Most people have no idea how long it takes to create the product that you describe. I used to do a few weddings for friends many years ago and I would put many hours into it like you are but then I soon realized that was not what they wanted or expected. They just to see them selves on the TV! Today the YouTube generation expect something short, creative and moving. They may only want a 5 to 10 minute clip set to music. In that case it might only take you 2-3 days to complete. Then you can move on to the next one. Either way you may have to take greater time educating them on the process before you start.
Chris

The newly-married (and their mommies) are going to want the video right away.
That being said, I understand your desire to produce a quality product.

Hire a student for $15/hr to do all the basic cuts. Hire smart and train tough. Give the assistant detailed notes on each successive cut. Then come in and tweak the final cut using your own magic touch. Build the cost of the assistant into your package price and offer a two-week turnaround.

Just a thought.

Four hours of video? I doubt there are many folks who want to sit through that!

Shorten it up quite a bit..... mostly highlights. Create standard templates with Intros, graphics, etc. that you can plug your clips into and modify just the text and music to suit the project. Using these techniques you can still produce a unique "custom tailored" product but you will not be reinventing the wheel with each new job.

These templates could be previous vegs of weddings you have delivered.

Most people will be more impressed with the quality and presentation.... not the quantity.

I have 2 times made an edited version of 45 min. or so and then burned 1-3 DVD's with the whole footage unedited. One was a wedding and the other a 40 years birthday.

/Ulf

Hey everyone, thanks for the insight.
Yes that's my thought exactly... we live in such an instant gratification society now that the thought that someone has to wait for something is unheard of....

I've thought about the hiring a student, but I'm sure I'll be losing more time showing them the ropes than what it's worth. Also the fact of increasing my prices to accommodate this when people want a deal every time you turn around I simply can't afford this. I know I will have to make this step at some point if I want to remain in the wedding industry, either that or don't give as much.
Which brings me to your point bsuratt. I have tried to cut things down. Everything but the actual ceremony and reception speeches is edited like music videos. So you aren't just sitting there watching boring footage. It's all details of people and details of the day.
The times that I have cut things down considerably, I've heard back from the clients of ... where's this and wheres that? Didn't you get this, and I'm surprised that wasn't in it. So, I figured I be real picky of what shots I put in but not cut content.
I've always got a really good response once people have their videos, It's just the impatient brides that think they are still princess of the day long after their day has come. Let's put it this way.... max there is 4 hours for a full day wedding.
I put in quality as well as quantity.
I just basically want to know if I am suppose to be feeling bad that it's taking this long for the quality and quantity that I do?
Thanks again everyone.

as well maybe I don't understand how I can make a template of something like a wedding that changes with each wedding.
In a way I do have "process" that I stick with, as well as similar detail shots. I've even gone as far as stock piling some detail shots of churches and what not of places that I frequently shoot at.
But as far as a template I can just sub in new footage. I can't see how this can be done. If you have further insight, please enlighten me.
Thanks again.

I've done maybe two weddings in my life. All I did was stick together a 3 minute promo and put that as one title. Then I did a sort of lightly edited raw footage disc where trimmed the beginnings and endings of clips a little, deleted those that were total garbage, and ran Ultimate-S on the timeline to give the timeline an automated second or so overlap transition on all the raw footage. The people were thrilled and it didn't take that long.

I do the same thing with special events. I edit a three minute promo, then a raw footage disc with an Ultimate-S automated standard cross-fade between clips and maybe a bit of driving music in the background. Usually that is all people need or want. Why sell a person a steak when all they want is a cheesburger. As a videographer you're calling card is the short promo. The longer stuff is just for the bride and the mother, and then they're going to have it mostly in the background as they talk to each other.

Then again, I avoid this kind of thing as much as possible so what do I know.

Although having never seen your work I would assume that you have, at a minimum, opening titles and graphics for each segment, closing titles, credit roll, etc. These sort of things can take huge amounts of time and can be made reusable. Disk authoring, graphics, etc and titles templates can be created where you can just change the text and add or delete anything necessary.

If I create a video from the ground up I can easily spend as much time on text and graphics elements and disk authoring as actual editing!

Suggest you sit down and watch one of your earlier (6+ mos ago) videos all the way through. I often do this and you would be amazed and how much you will learn from a fresh look at your own product.

"quality + quantity..." If you can't deliver timely, one of those has to go! I'd keep quality!

I agree....
I guess I would have to say I am too much of a perfectionist.
Every now and again look at the older stuff and yes I quite agree. I would try and use every clip I took that was usable. I felt I was cheating the clients out of content if I didn't.
In my more recent years especially most recently, if I have 3 or 4 different shots of the same thing. I pick the best one and move on.
Where I would have taken 10 minutes to show you all the details I do it in 4 or 5. So I am improving but I know I can tighten up more.
I do use templates for disc art and cover art. However each wedding I use details of the bride's dress or flowers or their rings etc to keep it personalized.
I have a folder setup that contains all the folders I need to keep things organized, I just change the name and get started.
I need to tighten up more......grrr.
Here's my demos if you are interested. These are made for the client to show their friends and family. I don't expect that new clients watch all of the video but it's there if they want.

http://www.dejaviewstudios.com/deja_View_wedding_video_demos.html

Some friends of mine had a videographer that gave them the low resolution, raw footage with time code. He asked them to pick the stuff they did and/or did not want.

I think he did this so that newlyweds could take their own sweet time to choose. If they took weeks or months to choose they would be less inclined to complain about time!

Then he would drop all the clips into a template of some sort.

I think they said it took six months before they had their video! Mostly because they couldn't decide what they wanted.

This also prevented them from complaining about who and/or what was/wasn't in the video. Clever!

Hello L8R. . .
how long is your contract? You do have a contract, don't you?
If you get the client to agree what they'll get before you start, then perhaps you'll cut down on the anxiety you have about what you give them... and how much it costs... give them a 45 minute basic price (or whatever you decide) and then add additional costs for additional work. . .
* * *
Look for a few Vegas tutorials online or forum discussions here centered on slugs ... a method whereby you insert place-holders for video scenes ... then with each new project, you replace the slug with the video from that wedding. . . in essence, you can use the same music and the same template over and over again; you only replace the slugs with the video you select for that client and change the bit of text pertaining to that client... your promo and closing credits might remain the same all year... if the chances are good that clients might know each other, then change the music, but the length of each music segment will remain the same... so that cuts down on the time you need... (you do have a music editor that will cut the music to the length of time you need, don't you? perhaps Sonicfire Pro or some similar program - find some way to automate the length of the music to keep you from anguishing and languishing over it)...

You are doing well. . . under a month is exceptional...
By the way, don't be afraid to raise your prices as your schedule fills... it has to be worth the time to continue to work on other clients as the wedding season progresses. . . make the price keep your interest and attention... and as you raise your prices, the assistant plan might look a little more enticing... (you don't have to teach your assistant everything you know, only what you want him/her to do) . . . (wink)

Just a few thoughts from the peanut gallery ... well, cashews. . . (grin)

Until that time... Earl J.

I think the most important suggestion in this thread comes from musicvid:

"Hire a student for $15/hr to do all the basic cuts. Hire smart and train tough. Give the assistant detailed notes on each successive cut. Then come in and tweak the final cut using your own magic touch. Build the cost of the assistant into your package price and offer a two-week turnaround."

Almost all weddings follow the same format, with special features depending on the religious persuasion: bride gets ready for wedding; groom sees bride for first time; groom and groomsmen come into to sanctuary, bride and father come down aisle; ceremony -- I do, I do -- reception, etc.

I think one thing videographers lose sight of is the fact that brides rarely compare wedding videos. You don't have to be original with each wedding. The idea of a template may offend your artistic sensibilities, but once we've seen one bride hoofing it down the aisle we've pretty well seen all of them. The story line's the same from one wedding to the next. Put the artistry into your camera work (i.e., shoot for the edit) and the edit will take care of itself.

No matter how creative you are and want to be, there's no profit in doing grunt work. Laboring over repetitive work takes you away from your business -- marketing, networking, etc. A well trained assistant can rough cut, with you coming in for a couple of hours to give it your special touch.

Just a suggestion from someone who burned out on weddings after 5 years of shooting them.

Jack

The wedding videos around here are pre-canned. Customer picks a theme, then cameraman takes the customary shots for that theme, slice and dice, done deal.

The customers don't know good from bad and don't appreciate it anyway so why bother?

The customers don't know good from bad and don't appreciate it anyway so why bother?

Maybe because some of us work to a higher standard than the basic "get it out as fast as possible" guys.

Mike

Watched you Paola Di Lalla wedding promo. Very nice work!

In fact, if you just took the promo, replaced the ceremony clips with the full ceremony and then added live audio in the reception clips you would have a very nice and well done wedding video. Give/sell them the raw video lightly edited on DVD and you've got a wrap!

If you push much more than one hour on the video, no matter how good it is, people will become disinterested, and if they do they will have a negative view of it.

"The customers don't know good from bad and don't appreciate it anyway so why bother?"

You're actually encouraging substandard work? I find that incredibly offensive.

I didn't get into this business because I like dealing with unruly brides and to slap together wedding videos.
I do the work because I love to create and love the challenge that each wedding throws at me.
If the area you are is nothing but "theme packs" I'm glad I don't live around there. I would not put my name on something like that.

I don't do skits, I don't make my couples do anything that wasn't already going to happen.
I agree that I need to tighten up quite a bit and again really scrutinize my work. Somewhere a happy medium between my highlight videos and their final video, but I would never stoop as low as throwing out a chop shop video.

L8R,

I spend up to around 4 months on a wedding video if they choose one of my top two packages. I usually spend about 48-72 hours getting the cuts, titles and layout down to tell the story. I then render it. I then sit on it for a while. A few weeks or so and then I watch it. I correct things I "settled" for in the original. I may add something I originally left out or take out some things I had left in that were borderlline. Basically I tighten it up and make it better. I may change some color correction after watching it on TVs (plural). I then sit on it some more. I repeat this process one more time and then go to work on the menus for the DVD or BluRay disc and the disc print and insert. I then call the client and tell them their wedding is ready and I will send it to them. Of course, during that time I will shoot an email their way to let them know where I am in the process and sometimes I will send them a link to a clip as a foretaste.

Before I even get to what I wrote above, I feel out my clients and am really selective. I want to make sure I can please my customer. If I don't think I can after meeting with them, I tell them as much and I give them the name of some other videogrpahers in the area. I would much rather refer someone to another than deal with a headache from a client I knew on the front end was going to be difficult.

In addition, each wedding is different. I try to shape my video to my client. I have never produced a prepackaged wedding and I hope that if I ever do each and every one of you would call me out on it. Not that there is anything wrong with quantity, but a wedding should be quality. Not only should it be quality, it should be exactly what the bride and groom are expecting and as a professional you should be able to get a good idea of exactly what that is.

Now, does this mean you need the latest and greatest? No, but you should be able to use what you have well and continue to grow in your skillset. What I am trying to say is, each wedding you do should be better than the last one you did.

My 2 cents.

j razz

I do a lot of weddings. I try and get the final product to them within a couple of months. But during a heavy season, it could be twice that long. You'll see averages of all videographers being between 3-6 months. I know one guy in L.A. that got so far behind that his delivery time was 16 months. Yikes.

But the best thing you can do is be honest with your clients. If you really think it's going to take a certain length of time, TELL them that upfront, before they sign a contract.

A few bad reviews will damage your company. Next to putting out a good video, customer service is key.

You're actually encouraging substandard work? I find that incredibly offensive.

I agree, I for one always try to get the best out of any task I do.

And welcome back John.

I didn't read your whole post. Why on earth are you including so much into the final product? TWO HOURS OF PRE-CERMONY??! WTF?

I strive to keep all my wedding videos to 90 minutes or less.

Hey yes welcome back John....

Thanks guys for your help. Jrazz, I am with you with the amount of work I put into mine... however I try and do all that within the 3 week frame.
I took classical animation in college and am no stranger to going over everything frame by frame, cut by cut... making sure every clip is smooth and clean and flows well with the others. This is why I chose this profession, to be able to continue that into work I can be proud of. That was the very thing that made me hate the animation.... pump it out... pump it out.... who cares...
The one big mistake I made in previous years that I have corrected this year was to offer a complimentary preview disc.
I thought cool.... I can buy some time and work on the next one while they're watching the preview.
Nope it ended up killing me and pushing me way behind, bottle necking my computers. I won't do that again.

Again, thank you to all who have answered. The styles and procedures are as eclectic as everyone's personalities on this forum.
I totally agree that you really have to pick your brides and I try to be mindful of that but some times the odd one sneaks through that shocks the hell out of you once the money is exchanged.

I'm really going to try and tighten things up and give them the wow factor by not how much detail I got but how I put it across to them.