Question - White background & composite

Harold Brown wrote on 10/5/2006, 9:01 PM
Vegas 7:
I have a clip with a white background that I want to composite over the lower track. I am using the Multiply (Mask) on the upper track and it looks perfect. The problem is that the rest of the video is black (no image). The only place where there is an image is where the upper clip is on the Multiply (Mask) track. So I have: ->no image -> special effect composite clip over lower track (looks great) -> no image.

I have tried Source Alph with Chroma Key on the clip but the result looks terrible. I looked through the manual and online help but cannot see what I need to do to make the rest of the video to show.

Appreciate help on this.

Thanks,
Harold

Comments

GlennChan wrote on 10/5/2006, 10:13 PM
Here is how I typically setup composites:

There's 3 tracks.

1st track: Put your alpha/transparency mask here. Apply the mask generator if necessary.
Composite mode multiply.

2nd track: Make this the child of track 1. Look in the left-hand column where all your track names are. The up/down arrows determine parent/child relationships. If not, the 1st track will multiply composite with the 3rd track and you don't want that.
Put the top element of your composite here... i.e. green screen element.
Normal composite mode.

3rd track:
Put the background here.
Normal composite mode.


I don't know if that answers your questions.
Chienworks wrote on 10/6/2006, 8:26 PM
Two easy solutions, neither is extremely pretty, but both are easy and workable.

1) Use tracks 1 and 2 only during that clip. Build the rest of your project on tracks 3, 4, 5, etc. (This is what i do.)

2) Add a solid white generated media event to track 1 wherever that clip isn't. This saves on tracks, but it's messier in the long run.
GlennChan wrote on 10/6/2006, 8:43 PM
Chienworks:
Isn't it simpler to use the parent/child relationships than what you suggest?
Chienworks wrote on 10/6/2006, 8:49 PM
I do use parent/child tracks for this. The problem is that the parent/child relationship affects the entire pair of tracks throughout the entire length of the project. If you are masking track 2 with track 1, then wherever track 1 is black you won't see anything of track 2 ... including the parts of the track outside of where you want to use masking. It doesn't matter whether the tracks are parent/child or not.
Harold Brown wrote on 10/7/2006, 7:46 AM
Thanks,
I placed the Multiply Mask and the clip to apply it to on the very bottom of the project and it worked. I can now see all of the video project. I had previously tried the parent child and it stilled affected the entire video. I had also previously moved it lower in the project but never to the very bottom. It just did not seemed right for the entire project to be affected where there were no clips. However, there may be a good reason for that that I don't understand.
The only thing that bothers me is how I have to chop the film exactly where the multiply mask is or you see nothing (the effects clip is half the length of the background and there for anyplace where the effects clip is not the video is black (or I can place the white on the track as suggested). It seems like I should be able to apply Multiply Mask directly to the clip instead of the track.

Thanks again for the both of your inputs.
Chienworks wrote on 10/7/2006, 8:10 AM
Yes, there is a very good reason. The mask compositing mode multiplies the pixel color values in the mask track by the pixel color values in the track being masked. Think of white as 1 and black as 0. Since anything muliplied by 1 (white) is itself, wherever the mask track is white you'll end up with the image on the other track showing through. Wherever it's 0 (black), well, 0 times anything is 0, so you'll see black. Now ... what's on the maks track when you don't have an clips there? Why, black, of course (or your project's current background color, which defaults to black). So when you don't have a clip on the mask track everything gets multiplied by black and ends up black. Hence my suggestion to add generated white to the track everywhere else.

I suppose it might be possible for Vegas' programmers to change the logic so that whenever there is no clip on the mask track that the mask is inactive. I suspect that would cause many more problems all around. Maybe a switch could be added that would toggle the behaviour between the two modes. Then again, since it's trivially easy to deal with the current behavior, it's probably not worth the effort.

That being said, there have been times when i wish i could insert "compositing mode markers" along a track and change the compositing mode from point to point. Now that would be swell. :)
Harold Brown wrote on 10/7/2006, 8:45 AM
Thanks for the explanation. Now I am working through a new problem. I needed to repostion the effect and now I have both white and black background (clip moved off screen using pan/crop) and everything is screwed up again! I see only part of each frame (where ever the white background is). I might be able to solve this by looking through my effects clips and getting one that is not a close up. This is at least a good learning experience.
Thanks