I've read several suggestions elsewhere to use boundary mics in this application. As someone who'd never heard of such mics until a few years ago and now finds them quite usefull I'd suggest investigate using them in this role. I can't vouch for their acoustic suitability as I've never tried them in a piano but mechanically they seem attractive.
Depending on the role and value of the piano you can screw them in and wire an XLR socket (or two) into the body of the piano.
Hm, would it then be an upright acoustic electric piano?

Bob.

In my alternate life, I was a live concert audio engineer for 30 years. One of my acts had a Yamaha upright piano and I never used a mic on it. I used one of these instead:

http://www.helpinstill.com/

It worked GREAT! As far as I'm concerned, it's the only way to "mic" a piano. When you go to the link above, be sure to read the article, "Why Is It So Hard To Mic A Piano?"

John

I'm as organic as this digital life allows me to be, and up till now I've preferred to record pianos through mics placed a little way away from the piano -to capture the piano's sound through a certain amount of air. I have three Rode NT1/NT1A's and they pick up a very wide and warm frequency range.

Mic positions and sounds can now be amazingly well reproduced digitally, but there's still something about the original analogue sound. ( I still love my 1975 Fender Super Reverb Gitarrrrr Amp.)

... there's still something about the original analogue sound.

Peter, there's a recording engineer I've worked with here in Miami that feels the same way you do (he's a musician, too). He's downright passionate about it. He says, "There's something about musical instruments moving sound waves through the air that simply can't be duplicated electronically" or words to that effect.

Well hang on here, the system that John is talking about isn't digital, it's as analogue as any mic. Basically it's just the same as as the pickups on an electric guitar.

But that's where I start to have a problem with the concept, I'm certain it'll produce a pretty good sound but isn't there one heck of a difference between the sound of an electric guitar and an acoustic one that has a lot to do with the resonance of the wood, isn't that why top shelf grands cost like $100Ks. The rest is just a cast metal frame, strings and hammers. And a piano is about the only musical instrument that goes downhill over time, the wood gets tired and it's time for a new piano. So I'd have to seriously question the assertion that the strings pickup the resonances and nuiances of the wood. Sure for a piano that's just there to belt out something in the midst of stacks of Marshalls then fair enough I guess, you do what has to be done but I think a purist would recoil in horror at the idea of electric pickups on a concert grand.

All of which maybe quite irrelevant as we don't know what jrazz is micing the piano for!

Bob.

Yes, sorry Bob, I wasn't very clear - I am "old fashioned", but still discovering alternatives to the way I've done things before,

In that same direction, I've just bought Komplete 4 to use with Acid 6 Pro, and, apart from an amazing array of natural and synthesised instruments, there are effects packages such as "Guitar Rig", which can be used live or as post FX, and is a virtual effects rack par excellence.

It is for a church. The piano will be used as a regular part of the worship service. It will be used in conjunction with 2 acoustic/electric guitars and 3 vocalists. Currently the piano's acoustic output has been dampened and an attempt to control the sound through the board has been made. We would like to have the ability to mix the piano with the rest of the sound.

Thanks for the suggestions thus far.

j razz

In that case my objections to what John suggested are probebly irrelevant but probably so is the need for that solution.
However a couple of good boundary mics aren't cheap and I'd wager enough electric pickups aren't either. Kind of begs the question of why not invest in a good electric piano then you can go all the way from 0 to 11 in the mix.

Bob.

We have a keyboard, but the sound is different and if the church could justify spending a lot of money on a piano that is already outfitted for that purpose I believe they would, but I don't believe that is in the budget. So, we are trying to figure out the best way to mic a piano to get the best sound possible within a budget of a grand or less (hopefully way less) as that will give us more room to buy a few other things such as new mic's for vocals and possibly some new monitors.

j razz

Years ago, there used to be a PZM mic on sale at Radio Shack for around $40 bucks at the time (around 20 years ago). Maybe they still got this item on sale? You simply could tape it wherever you want according to your preferences / sound.
Good thing about this mic: you have to go loud as hell to make it clip. Bad thing: you'll have to cut a lot on hi-end spectrum of your EQ (mic=big boost in hi's) AND it works with AA batteriy so you'd better get rechargeable ones... (but it lasts for a good while before it dies so it isn't as bad as it seems)

Pic: http://www.uneeda-audio.com/pzm/pzm1.jpg

Sorry, further research (see link...) showed they no longer sell this item, but maybe you could find it on e-bay or something... Or simply (like suggested higher) get the more expensive Crown or Audio-Tech boundary / PZM mic... it's sad they don't sell it anymore cause it was good for the price



link: http://www.gbaudio.co.uk/data/pzm.htm

We have a keyboard, but the sound is different

Today there are many very high class piano patches for MIDI keyboards.

They are a far cry from early attempts, and use much more advanced technology including multi-sampling to get a really nice, natural sound.

Course,

Could you point me in the right direction on that? I am relaying this information to some others and would like to give them all viable options to consider. Thanks.

j razz

Putting some mics inside an upright piano is going to sound anything but natural. Upright pianos are incredibly difficult to mic, particularly in a live sound situation. If they are dead set on using the upright, the Helpenstill for $400 is going to do the trick.

Now, if it were a grand piano, then I'd be suggesting some PZMs or a nice M/S setup. Although, for the ultimate solution to your particular need, I agree with the suggestion of a digital piano. There are some excellent sounding digital pianos out there these days. Of course, the ultimate quality of their sound will depend entirely on the PA system.

John

I agree, I have a Roland RD-700SX that gives me several good pianos, organs, strings, voices, etc. No miking needed, never goes out of tune, full 88 key piano action, on-board effects, etc. Sell the upright and buy one of these or its equivalent for under $2000 new or considerably less used.

Ted