Rendering Quality...

frobro wrote on 7/19/2004, 11:48 AM
Hi-

I am trying to render a file from Vegas 5, but the quality is not great.

I have rendered about 500 frames from a 3D program at 720X480. (.jpg files)
After I put them on the timeline, with music on a saparate track, I go to Render as. I've been rendering at 720X480, Indeo video, .avi. when the movie finishes rendering, the quality is not that great.
It seems like there are a lot of preference settings in Vegas and I must be missing something.
Eventually I want to put my rendered movie on a DVD. Does anybody know the best way to approach this? What is the best way to set up the properties for the source footage, the timeline, and the actual render from Vegas.
Note: I will be using DVD architect for burning the DVD.

Thanks for your help.

Comments

Chienworks wrote on 7/19/2004, 11:53 AM
Probably the majority of the problem is the Indeo codec. Use DV or uncompressed instead and you'll get much better results.
ScottW wrote on 7/19/2004, 11:56 AM
Use MPEG2 and select the appropriate template for DVDA. If you go to any other format then DVDA will have to recompress it into MPEG2 anyway, so might as well go to MPEG2 to begin with.

Also the audio should be rendered to AC3.

--Scott
frobro wrote on 7/19/2004, 11:57 AM
Okay, thanks.

One other quick question:
Is it better to use MPEG to go out to DVD, or is it still best to us DV or uncompressed?
ScottW wrote on 7/19/2004, 12:04 PM
The content on the DVD will be MPEG-2 for the video stream and normally AC3 for the audio stream.

If you render to DV, then DVD Arch will simply take the stuff and compress it as MPEG2 anyway. The reason most folks suggest rendering MPEG-2 directly from Vegas is that you have much more control over the various options. For example, you can do a 2 pass encode via Vegas, but not via DVDA.
frobro wrote on 7/19/2004, 12:15 PM
Thanks for all of your suggestions. If you haven't already guessed, I'm new at this.
I don't know what the 2 pass encode is, and if I choose to render as an AC3, I don't understand how that relates to MPEG.

Any suggestions on a useful book I could buy would be great. I didn't get much from the quick start manual from Sony.
ScottW wrote on 7/19/2004, 1:00 PM
Read this forum and the DVDA forum. Read what people post and what responses they get. There's also some good web sites with tutorials; doom9.net is a good resource and there are others.

2 pass encoding refers to having the encoder make 2 passes across the source material. On the first pass the encoder basically just takes notes about what's going on in each frame of the picture. On the second pass the encoder actually does the encoding, but since it has notes from the first pass it can make better choices about how to encode a particular frame since it knows what's coming next. So, if you've got the time, 2 pass is usually a little better than single pass - but it also largely depends on the source material.

Some encoders let you make more than 2 passes over the source material. These encoders usually start at around $2,000 and go up from there.

AC3 is for your audio stream. DVDA wants the audio in a seperate file and then will will multiplex the video and audio together in the final project.

--Scott
JaysonHolovacs wrote on 7/19/2004, 1:01 PM
A two pass encode is used for variable bit rate MPEG-2 encoding. It means it goes through your source data twice:

1. The first time, it just looks it over to find out where the most bits are needed to encode the video cleanly, and where less bits are needed for good quality.
2. The second time, using the data from the first render, it actually performs the encoding.

Two pass encoding takes much longer than 1 pass encoding(not sure if it's actually twice or less). But if you have some areas of video that are more active and others that are less so, you will get better video quality for the same bit rate(theoretically, anyway). I don't think there's any case where it will be worse, so for a final render I would always use it if you can spare the time.

AC-3 is the format used for many compressed DVDs... it's also known as Dolby Digital(not sure exactly how the licensing is with that name and all). It can encode many audio channels at high quality. For example, many commercial DVDs use Dolby 5.1, which means 5 separate audio channels(1 for each speaker) and 1 LFE(or subwoofer) channel for the bass. Vegas and DVD-A2 can do this also, but it's a little more advanced to start messing around with multi-channel sound.

Chances are, all you need is stereo sound, which can also be encoded in AC-3. For stereo, you can also use PCM, which is basically uncompressed audio. PCM never supports more than 2 channels(ie stereo) because the data rate gets too high.

Encoding AC-3 requires licensing, which if you've purchased Vegas+DVD you already have for no extra charge! Without it, you are stuck with stereo and PCM. I always use AC-3; I'm not sure of any case where you wouldn't because it's much smaller and sounds great. Just listen to any professional Dolby Digital DVD; I don't think you'll have complaints with sound quality.

Do not use MPEG-2 for audio. While it seems to make sense since the video is MPEG-2 that MPEG-2 audio would be the way to go, it's not. Most DVD players don't support MPEG-2 audio. PCM and AC-3 are the only reliable choices... DTS is also popular, but I don't think there's anyway to do DTS in Vegas or DVD-A2.

-Jayson
frobro wrote on 7/19/2004, 1:12 PM
Thanks for all of your help, everyone.
After looking at the software again, things are starting to make sense.
orca wrote on 7/19/2004, 4:09 PM
> Also the audio should be rendered to AC3.

I just have a question about this, can this be rendered together with the picture or I should render this on a separate pass?

ScottW wrote on 7/19/2004, 4:22 PM
It gets rendered as a seperate operation; there are scripts available that will do the MPEG-2 render followed by the AC3 render.