Q: Best Films/Shorts Shot in SD MiniDV You Know?

Soniclight wrote on 8/24/2007, 11:39 PM
Please read whole post before listing work since I'm seeking certain types of examples, and not others. Thanks :)

1, Purpose of Question

As some you you here know, I will be spending a small windfall I got on getting a prosumer, not pro cam. Just can't afford the latter.

From all the advice I got in past QTs I put up, I've go to decide between getting an HDV and have less money left over for other gear (i.e. upgrading to Vegas Pro 8 when it comes out in September), or get a good 3CCD SD and have more booty left to invest in other gear.

Currently leaning towards SD and I can wait a bit, so I will. I.e. after September product releases. So, let's sidestep the cam models, specs and so on and just stick to genre or style.

2. Genre or Style of Examples Sought

As a reference point of what work you know of that was shot in SD MiniDV:

-- My film project is part love story, part fantasy with light and other effects (i.e. using particleillusion3, overflights of the Earth and landscapes using NASA WorldWind and Celestia. (Visit my homepage and you'll get a sense of my visual style, albeit in somewhat over-saturated still artwork)

So I'm wanting to make an "independent" film, most likely a short. Therefore looking for film-like work, not sports, underwater (sorry Nick :) or corporate presentations. I.e. possibly Sundance or other film contest entries that you know of.

Sure, most films are still shot on celluloid. But I'm hoping there are some good SD examples, too.

And of so, I'd like to know of ones that have night and low-light interior scenes.

This since the central premise/scene around which all the more elaborate effects and scenes will be woven is an intimate one that will most likely to be shot indoors.

(Farss calls my style "moody, sensual, dark." Well, I wouldn't quite use darj for it's certainly not a downer or noir. But it does have a certain ethereal, intimate and dramatic feel to it.)

And preferably work that could view online, even if but trailers. If not and if worth it, I'll rent it/them.

Thanks.


Comments

GregFlowers wrote on 8/25/2007, 10:33 AM
In my opinion, I would go HDV over SD DV. The main reason is I say that is because your final product ideally will be viewed on a large movie screen and that extra resolution really makes a difference. If it was destined just for normal SD DVD then I would say it doesn't matter as much. It also sounds like your project will require a lot of compositing and HDV via intermediary like Cineform will hold up better than SD DV in most cases.

I have owned a VX2000 and FX1. The VX2000 was a good 3 chip dv camera and the FX1 is a good HDV camera. Digitally projected on an 8 foot screen, the FX1 blows the VX2000 away. The differences in low light performance were not that great. Furthermore, since you will have control of the lighting it sounds like, light those indoor scenes in a way that sets the mood, but supplies adequate light. Dark, moody scenes are more about lighting it correctly than not having much light at all.

What range of budget are you looking at? $1000, $2000, $3000? I would be cautious making judgements about SD DV quality based on other people's work simply because you don't know what kind and quality of lighting used, any 35mm adaptors, etc. Good 3 chip SD DV cameras like the Panasonic DVX100 series or Canon XL2 will cost as much as decent 3 chip HDV cameras.

So, IMO I would go HDV for the increased resolution needed for a large screen and light properly around its weaknesses. Examples of theatrical releases shot on SD DV include 28 Days Later, Open Water, and Pieces of April.
Jay Gladwell wrote on 8/25/2007, 11:23 AM

Most recent I'm aware of is Iraq in Fragments. It was shot with Panasonic DVX-100 and DVX-100A cameras, using 24p advanced pulldown mode, letter-boxed. Looks great!

Too, it won the "Best Cinematography" award at the Sundance Film Festival. Imagine that! And it wasn't shot in HD...


p@mast3rs wrote on 8/25/2007, 11:40 AM
still railing against HD are we Jay?
Soniclight wrote on 8/25/2007, 1:17 PM
GregFlowers,

At the most, I could afford and FX7 on the Sony side in terms of that series. 1/4" chips vs. 1/3" of FX1. My budget is $1500-2500 (absolute max). I cringe at letting go of $2500 frankly.

And, yes, I noticed that good SDs cost about the same as a mid-level HD now .Ideally, looking for a mint condition second hand in either case, price wise (mint meaning bought but not use over a few hours, anything else is a risk).

So still in conundrum.

As to how people shoot and light their scenes, good point.

Jay,

Thanks for film referral and I'll go look it up. It's probably going to be hard to find what I'm looking for in terms of low-light and night scenes, interiors, etc..

------------------------

So allow me to revise this Q a bit

Maybe I'm on a fool's errand with this thread's question, but welcome more input. INCLUDING forum memeber clips, even brief excerpts.

It's far more about seeing well shot lower-light scenes than whether something has been entered in any festival.
GregFlowers wrote on 8/25/2007, 2:16 PM
The FX1 will be better than the FX7 in low light. You may consider the Canon HV20 HDV camera. It has been getting raves and has a large user base for support. It has a single 1/2.7 inch CMOS sensor and comes in about $1000. It also has a 24p mode that significantly improves its low light performance and may yield a look that meets your needs.

If you would like to see what FX1 footage looks like in very low light, I have video shot inside of Carlsbad Caverns with only the available light. It may be close to what you are looking for. It was shot at 1/30th shutter speed so the low light performance was increased at the expense of halving the resolution. The gain was maxed out so it should give you a very good idea of what to expect at worst. You could play around with Levels, Curves, and Mike Crash's free Dynamic Noise Reduction plugin to see what you could do to clean it up some.

PM me if you interested and we'll find a way to get you some clips to examine and play with.
Jessariah67 wrote on 8/25/2007, 2:57 PM
To plug a little reality into this equation, it is more than likely that any film shot on a prosumer camera is not likely to be consumed largely "on the big screen." That said, I shot a feature on a GL2 and it blew up fine for screenings (digital projection - not blown up to 35mm). You can get a sweet picture out of a Canon XL2 in 24P, and it is arguably a more "filmic" look than some of the ultra-sharp pieces I've seen shot on prosumer HDV.

Especially if this project turns out to be a short, I would be more concerned about the practice it provides. I would also pay more attention to the glass. With no help from adapters, something like the XL2 is going to give you more play with depth of field in many circumstances.

Best of luck luck with your project.

KH
Coursedesign wrote on 8/25/2007, 3:06 PM
You should be able to get the HV20 for less than $800 currently.

It is indeed a very good camera, favored by even some hardcore pros who understand what they are giving up when they don't use their normal $100,000 cameras with $100,000 lens kits.

Look for example at http://prolost.blogspot.com/2007_06_01_archive.html.

That's Stu Maschwitz who knows as much about making SD&HD video look good as anybody (he's behind the good looks of a lot of Hollywood movies too).

I really recommend you spend $27 on getting his book "The DV Rebel's Guide" (without being fooled by the title). You will be inspired in ways you could not imagine, and I think what you could quickly learn from this easy read could save you a lot of time, money, and hassle.

You'll learn how to get the best quality from low light video too.
Soniclight wrote on 8/25/2007, 4:22 PM
Well, looks like we've sashayed back into models and specs :) That's OK, I'll just learn even more.

GregFlowers,

I'll PM you on your clip.

--------------------------

As to HV-20, I've had plenty of people telling me that it might be the best solution for me (balancing cost yet still get HD). My only concern is the single sensor, so let me put it this way:

--- If you could choose between a 3CCD FX7 or the 1CCD HV-20, which would you get if price was somewhat similar (though it may be hard to find an FX7 for under $20000? This could also refer to any 1/4" 2 CCD HDV vs. single sensor models.

Obviously, more sensor real estate, the better in terms of colors and usually more costly. But deals show up, minor miracles happen, so I just want to learn as much as possible until said time. Lens size and quality is also important.

As to Stu Maschwitz's site, I'm wading through it right now.