A too-fast DVD will fail at unpredictable times, depending on the player. I never exceed 6 Mbs, even if the program is short.

We've made hundreds of DVDs using Ritek G04 -R, Pioneer A06 burner, and DVD-A. Not one complaint. Not one return. BTW, Ritek is quality media, it simply costs less!

Jay