rendering wmv clips - best technique?

genie wrote on 12/26/2009, 2:44 AM
Hi,
I am stitching a series of wmv clips together with transitions and I would like to know the best setup for the render process. The clips are all wmv 720p NTSC, 3485kbps and the only template seems to be the windows v11 but the my core 2 duo laptop bogs down trying to do it. ( A one hour 20 minute video looks like it will take about 30 hours to render!) Isn't there a way of simply outputting the video as a perfect copy of its own original template, or am I missing something. Appreciate any thoughts, cheers.

Comments

Chienworks wrote on 12/26/2009, 5:04 AM
Not with Vegas. Vegas will always re-encode WMV.

Perhaps Microsoft has a .wmv stitching tool available somewhere. I did a very quick google search but only found one program for Mac and nothing specific for Windows. You'll probably have to do a lot more than glance at the first few results.
TLF wrote on 12/26/2009, 6:25 AM
Use Format Factory to convert the WMV clips to something more Vegas-freindly.

Format Factory is free and can be downloaded from http://www.formatoz.com/
BudWzr wrote on 12/26/2009, 8:44 AM
Windows Media Encoder (Free From MS) has a custom mode that lets you batch encode (combine) from multiple files. Don't know how slow it is though.

UPDATE: Oh, I re-read your post and this won't help. You don't want to just stitch, you want to apply transitions too.
BudWzr wrote on 12/26/2009, 8:56 AM
Also, your bitrate is WAY too high. Cut it down to 1000, or even 500. Just try it with a small selection area first, and see how long it takes.

I don't know where Sony gets this "WMV 11" from, AFAIK WMV9 is still the latest release. Perhaps it's referring to VC-1 advanced profile, but anyway it still has to re-encode to render the transitions, there's no way around it.
Chienworks wrote on 12/26/2009, 10:25 AM
Way to high for what? 3840Kbps is about as low as i'd want to go for DVD-quality SD clips.
musicvid10 wrote on 12/26/2009, 11:39 AM
The latest version of Super by Erightsoft has a wmv stitcher.
This is just information -- I haven't tried it.
BudWzr wrote on 12/26/2009, 1:48 PM
For the WMVHD (AKA VC-1). source files, they're 720p, 4 times larger resolution than DVD resolution. That's why it's taking so long.
genie wrote on 12/26/2009, 2:52 PM
OK thanks for all the tips. I'll check out a couple of the stitching tools and see how it goes and I'll drop the transitions. Wouldn't a simple 'copy base video template' also be an option in Vegas - to copy a video file on a hard drive only takes a few seconds!
PerroneFord wrote on 12/26/2009, 4:48 PM
Well, a couple things.

1. You aren't copying the file. You are using an encoder to re-encode the file. And you are HOPING that it's smart enough to realize that nothing has changed.

2. Microsoft make an encoding application that is excellent. It gives access to more professional tools and results, and its a free download from their Windows media site. It has both a 32 and a 64bit version. It can encode live streams or files.

3. Get used to the idea of using helper programs for your video work. Yes, Vegas Pro costs a few hundred dollars, but it can't do everything. No NLE can. Sometimes there are other VERY valuable tools out there to do specific tasks.
genie wrote on 12/26/2009, 10:35 PM
OK, a change of tacks. What about if I just want to trim a file to extract the part of the timeline that I want from each clip. In other words copy a segment of a file, or alternatively copy the whole video file and then chop off the bits I don't want. Is there any software that does this - perhaps something from Vasst? Sounds easy and quick without the need to render a new file frame by frame but maybe it isn't?
PerroneFord wrote on 12/26/2009, 10:49 PM
the problem that you are having, is that you are thinking of video as though it were a discrete set of frames. You want to remove a certain number of frames, slide the rest into place, and just put it all back together. Well, in many professional codecs, this is exactly how it works. They are called INTRA -Frame codecs, because each frame is compressed completely separate from any other.

However, consumer based, or highly compressed codecs like WMV, AVCHD, Mpeg2, etc. aren't done this way. They rely on the frames around them for information. Remove a frame, and things begin to fall down. This is why they have to be re-encoded. To recalculate that missing information. It's like the links in a chain. If you have a chain 100 links long, and you remove link 12, link 55, link 71, and link 98, you aren't going to be doing much with that chain any more! It must be reconstructed.

So no, this isn't as simple as it might seem on the surface. Cutting the ends off or attaching two videos together can work. Just like with a chain. But as soon as you split it, integrity is lost.

Soniclight wrote on 12/27/2009, 12:48 AM
Maybe I'm not following this thread as I should, but wouldn't simply rendering the raw .WMV files to suitable lossless (or if space allows, even uncompressed) .AVI ones in Vegas -- and then use the AVI versions in-project for editing solve the whole dealing-with-WMV thing?

Once something is in AVI many more options open up, including exporting/rendering out the final render. But then I'm not an expert on the nano-topography of formats and codecs either, so my suggestion may or may not be naive.
genie wrote on 12/27/2009, 4:48 AM
Good point PerroneFord! I can see I will have to give up on the lazy man's technique. thanks for all your thoughts guys