PAN/CROP: Smoothing Shift from Zoom-In to Pan-Zoom On Same Footage?

Soniclight-2.0 wrote on 3/18/2017, 2:54 PM

(First, problems migrating, so I'm a 10+ years Vegas forum member formerly known as "Soniclight" - Philip Knight - for those who know me. Hence sneaky addition to this temp account of "2.0" in username.)

System: Win7 64-bit. Sony VP is version 10.e*
(* No upgrade for not critical, and can't afford it anyway.
So hopefully I'm not "obsolete" here due to not having 14.x.)


For simplicity's sake, let's assume my project is 16:9 and I'm crop-panning in on a horizontal 16:9 box with flowers in it set on a wooden table; the table's field or as-background takes up about 20% of the total scene.

A) First keyframe is full frame showing the above.
B) Second is aimed at the center of the box on the featured flower at middle of it, zoomed in showing 75% of the box.
C) Third and last keyframe is pan to the left or right to go and focus on another flower (still also zooming in, but far slower).

I've tried every conceivable combination of Slow, Smooth, Fast, Linear, etc. keyframes. The second keyframe still is abrupt, not smooth. Eventually I "cheated" by using a velocity envelope to slow around this keyframe to give a semblance of smoothness. But as we all know, velocity curves change things and require down-event/clip compensation. In short, it's feasible, but tricky.

Any suggestions to pull this off -- without having to resort to velocity envelopes?
Consider my hypothetical scene with 3 keyframes as actual example and let me know what you would do.

Thank you.

~ Philip
 

Comments

Former user wrote on 3/18/2017, 4:11 PM

I don't know if you have tried this yet, but you probably have. You can play with these numbers as well to smooth movements.

Soniclight-2.0 wrote on 3/18/2017, 5:46 PM

@david-tu -- Appreciate reply. I vaguely remember someone mentioning this to me here a few years ago. I purposely default preferences for Pan/Crop at 100%. Maybe I'm incorrectly assuming that means what it implies (the smoothest). So let me ask you this:

---- What do lower numbers (incl. to 0) settings do to a keyframe's behavior in comparison to higher ones (inc. to 100)?

---- And for this particular simple 3-keyframe example, what numbers would you use?

Keyframe 1 @ ?% - Type of keyframe = ?
Keyframe 1 @ ?% - Type of keyframe = ?
Keyframe 1 @ ?% - Type of keyframe = ?

---- I tend to use Linear mostly. Should there be some mix-and-match here that would also help?

Thanks.

Former user wrote on 3/18/2017, 6:58 PM

Those numbers affect all modes of linear and smooth. Generally they adjust the speed up and slow down at the beginning and ending of moves. Honestly, you have to play with them to see the effect since it varies based on the other settings. Linear attempts to give you a hard stop and start where smooth tries to ramp up and down.

Former user wrote on 3/18/2017, 7:16 PM

The first is all linear at 100, the second is all smooth at 100 and the third is all linear at 0. I think the first works best, but I don't know if this is the movement you are going for.

monoparadox wrote on 3/18/2017, 9:55 PM

You might look at the "Tweener" effect in Vegasaur http://vegasaur.com/tweener

--tom

Soniclight-2.0 wrote on 3/19/2017, 2:38 AM

The first is all linear at 100, the second is all smooth at 100 and the third is all linear at 0. I think the first works best, but I don't know if this is the movement you are going for.

Thanks for what seems to be the time you took to do this. And I agree - the first one is the smoothest. The nit-picky part of me wants to have a kind of "beauty pass" no stop affect. Probably only possible in Adobe AE. Which I have (CS3) but have essentially never really used since I'm Vegas-addicted. :) Anyway, I can fiddle around with the smoothness numbers, see what happens. NRN.

Soniclight-2.0 wrote on 3/19/2017, 2:53 AM

You might look at the "Tweener" effect in Vegasaur http://vegasaur.com/tweener

--tom

Thanks for suggestion - I checked it out and definitely has some cool features I saw in the demo video. But as some of the Vegas veterans here know, I live on a fixed Soc. Sec. disability income only, am a "serious amateur/semi-pro" - not a pro - and so out of my wallet zipcode. One has to get the entire Vegasaur to get this fx. Been aware of Vegasaur for a long time - but wallet outweighs need for cool stuff (like this fx) - lol.

Former user wrote on 3/19/2017, 9:02 AM

It seems to me that there used to be a PATH line in pan/crop (maybe version 4) that you could use bezier curves on. It just disappeared one version and I am not sure why.

Soniclight-2.0 wrote on 3/19/2017, 1:21 PM

I started with v.6, so if there was... I missed it. :)
I know one veteran here who seems to have connection with Magix, maybe we could hustle them to put it back in. Or as a downloadable script or such. Retro-adaptable to, oh, say version 10. (Yeah, dream on, dude.)

JackW wrote on 3/19/2017, 2:26 PM

The PATH feature was extremely useful. I never could understand why it was dropped. This has been an interesting discussion. Thanks.

TheHappyFriar wrote on 3/20/2017, 8:47 AM

The path feature just showed the path, never modifiable. I miss it & remember being told years ago it was unintentionally removed in Vegas 5 (along with some other features!) and would come back (other features removed, like the track motion presets, came back).

In the Vegas help file, search for "keyframe", click the "keyframe animation" listing, scroll down to the "Change the interpolation curve between keyframes" and expand it. It will show the curve each keyframe uses.

The speed is changed by spacing the keyframes closer (faster) or farther (slower) apart. The curve type you use on the keyframe also changes between that keyframe & the next keyframe. That's important to remember. The curves affect the speed somewhat, but not as much as the distance between the keyframes (also remember, the higher the FPS the more frames you need between them to make it slower)

Using more keyframes may be what you want.

Former user wrote on 3/20/2017, 9:07 AM

I was thinking you could modify the path, but memory might be flawed. I did think it was a useful visual indication making it easier to adjust your positioning.

Soniclight-2.0 wrote on 3/20/2017, 11:41 AM

Thanks for responses.

I'll look into the Help suggestion. For now my sneaky velocity curve workaround did a fairly good job. This video is not for a pro production or pay, so tiny things like that probably wouldn't even be noticed by the viewer... I can tend to over-perfectionist stuff at times. But it is also a craft pride thing.

(On an OT: "TheHappyFriar" - aha, recognize your name - you're one of the veterans of the board. I've been gone from the board for some time. I wonder how many of those are still around - Farss/Bob, John Meyer, Musicvid, etc. I know, I can just do a search by username. I used to call you guys "the Yodas" of the forum which I once referred to as being my "Vegas University." I've earned so much from you all. So no answer needed, just musing.)