I just remembered what some friends of mine did back in the sixties. They set up an 8 mm camera behind a stallkeeper at a grocery market. Then one of them went up to the stall, very openly helped himself to a carrot and ate it. The stallkeeper, of course, couldn't believe his eyes, never seen cheek like that before. Even from behind you could see his body language while he struggled between just yelling or actually running around the stall to do whatever he then would have done. An amazing piece of forced documentary.
Tor

Mornin' TorS [ GraZIE - not Graze! Mind you that's where the nickname came from I think . . . . ]

Yup - Got plenty of stuff that falls into your first post. SIlly stuff, sound roadies "getting-it-up" as they say; BAD singing by the roadie; people wandering around wondering where their pitch was; lots of this . . .

I do like the story in your second post! Wouldn't attempt this around these here parts!

I suppose, what I learnt was to get clear in my mind a "simple" story board - could always deviate. I must remeber to more "interviews". Got a nice snippet of an elderly couple who've been "fairground" events all their lives. I did have the presence of mind to get hold of the tmetable for the day, and with some of predetermined shots got this from the TT sheet - that was useful.

This post is really to glean more "Must Dos" from you'll.

Thanks TorS!

Grazie

Grazie, some questions I'd go through are -

How long is it to be - that tells me how "brutal" to be when selecting footage.

What style or "tone" do I want - tell a story, or a montage of impressions - maybe both - I'm sure you've got lots of "bits and pieces" which would go well set to suitable music (another question - which music?)

There may be a few "parallel stories you can follow - if so, go back later and see how XXX is going, then back to something else.

Probably confused you more, but a few ideas ... good luck

peter

Peter - No, you haven't confused me. What you've actually done is to put some "shape" or created a "format" onto which I could have had a scratch sheet to work from - excellent!

In essence many threads, many interweaving stories - keep it lively and keep it what it is - An Arts Event!

Thanks - Grazie

For some inspiration on these kinds of pieces, check out the work of Les Blank (one of my personal heroes). You can find his catalog at: http://www.lesblank.com/main.html

Some titles of particular interest:
- Garlic is as Good as Ten Mothers
- God Respects Us When we Work, But He Loves Us When We Dance
- Always for Pleasure
- Yum! Yum! Yum!

Some of these might be available at your library or hip video store.

Um..ah...ok. I am gonna suggest a few 'traditional' things here. First I can't say I believe in the 'shock' reality of something or making something happen. But in saying this if that is what you want to do than yeah, go for it. Obviously things such as the Faces of Death videos and the Girls Gone Wild videos have a strong appeal. For me personally there is a fine line between shooting an event and something unexpected happens and going to and event to either make something happen or going 'because' something will happen. Of course my opinon on these things has changed considerably since September 11, 2001.

Anyhow - if you go to an event with an idea in mind that is the best case scenerio. In your case that could be several things - you said it was community event so one idea would be to just show how the community comes together to support it local artists. Another could be to show the local talent and interview said talent. You could also take the view of the local community that may not really want the festival there bcasue it inconviences them - so you stay on the outside and go to people who live in the area and interview them about what they think.

Obviously there is the whole 'what message do you want' concept that will present whatever reality you are feeling. For example you mention "I started to loose the plot - and the will to live - after the 4th music set!" and that could lead you to present this event as boring and just painful to have attended. Editorial wise you could just show the worst art, the worst singers, the worst dancers and so on. This is what really happened, your camera doesn't lie, but you also are not showing the entire picture...and that is your option to do that. It might be even more of a challenge to your skills as an editor to take an event that was horrible to you and put together a piece that shows how enjoyable it was.

If you have no idea of what the event is about, for example you get a call at 6 am telling you to be at a location to shoot a kids fair by 8 am, you need to ask a few questions of yourself yes, but first you need to find out why you are needed to shoot this event. Obviously if it something for the news you would approach it a lot different than if it was for an advertiser or sponser of the event. Lets say you are shooting for a radio station putting on the event. They call and you ask what they 'need' and they will say something to the effect of "People having a good time and the vendors" and that will give you your first important shot list. Chances are this radio staion wants a final product that will show future potential sponsers how fun and family oriented events they sponser are. Beyond that if you find a booth surrounded by people shoot it - shoot a wide shot, shoot close ups of happy people at that booth, shoot money changing hands. It may seem boring but think of the affect on a business who is thinking of coughing up money at a future event seeing throngs of people...happy, money spending, people...at the booths.

Now on a different level it was mentioned go seeking out trouble. I don't have the same vision, at least on a broad level. But imagine this - say you want to do a piece on children who are kidnapped. So you go to this event with a few things in mind...to shoot familes having a good time and maybe even go to these families and interview them. If along the way their happens to be lost child doesn't that add something? But I would hope you don't go just because you want some child to be lost so you can shoot it. Lost children aside you take your 'happy family' footage at a later time and go to local law enforcement and you sit down with an 'expert' and shoot this person as they view the footage you shot. Now you have commentary about what this family did that was safe and what that family did that was dangerous. See what I am saying? Now your footage takes on an entire new meaning. Instead of just people walking around a community arts festival you have people putting their children in harms way...perhaps.

Obviously you can do anything you want as an artist but if you are trying to tell a story it becomes a but harder because you have to present the material in some cohesive fashon. How to do that may not always start off with a clear cut idea, just a vauge notion. You might go to cover the overall event but end up seeing some performer who just blows you away and suddenly that becomes your story. And time...the time of the final project. You can make 60 seconds a hell of a lot more exciting than 30 minutes but if a story is there you really can't tell it all in 60 seconds. Just don't be put off if you shoot a lot of material and never use it, that is the nature of the beast when it comes to shooting 'reality'.

Hope some of this helps.

Filmy - "Hope some of this helps. " in the short time we've been reading each others posts, this is as close to an understatement I've seen you make! - YOU HAVE BEEN BRILLIANT!!! - Your penulitimate sentence is a real winner for me.

[ I'm re-reading your post as I'm writing here . . ]

My "loosing the plot..." wasn't about it being boring - I have a high boredom threshold - it was truly me not seeing where I was going next with the way the day was panning out. Your most obvious thing I "steered" away from was the talking head shots - I love doing them, I also get enthused by what is being said too. The money changing hands is a brilliant tip and the "ordinariness" [ is that a word? ] of putting an event together and what is happenning to make it work is also valuable.

Filmy, you've been very understanding and willing to share,

Best regards,

Grazie

I'll fight for the trouble angle. We may not understand the word trouble the same way, though. There's no good film without a bad guy. But the bad guy does not have to be a lady frightener or some desperado with a mass deceptive weapon in his charge. Rough winds do shake the darling buds of May (if I remember the old bard correctly). The weather of course is a very likely bad guy at a fair in England. And even on a bright day you can use the thought of bad weather as an element to keep the viewers interested.

Here's a scenario (if scenario is the word I want): I'm shooting an art fair. I go when they set the thing up and talk to some of the stallkeepers. I single out a few items that look lovely but the owners think perhaps they'll be hard to sell. During the day I shoot the selling of items by the plenty and keep returning to the singled items to see how it's going. (This way I get to show what the fair contains, how many people were there and what they were doing, mostly.) In the end I have footage of one happy ex-owner of a lovely item, counting the profits, and perhaps one still-owner saying Better luck next time, and even perhaps possibly a shot of a happy present-owner of a stuffed owl thinking aloud how she's gonna break the news to her husband.
Who's the bad guy here? What's the trouble? Buying and selling has been the idea of a market day for as long as our historybooks can remember. So the prospect of a failed sale is a perfect bad guy in this perspective. As is the prospect of a silly purchase.
So when I say look for trouble I mean find the thing that can make the main subject fail. And shoot their battle.

Was this, by the way, a question about what you should do with what you had shot, or what you should go for next time?
Tor

Errrmmmm..... Yes, to both parts of your question.

Oh, I do understand about the "trouble" thing. Generally it's about drama, that might not be about "good" things. Even further, it's about being human, it's about an all embracing event WORTS 'n ALL! Yeah?

This thread is just too superb! - I'm gonna distill these Words of Wisdom, and place them in my "Do This Grazie!" Word document. Y'know the type of thing:

Table with the following headings:

Project - Client - Treatment - Essential Shots - Valuable shots - Draft Edit Outline - Notes for Info

Row 1
Row 2
Row 3
.
.
.
.

Neat stuff Chaps!!

Grazie

Yes Tors, I know exactly what you're saying. When I was doing a script writing course they hammered the idea that "conflict is drama".

Like your "bad guy" or "trouble" concepts though, this doen't have to mean something evil, (although in many movies it does...) but something around which a story revolves. If there's something which someone is concerned about, we as viewers are "pulled in" to the story because we want to know how it turns out - we're hopelessly curious!

So, Grazie, if there are any such points in your footage - whether the loudspeakers are going to crackle, or fall over - whether someone is going to turn up in time, or as Tors hinted, whether it's going to rain over the iced buns! etc etc - use them!

Oh yes Peter! - Drama is very essential - I think it was Hitch who said - "It's not what someone is doing in a film that creates drama - It's WHAT happens to them!" - Well, if it worked for Hitchcock . . . . . .

The edit is now starting to form itself in my head - yeah? Thta's been partly due to this thread. - The other thing that this thread has done for me - not coming from a ProFilmic background - is having some of my "worries" somehow diluted by the pros here saying things, I was thinking I was being a NumbNutz about - yeah?

Now comes the way in which I can make V4 work in a more elegant way - Takes and Media Bins - where I can go ahead in a creative way and apply a critcal and "organised" way to the actual capture process, to give me a flowing method of providing me with a "slick" way of reviewing - what is 3 hours of tape! - in a easy and non-head banging editable project.

You're all too good!

Grazie

I agree with the "trouble" discussion, although I would term it a bit differently: What Obstacles Are Overcome?

Editorial decisions on this kind of project are almost infinite. You can quickly become paralyzed by the number of decisions to be made. So, some simple questions to help you frame your thoughts:

What's the story about? (e.g., "How a low-budget community event came off despite lack of dollars, inexperienced organizers, city council antipathy and last-minute cancellations...") Imagine TV Guide writing a capsule description of your piece. What would it say?

Who is (are) the central characters? (Organizers, particular musicians, individuals in the crowd....)

What are the range of opinions about the event? (Is a neighbor cheesed off about the noise and parking? Is there someone who does nothing but dance wildly throughout the event? A merchant who sold out in the first 10 minutes? Someone else who's been there all day and not made a dime?)

One of the things Les Blank does really well in this kind of thing is to develop subplots and then sprinkle them liberally throughout the piece. What happened to the little girl who was crying uncontrollably in the first 5 minutes? You can pay it off later on by showing her reunited with her Mom and Dad, eating an ice cream cone. (Corny, I know, but you get the idea).

Try editing together 4 or 5 distinct stories about different people in the crowd, then "shuffling" those stories together. It's sort of like building a series of "cliffhangers" in each story line, jumping to the next storyline to build suspense, then paying off the story later when you get back to it. This will really sustain audience interest.

I would also pick maybe 1 representative song from each musical act and use the music to underscore or counterpoint the stories you're telling.

Go rent some Les Blank films!!!!