Comments

jetdv wrote on 6/26/2004, 5:18 AM
We use wireless mic(s)
RafalK wrote on 6/26/2004, 5:50 AM
Steve, I think you might be talking about mini disk recorders. Sony makes them and I think few other brands as well. Check out BHphotovideo.com , they sell them.
Jet's way is what most likely 99% of us use.
TheHappyFriar wrote on 6/26/2004, 5:59 AM
I'm recording a graduation today & have my computer plugged into the mixer (everyone will be using the mixer). But, wireliess mics's are a good idea. :)

If you have a laptop you could use that, but a minidisk recorder would be a great idea.
2G wrote on 6/26/2004, 10:50 AM
Just to expand the topic... if you have a couple of wireless mikes, a general 'room' mike, and maybe a feed from the house system, what do you do with it from there? Do you have a small mixer you feed everything into and premix it down to one signal? Or do you record multi-track audio and mix in post production? If you don't have a separate digital recorder, do you feed the output directly into one of your cameras and record on the audio track of the camera?

My dream is to have a 6 or 8 track digital recorder that can hold at least 90 minutes (for potentially long ceremonies). I don't like to pre-mix anything. I want the versatility of post production mixing. I know these recorders are out there. But I haven't won the lottery yet... :-)

Has anybody found any multitrack digital recorders in a reasonable price range?

2G
davidkwock wrote on 6/26/2004, 12:13 PM
I have two Mackie SDR 24 track harddisk recorders. Costs about $1,000 each (used) on ebay plus $30 for each cable (you need one cable for every 8 tracks of recording). I use them to record live music-band shows and a series of comedy shows (11 open mics at once) for local TV. The second recorder is a back up. Uses USB port (slow) or optional firewire bays (fast) to transfer files to computer to do post production in Vegas. These Mackies are rock solid and reliable. They don't crash like recording on a computer. Nevertheless, good clean audio should still be recorded through the cameras for backup and audio sync.

You still need a little mixer.

Another option are those all-in-one deals from Roland, Yamaha, Fostex, Kawai, Boss, etc. Mixer and recorder in one unit. Make sure its easy to transfer compatible files to Vegas afterwards.

I have the Roland VS-1680 but I prefer the Mackies because of its "24 bit" headroom of over 100 db (so most of the time - no need to compress), built in meters and "no need to read the manual" simplicity.

Obviously, my preference may not be the best choice for you so you need to do a bit of research here.
DavidMcKnight wrote on 6/26/2004, 2:52 PM
I have a pair of minidisk recorders I got from ebay for about $60 each. They are a tad bigger (but flatter) than a wireless pack and fit nicely in a grooms pocket. Simple matter to use one and a lapel mic to get the source audio, then later record the audio into Vegas and sync to video. This way, the groom is heard (many times to my great enjoyment...and they don't realize they are being recorded the WHOLE time...), the bride is heard ,a nd the officiant is heard. I rarely if ever use the second one, but would use it on a podium for speakers if need be.
zstevek wrote on 6/28/2004, 8:00 PM
Thanks for the replies everyone.

I am thinking about buying an Olympus VN-240 PC Digital Voice Recorder. You can hook up an external mic and it can record up to 4 hours of audio.

It uses a recording format I am not familiar with called ADPCM. Does anyone know if Vegas can read this type of audio file?

Here is a link to some specifics about it, I would appreciate any feedback (positive or negative)

http://www.videodirect.com/olympus/voicerecorders/olympus-vn-240.html

Thanks
DGates wrote on 6/28/2004, 8:51 PM
I'm not sure about mp3 player/recorders or even the digital voice recorders. Perfect sync is what you need. Those options are currently untested. You may want to consider MiniDisc.

As a frequent visitor to a wedding forum, http://www.videouniversity.com/wwwboard/wedding/

I'd say unofficially, maybe 25-30% of wedding videographers in that forum are using MiniDisc for the vows, officiant and podium. You've got one shot at getting it right, and the occasional static or interference of a wireless system is simply not acceptable. MiniDisc sounds better than any wireless out there. That's a fact.

If you're taping for regular video production, where you have the chance to reshoot as many takes as you want, then wireless would be fine.

biggles wrote on 6/28/2004, 10:32 PM
I have been using Mini-disc up till now but have just gone out and bought a HD MP3 unit that has external mic. in as well as optical in and optical out. It has a 20G HD and will record either MP3 or WAV.

I have only just unpacked it so have yet to try it out, but am pretty confident I will get a good result.
farss wrote on 6/28/2004, 11:30 PM
If you use good wireless mics you will not have a problem. We've tested them to 100s of metres with no problems and you'll notice they are used constantly in broadcast and live events. But you hvae to buy the GOOD ones, anything under about USD500 is not going to cut it.
Sennheiser makes some good gear that will stand the abuse and have 100s of channels. If you've got something like PD150 then wireless mic in one channel and on camera mic in the other is a reliable way to go with minimum amount of gear.
LarryP wrote on 6/29/2004, 6:06 AM
If you are in a church check on the assisted listening system. We have a couple of Telex receivers equipped with an XLR cable that the videographers use to get a house feed. They like the freedom to move about.

Larry
rcrawfor42 wrote on 6/29/2004, 10:52 AM
I have an Archos GMini that I'm going to try out as a second source. It's a 20Gig MP3 player that can record MP3 or WAV files. The only beef I have about it is that it needs line-level inputs; I've cobbled together a simple pre-amp, but I haven't really given the whole thing a real test yet.

biggles wrote on 6/29/2004, 7:28 PM
I've just been 'playing' with my rig - its an iRiver iHP-120 and has a Mic-in setting and it works flawlessly.

The really nice thing is the USB2 interface because to get the audio track into my PC, its a simple 'drag 'n drop' operation.
zstevek wrote on 7/2/2004, 9:35 PM
dmcknight,

What type of Minidisc recorders do you have if you don't mind me asking?

Thanks
DavidMcKnight wrote on 7/3/2004, 8:55 AM
I have two Sony MZ-R37 recorders that I got off ebay. They've worked great for me. They have a mic in - I use a radio shack lav that cost about $30 and again, has worked very well. I got the second unit in case of podium readings and as a backup. I like that you can put it in mono mode and get 2x recording time, and that there is a lock switch so that once you've set it in record mode, activated the switch, it will not stop recording no matter if buttons are pushed accidentally, etc.

You can find out more info here, from the minidisc.org site:

http://minidisc.org/part_Sony_MZ-R37.html

(edit)
I guess one downside is that the only way to transfer audio from the R37 is from the analog out, into your sound card, and captured in vegas as an audio track. I usually only have one of these per wedding, and isn't that big a deal for me. It would be nice to have a device that you could connect via usb and grab the audio as a file - but this device does not do that.

Edin1 wrote on 7/3/2004, 5:28 PM
To save you from wasting time on reading this whole message, short conclusion about MiniDisc portable Player/Recorder is here:

Pros: Very good audio quality, long battery life, small profile, relatively cheap media, longer recording times through Mono and lower quality setting

Cons: No digital transfer to PC or any other device; only analog capture from the headphones output possible, and therefore the amount of recording time is the amount of transfer time; a huge setback! The audio quality also suffers to some extent because of digital>analog>analog amplifier>analog transfer>digital conversion.


I've bought a Sony MiniDisc player (MZ-NF810CK) about a year ago, as I needed it for a radio station. My primary use for it was recording interviews, and doing transfers of recorded radio shows on MiniDisc to computer, and then Audio CD.
This specific model had the most features and capabilities, and was the most expensive one at that time ($279.99 at Good Guys).
It has Line input (electrical and optical in the same jack), Mic input (Stereo!), USB jack, and headphones output.
Here are the pros and cons of using MIniDisc:
GOOD FEATURES:
1. Very god audio quality - clear sound, whether you use Line-in or Mic-in, very low nise circuitry; the noise floor of your microphone is pretty much the noise floor of the recording, as MD Player/Recorder hardly adds any
2. Very long battery life - One AA battery will give you at least 12 hours of recording time, more than the internal rechargeable battery (at least 7 hours), and you can use both for at least about 22 hours of recording time; playback time is about 3 times longer: amazing!
3. Ability to record in Mono mode, which doubles the recording time of the disc
4. Ability to record at lower quality setting, allowing for longer recording times
5. Good anti-skip protection
6. Small physical size of both player and discs
7. Relatively cheap media
8. Discs enclosed, and therefore protected from dust, scratches, fingerprints
9. Pretty fast response to commands, as well as powering on

BAD OR NO FEATURES:
1. No USB MiniDisc Player to PC capability, only from PC to MD Player/Recorder;
This is the biggest problem of portable MD Players, as the only output you have is the analog headphones output. This means that you are loosing some quality because it is not LINE out, and because you have to capture that audio again with your computer sound card, which also adds some noise to the audio. As bad, or even worse thatn that is the fact that you have to transfer this audio at 1x speed (realtime), that way spending at least the same amount of time you spent on recording the audio. If you have 12 hours of audio material, you will need 12 hours just to transfer it from MD to anything else. All of the State-of-the-art technology used in MD players means nothing when you want to transfer MD digitally to anything else. Sony gets two thumbs down because fo this!
2. If using MD Recorder for recording sound track for video shooting, you will need to manually synchronize the audio with video; many times, wireless mic connected to camcorder's line input saves you from a lot of time-wasting and trouble. This is not really a lack of the MD device, just an advice on saving time and energy when shooting videos.