posting to Web

Widetrack wrote on 10/12/2008, 10:17 PM
I'm trying to put four 1-minute clips onto a website to promote a product and I'm pretty much lost at sea.

I've been all over the web including this usually oracular forum, but every time an answer seems about to come, it takes a left turn and I end up stumped.

A couple of years ago, I put up a few mpeg-1 clips as progressive-download Quicktime, and they pretty much did the job.

But now I'm trying to use the new smaller/better new formats of MP4 and Flash, but I feel like Rocky after the big fight.

E.G., my old MPEG 1s were 30 seconds each and about 1.5MG. I tried new 60-sec MP4s, at low specs (320 x 240; 29.97 progressive, AAC audio) and they came out between 5 and 7 MB--significantly more than twice the size, and clearly way too big to work.

I burnt one of the new ones again as MPEG 1, about the same specs if not even crappier quality and it came out at 404.37MB!!!

I've tried to figure out Flash, but the 2 converters I downloaded (FLv Encoder and RIVA, were unworkable. RIVA has a GUI with no text but just a few blank rectangles. couldn't do anything with it. FLV doesn't see the mp4s i burned from Vegas, only WAVs and MOVs. does this mean I have to spring for the $600 price tag on Adobe flash, jus tot upload 4 measley promos?

In all the posts etc I've read about how to make Flash videos, I can't reconcile the difference or relationship between the FLV file and the "player" or SWF file. It seems you have to have both on the website, but where you put them and with what HTML, I can't figure. Damn. I had a gig in the 90s posting audio to the web when this stuff was brand new and understandably hellish, but it seems worse now.

Can anyone direct me to a complete, coherent discussion of how I can do this ought to be no-brainer? Or even better, anyone want to make me an offer to do the job while I get some sleep or at least provide some consulting to walk me thru it?

As usual, thanks to anyone with any help.

Comments

John_Cline wrote on 10/12/2008, 11:02 PM
For a file of a given time, the final filesize is determined EXCLUSIVELY by the bitrate.
JackW wrote on 10/13/2008, 12:31 PM
Have you tried "embedded video viewer" on Google? I used this and similar search criteria a couple of years ago to find a Java app that embedded a viewer on a web page.

One of our clients put a promo we shot for him on his web site at http://www.stmaryangler.com/ Look at the page source to see how his web master embedded the flash player. Might prove helpful for what you're trying to do.

Jack
TheHappyFriar wrote on 10/13/2008, 1:01 PM
don't use flash or mp4. :) Use quicktime (mov) or windows media (wmv). All comptuers play those w/o the need for ANY downloads (except Windows requires a quicktime install, but all mac's & linux installs come with a quicktime codec installed pretty much. All windows & linux installs comes with a wmv codec. Not sure about mac).

Sad to say, but the "oldie but goodie" rule applies here!
Widetrack wrote on 10/13/2008, 1:09 PM
Thank you.

this sounds absolutely like the answer!

You're saying that Wmv does a "progressive download" thing like QT?

If so, is there a setting for that in the Vegas Render window?
TheHappyFriar wrote on 10/13/2008, 1:37 PM
i don't know if the vegas encodes does this, but Ms has a free WMV encoder on their site. Use that one.

Another thing to note: you don't NEED it to be progressive for a viewer to view it progressively downloaded. If it's loaded up in a media player it does a progressive download regardless if the video is encoded any special way.
Widetrack wrote on 10/13/2008, 6:39 PM
THF:

What do you mean by:
"If it's loaded up in a media player"?

The only way I know to embed a video or audio file is to use the standard "HREF" code.
Chienworks wrote on 10/13/2008, 6:55 PM
Way way way back in the dark ages of the 20th century, web browsers would download the entire file to the local hard drive, then launch the media player to show it. This annoyed a lot of people because the download time was often a substantial fraction of infinite. So, special web server streaming plugins were developed that would bypass the standard browser download and start playing the file as soon as a small bit of it had downloaded, in the hopes that the next bit would download before the first bit was done playing.

Modern web servers and browsers are smart enough to do all this by default even when using the plain ol' href= syntax.
Widetrack wrote on 10/13/2008, 7:44 PM
ChienWorks:

it's good to hear that someone remembers those dark days endured be geezers like me. I even recall when Apple (!) first came out with their progressive download for QT.

But I finally had to take a break to pull all the arrows out and took a couple months off.

And now, you're telling me that here, in this new enlightened century, many or all of the video formats will behave this way?

Boy Howdy.

And some people don't believe in progress.
Cliff Etzel wrote on 10/13/2008, 7:55 PM
THF - I have to disagree with your advice about NOT using MP4 or FLV.

First off - I've written a detailed how to on using MP4's with the FLV player here. It pretty much makes either format available online via one player embedded in a web page.

Secondly, IMO, WMV and quicktime are archaic 20th century media formats - why is it Flash dominates as the single most pervasive media format on the net - and the new F4V format is looking to become even more promenent in the near future - with as high as 98% install base? That's higher than any other media format. In addition, one can utilize Adobe Media Player and watch FLV's natively via local playback if you make the FLV available to download. So given this trend, there's no compelling reason to use anything BUT FLV or MP4. I haven't done either WMV or QT in at least 2 years for the web.

I'd say the oldies are not necessarily the goodies in this 21st century age of web 2.0 (and beyond) multimedia content.

Cliff Etzel - Solo Video Journalist
bluprojekt | solo video journalism blog
Widetrack wrote on 10/13/2008, 8:33 PM
Cliff:

Read your tutorial. It's about the clearest I've seen, and it's annoying that none of my googling found it.

started downloading as you suggest.

About the Air thing:

1. Is it the SDK that i'm supposed to download?
2. how are Air and the QTIndexSwapper related? Air is not apparently an app, so what do I do with it? and wht does it mean to QTIndexSwapper?

thanx.
Cliff Etzel wrote on 10/13/2008, 9:44 PM
Download AIR from Adobe's link on their home page - AIR is a framework for other apps to tie into.

QTIndexSwapper is an app that ties directly into the AIR application framework - it moves a reference snippet of code in the MP4 file from the end to the beginning so that it can play as a progressive mp4 via the FLV player.

HTH,

Cliff Etzel - Solo Video Journalist
bluprojekt | solo video journalism blog