Tried that (it's the default setting), that's why it doesn't make sense especially at the "supposed" quality (16 bit@48khz). My source sounds fine (mono avi file with no compression). The only thing I can think of is that the codec is doing some phase cancelation because of the mono source file?????

I've experimented with many settings combinations of QDesign music 2, and I'm quite happy with what I'm using now. The trick is not getting (sampling frequency) khz & (data rate) kb/s mixed up. They are different.

Unless you've purchase the Pro upgrade for $300, QDesign Music2 codec in Quicktime pro caps you at 48kb/sec PERIOD. With this limitation, some sacrafice needs to be made. I chose to stream in mono, because, then I can concentrate all the 48 kb/sec on one GOOD channel of sound, rather than splitting it up to 2 nearly identical poorly compressed channels. To me, sound quality was more important that sound separation.

Next, and this has more to do with your content. You can use 22khz or 44khz. I found that 22khz sounded better, because.....well hell I don't know why, it just does. Not so much of that MP3 tinny warbling sound. The kind that you hear when you use the channel converter to do vocal cancellation.

If you have broadband (modem would take to long). I use that codec for all my streaming -- I think it blow WMP compression away.

http://www.reelondvd.com/Streaming%20Media.htm
(Choose the Aviddiva clips)

Jeffy82@aol.com

Thanks so much for the information. I checked out some of the clips on your website and the audio sounded quite good. Nice stuff.

After trying many combinations of settings, my audio still has that damn audio phasing or cancelation effect. It's very annoying. Like I mentioned earlier, I'm just starting with a avi uncompressed mono file and trying to get it to compress and sound good at any sample rate or bit rate. I've tried 22, 44 and 48khz. It's very weird. Now, the only thing I can think of is that my audio (water fall sound) is so rich in range that perhaps that's it....maybe.

If you or anyone else can recommend another audio quicktime codec that would be next in line for quality, let me know.

Thanks again

a waterfall is essentially white noise (or is it brown?) which could certainly be revealing the weaknesses of the compression algorithm. just like video noise doesn't compress well, audio noise won't compress well either.

if you had narration going over it or a music bed, it would probably sound better. but noise alone will just tweak out the compressor and uncover some of its deep dark secrets. ;)

Well as an experiment, I recorded 30 seconds of stereo music (with lots of dynamic range and response) and tried to render it using the QDesign codec-----guess what, no matter what setting, you can hear the phasing/cancellation effect as it "combs" through certain frequencies.

Using other QT audio codecs like IMA 4.1 and Alaw 2.1 you can get much better results for Quicktime sound that demands full fidelity or audio with alot of spectrum.

Conclusion: The poor performance of the QDesign codec really shows up on music. This is probably due to the fact the QDesign codec included in Vegas is the "Basic" edition which doesn't have the professional fine controls.

Reference: http://www.qdesign.com/products/about_products/qdmc.htm

> If you or anyone else can recommend another audio quicktime codec

Well, you can have MP3 sound into your Quicktime file. But you have to encode the MP3 file with an extry step. Export your video to Quicktime and your Audio to MP3. Then replace the audio track of your Quicktime video with the MP3 file.

Marco

Mixer 440,

I don't mean to be overly critical, but....you're doing something wrong. I believe QDesign2 is probably the best codec Quicktime offers for sound without having to go to extremely high bitrates or uncompressed. I'm sorry, but I cannot see how you are getting such bad sound performance out of this codec. And I DO mean the Basic version.

Here, check out a clip I put together to show my point. I found the clip in some dumpster, so I don't know anything about it. I did sweeten the audio for a fuller sound than the clip provided. You'll understand.

http://www.reelondvd.com/WaterSounds.htm

(You may need to pause it to let it load completely)

I provide screenshot of the audio settings under the video clip.

I'm using the BASIC Q DESIGN MUSIC 2 at 22khz and 48kbit/sec MONO (by the way, 48kbit is NOT Quicktime's or QDesign's default) I believe the Quicktime/QDesign's DEFAULT IS 24kb/s), -- This is probably your problem. If that's not the problem, is your audio source clipping or is is to quiet? What application are you using?

Jeffy82@aol.com

It's fine to be over critical, and I'll be the first to admit I'm making a mistake when I figure it out. Plus, I appreciate your persistence.

Well after visiting your link, the first thing I noticed was that indeed the audio did sound good----very good, and just what it should be for the codec you used.

But, then I saw that you're using the QT Pro movie player to export the QT sound (from the screen shots). I'm using the rendering custom options within Vegas Video 3c. It's not much different since it's using the same codec, but the options are somewhat different. Indeed, I'm selecting similar settings (48kbs,22.050 khz, 16bit, mono) but no matter what setting I get the phasing/flange/comb effect using Vegas. However, using QT Pro it's just fine and darn good. Now that's really weird.

If you have time, check out the audio on my link: http://www.xmission.com/~mbmiles/lavarun1.mov (BTW the audio is that way either playing local, stream or download)

I'm going to keep fiddling with this issue and find out the problem, which must be in Vegas or something I'm doing.

Mike,

Ok, I just played your video, and I hear it too. I can see why. It's encoded as stereo instead of mono and it's at 44khz instead of 22khz.

Yes, I do have quicktime 5.02 pro, send me an email at jeffy82@aol.com and I can help you with that.

I don't think that should make a difference, though I may be wrong. I actually did that video with Soundforge. It was the easiest way to get DIVX into the Clip -- Since their SF Video Editing Program can't seem to handle divx.


So you're saying that when you:
Goto File, render as, Choose an MOV,
Do you not have a "Custom" Button? (or is that only in QTPro?) Click Custom Button.
Then, Click Audio Tab at bottom,
then in the format box: Set to QDesign 2.
Is there a Sample Rate? Set to 22,050
Is there a Channels Box? Set to "MONO"
Is there a Bit-depth? Set to 16
Then ok and save.

If it does require QTpro to convert from Stereo to Mono and from 44khz to 22. Then your other alternative is to make a duplicate of your original, (I don't want you to mess up the original) and then have VV change those 2 thing, and then try to export as an MOV.

Let me know.

Jeffy82@aol.com