Really, really, WEIRD number ONE

NeilPorter wrote on 6/4/2003, 7:44 AM
Hello All,

So far I had only captured whole 60 minute tapes from position zero to end, 5 of them. I then found a need to capture the last 10 minutes of a tape. I set the position on the camera and ran Vegas Video Capture. Every other time I had run Vegas Video Capture from within a running Vegas. This time, however, I ran it as a stand-alone application. Previously I had not known that this could be done.

Anyway, the capture was working as usual so I left it and went and did something. When I returned, the capture had completed successfully. HOWEVER ..... the camera had been re-wound to zero and then been completely ERASED from beginning to end, stopping at the end of the tape.

HOW ON EARTH DID THIS HAPPEN????

(Sorry for shouting, but this is distressing - I have lost some irreplaceable video)

My camera is a Panasonic NV-DS38A (PAL system).

Regards,
Neil Porter

Comments

Former user wrote on 6/4/2003, 7:49 AM
That is scary. I hope SoFo takes this one seriously.


But as hindsight, be sure you use the Lockout tab on the tape whenever capturing. I found this to be a good practice in my real video job when 1" VPR 3's would erase a tape on rewind.

Sorry abou the loss.

Dave T2
mdsh wrote on 6/4/2003, 9:16 AM
So where was the record lockout tab on a 1" tape?

Mmm - VPR3's. They were fab. Spooling tapes in 'sport mode' was scarey :-)
Former user wrote on 6/4/2003, 9:24 AM
The 1" tape itself didn't have one, of course ;)

But the VPR3 had a hard lockout switch that would prevent any record command. We had it happen a couple of times before we found out about the switch. It erased in rewind on high speed.

Dave T2
BillyBoy wrote on 6/4/2003, 3:53 PM
How did it happen? You didn't read the manual would be my guess. If you want to capture PART of a tape you use the advanced capture tab.

If you want to print to tape, and NOT print from start of tape, pay attention to the prompts and select from the media bin. The down side of any camera being controlled from within software such as Vegas is it does EXACTLY that, the software controls the camera. Again, sorry, but user error.

As far as erasing, that can/should be prevented with changing the little tab on your DV tape. One of the first things I tired when first getting Vegas. Can it write to a "protected" tape? No, it pops a warning saying the tape cant be written to. Just wanted to be sure. Better safe than sorry. Also another reason I have a hard disk version of everything I put on DV tape.
NeilPorter wrote on 6/6/2003, 6:06 AM
> How did it happen? You didn't read the manual would be my guess.
Well, I did. I'm a fanatic manual reader, in fact. I skim read EVERY manual
just so that I know what's there in case I need it later. When I'm about to do something new I read that portion again. Where does it say that the tape will
be erased after a capture, whether full or partial?

> If you want to capture PART of a tape you use the advanced capture tab.
Otherwise you are guaranteed an erased tape? Folly! Far too dangerous. I'm sure SOFO would not have built-in such a feature deliberately. SOFO?

> Again, sorry, but user error.
I don't believe this, in this circumstance. No procedure should erase a whole tape back to blank without you confirming it somehow, especially as it appears to be tagged onto the end of a different procedure.

> As far as erasing, that can/should be prevented with changing
> the little tab on your DV tape.
Agreed. I won't get caught again. All the other captures proceeded so well that I was off guard.

Regards,
Neil Porter
jetdv wrote on 6/6/2003, 8:35 AM
Neil - I agree with you. You can put a tape in, press play, and press capture in Vidcap and it should simply capture to the end. As for why your tape then rewound and started recording, I have no clue. I have NOT seen this behaviour before, though.

Having said that, I DO use batch capture at least 95% of the time.
SonyEPM wrote on 6/6/2003, 8:53 AM
If this is our bug our CTO will chainsaw 10 Vegas engineers in half (starting with the project manager).
sqblz wrote on 6/6/2003, 10:17 AM
I must say that I eagerly wait the *next* posting of Sonic to this thread...
Sorry to be cynic, I was just remembering the second posting: "I hope SoFo takes this one seriously".
Where can anyone be safe ? Wouldn't the IR transmitter in my laptop accidentally command my Camera in the other end of the room to rewind and erase whatever is loaded (even *with* the protection tab on) ??

Spooky, indeed ...
Acts7 wrote on 6/6/2003, 10:33 AM
I just want to say - Im sorry - I feel your pain.
I DO thank you for posting this as I hope when I get my DV i WILL remember to lock the tape.

Thanks for sharing
SonyEPM wrote on 6/6/2003, 10:42 AM
ok, sorry. Using a worthless DV tape, can you reproduce the problem? If so, what are the exact repro steps, including hardware?
Acts7 wrote on 6/6/2003, 10:46 AM
MAN - I REALLY have to compliment you Sonic - YOU GUYS ARE ALWAYS on here its not been 2 hours since your last post and your back looking for more
Thanks for a great product and your ever-supporting help

vicmilt wrote on 6/6/2003, 10:57 AM
My sincere condolances for your tape loss -

as a matter of course, we ALWAYS IMMEDIATELY lock ANY videotape as soon as it is removed from the camera - PERIOD.

we prenumber rolls, prior to shooting so that none gets lost or retaped over

we never replay tapes "on the job" except for a spot check at the end of important scenes - the Sony cameras have an "end search" button which replays about 5 seconds, and then resets the camera to the end of code.

but we are all watching anxiously to see how this predicament occurred. I've been using VV for three years, with hundreds of tapes Captured, and never had this situation.
But (see above) all of my tapes are locked. Nevertheless, automatic erasure is a terrifying thought. The loss of video original is bad, bad, bad.

One thought, though. Unless I misunderstand your plight, you did transfer the beginning of the reel, and then the end. If so, and those transfers are ok, you've lost nothing (I hope). DV transfer is loss free. Just edit the two pieces back into one, and immediately make a new DV tape for archive purposes (hard drives do crash).

best of luck -
v.
NeilPorter wrote on 6/6/2003, 9:19 PM
From SonicEPM

"If this is our bug our CTO will chainsaw 10 Vegas engineers in half (starting with the project manager)."

This what I expected the seriousness of this to be although I wouldn't really want you to go that far. ;-)


"ok, sorry. Using a worthless DV tape, can you reproduce the problem? If so, what are the exact repro steps, including hardware?"
I will try to get around to this.

From vicmilt

"we ALWAYS IMMEDIATELY lock ANY videotape as soon as it is removed from the camera - PERIOD."

For the future, me too.

"you did transfer the beginning of the reel, and then the end. If so, and those transfers are ok"
Except that I taped new material over the beginning!!! :-( I had thought I was finished with the material but, on disk, I had accidentally lost some clips which, coincidentally, were still left on the end of the tape in question.
Thanks all for your interest. I'll try to get onto some experimenting on this asap.

Regards,
Neil Porter