Quest for New Camcorder - Revisited!

Grazie wrote on 7/9/2002, 1:15 AM
Sorry to get back onto this, but I wanna new DV Camcorder!

Here are some of my requirements:

1. I've got big hands. Today's humbly priced DVCams have small, "tweezer" operated buttons.
2. Fabulous video colour representation and sharpness.
3. I use a tripod quite a bit soooo a sideloading DVC would be choice.
4. Manual focus
5. Separate mic input and excellent audio handling
6. DV/AV in and out

I really don't need majorly extensive Fx effects as I can now do this within VF.

I've looked at the Panasonic NVMX 300B (now superceded by the NVMX 350). It's got everything I want - Lieca lens and 3CCD - manual focus ring and looking at the reviews is very tempting. It had been billed as a "semi-professional" performer. Anybody had experience of this one? However, having handled this neat "little" beast, the buttons, for me, are very fiddly. Just seen Sony latest release. It's got sweeping curves and bigish buttons. However, this one is a "bottom" feeder tape input - silly in my opinion. But it does look good and is very ergonomic. although it is half the price of the Pannie 300 it does not have the features I need.

I'm going to get some "training" video work shortly and would prefer to upgrade from my Panasonic A/V.

Grazie

Comments

ronaldf wrote on 7/9/2002, 10:44 AM
Maybe it is time to go all the way to a Canon XL-1.
laz111 wrote on 7/10/2002, 5:26 AM
It may be worth having a look at some reviews at PC Adviser, here:
http://pcadviser.co.uk.
Sarasdad wrote on 7/10/2002, 8:04 AM
I use 3 sony digital 8 cameras and they do everything they say they will do.I film ballets, weddings, recitals and general functions.These cameras are somewhat larger than dv cameras,but still compact. The picture quality is great also still pics are
decent especially for internet.I have studied digital cameras and FOR THE PRICE YOU CAN NOT BEAT THEM.Price range $500 to $1000.They work great with VF.I have some pic albums on web with pics from video .imagestation.com sarasdadvideo
laz111 wrote on 7/10/2002, 8:56 AM
Sarasdad, I know what you mean about the older Sony's. I still use my TRV 120E and it's still a good workhorse. Grazie, am I right you're system is PAL? Instead of buying an 'in' and 'out' enabled DVC it would pay to save on the manufacturer's 'hike-up' in it's price and get one with 'in' disabled and then buy a widget to enable it.
Grazie wrote on 7/10/2002, 10:43 AM
Laz - yup! I'm a UK Pally! I think I've read that in a UK VidMag. In your experience/knowledge what has een the typical "hike-up"?

Grazie
aew wrote on 7/10/2002, 4:21 PM
I have the Panasonic MX 350...Great camcorder, great price , great features. I like the fact it's compact and that it takes great still shots.
The function buttons are small but managable, the tape load is unfortunatly bottom feed (you have to take it off the tripod to load...dumb).
HUGE LCD viewer.
The stereo mic is on the top so it picks up omnidirectional noise (operator included). But just get a Sennheiser MKE300 mini shot mic (mono), this of course will add to the total price.
Cannon has the XM1, not too sure about the features.
I'm happy.

Nick
Grazie wrote on 7/10/2002, 6:07 PM
Thanks for that Nick,

I tried the MX350, but I did find the controls a bit teeny for my fingers. yeah and the bottom feeding thing is a bit of drawback.

What's the colour like? The separate mic situation, is that straightforward?

Grazie
Grazie wrote on 7/10/2002, 6:09 PM
Canon XL-1 - I've read up some criticism of the shoulder balance and the fidly focus ring and "twitchy" zoom. What's been your experience?

Grazie
JimClark wrote on 7/11/2002, 12:32 AM
Hey Nick can you tell me if the Panasonic MX350 has analog to digital conversion?
I also am looking at buying a new camera. So far it is either the sony TRV-25 or the TRV-740
Jim Clark
laz111 wrote on 7/12/2002, 4:10 AM
Grazie, it's diffucult to assess the hike-up as there's no immediate price comparison on any particular same model of any manufacturer's camera with 'in' enabled or disabled, but I estimate it can be as much as a couple of hundred squid (or more). Conversely a widget costs about 60 squid. But if you chose to go the widget route it'd be best to check with http://www.datavision.co.uk first.
miketree wrote on 7/12/2002, 4:27 AM
Some camcorders can be programmed to allow dv-in without using a widget. I believe Datavision sell them pre-programmed or can do the job afterwards for a fee. I plan on getting my Sony 130e done sometime soon. I don't know whether any of those models would be suitable for your requirements.
soundguy63 wrote on 7/12/2002, 9:28 AM
Those are valid complaints against the XL-1 with it's standard quasi-manual/servo-focus lenses. There is a fully manual focus professional-style lens with a real zoom control available, but you're talking about a far greater expenditure with that total package.
With alot of work, attention to lighting and proper technique for inputting audio, you can force an XL-1 (even with the standard lens) to give fully-professional results. If you're essentially working alone on documentary-style projects, it's quirkiness and flexibility might not be worth the increased cost.
The PAL equivalent of the new GL2 might be more efficient for you.
Grazie wrote on 7/12/2002, 10:28 AM
Yes, Soundguy63, I understand thank you. I'm having a "look and feel" session in London tomorrow where I'll get the opportunity to get to grips with the XL-1. Sorry to sound thick - but what is GL2? Sorry....

Grazie
soundguy63 wrote on 7/12/2002, 2:15 PM
The Canon GL2 is the newest step down from the XL1s. I think under Canon's PAL naming scheme for models these may be called something totally different(?)
At any rate, it's 3-chip, with improved resolution over the GL1, fairly good glass (but non-removeable I think, unlike the XL1 interchangeable system), manual audio controls and a better on-board LCD screen.
I havent heard any detailed real-world reports on it because it's only been available for a short time. So, not personally recommending, but since you mentioned the XL1 I thought i'd throw that out as a more streamlined possibility.
soundguy63 wrote on 7/12/2002, 2:17 PM
Oh yeah, forgot to mention that it has audio metering visible in the viewfinder.
Grazie wrote on 7/12/2002, 4:39 PM
Thanks Soundguy63 - I'll check this out when in London. There's a new Olde [well actually opening is tomorrow! ] Camcorder Shoppe and I'll quiz them on what you suggest. Am I going to have fun!

Thanks everybody for your feedback.

Grazie
Grazie wrote on 7/14/2002, 4:48 AM
I think I'm in love!

Have returned from London Town and "I've seen the Light!" Yup The future... the fiture is XM2 [if this is the PAL step-up from the XM1 - going on SOundguy63's comment about naming in PAL-land]. Got my hands on the XM1... slid my hand into the grip and ... well what can I say! Just think of Tina's "Steamy Windows" playing in the background - got the picture? Okay - the XM1 [or XM2 see rest of post] is for me! Where have I been looking all this time? Yup read the articles - didn't sink in. Now I've re-read same articles and the pennies or dimes have started to rain down. Was told by the very nice, very patient assistant that the XM1 is used by TV crews in these parts as a standby if and when their £5000/£6000 broadcast machines had a fit! Well - excuse me - this is definately the type of endorsement I need - I buy this machine and I'm in the broadcast quality zone - touch-down - home-run - over the boundary - the Full Monty! The Full Nine Yards!

Woahh what a machine! Now then the GL2 or could it be the XM2 - I've seen a States-side Canon PDF brochure which I downloaded and printed off giving the details of the GL2. It would appear that this is going to be my preferred choice of cammy. It's big enough for my fingers and generally the layout is ergonimically thought through. It's got a side/top loading tape-dock. It's got the flourite lens technology and the 3CCD with pixel shift - Koool!

The brochure I downloaded was extemely helpful and in itself was a useful 101 for me on DiGi-Speak. Nice pretty pictures and "This is what you can do with your new GL2 Cammy" (my quotes my line) type explainations - Nice one Canon!

The audio controls are extensive [ I hear you Soundguy63!]and the options for further accessorizing this side of video craft has been recognised by Canon.

Canon has brought together its Camera experience and integrated this with the GL2. There's also a memory card and and and - well it just goes on and on and on.

However.... London didn't have a XM2/GL2 in Shoppe... nor did it have any information available [that's why I downloaded the PDF from Canon!]. London Shoppe speaks of said cammy being released in Aug/Sept. Oh well I'll kicked my heels till then.

I see that State-side Cammy Shoppes have "back orders" for the GL2. Has anybody yet experienced the GL2? What was it like for you?

Tried the Panasonic 350 - Nah not for me.

Y'know what people? I can see myself needing to upgrade to Vegas before too long! I'm really glad I just got paid for for some graphics and consultation work I'd invoiced for this month.

Grazie

ps - I don't work for Canon - but I'm open to offers!