Serious Vegas weakness...

jj_joseph wrote on 5/24/2003, 9:20 PM
Vegas 4 is powerful in many ways but the keyframing engine leaves me feeling that there has to be a better way.For one thing,the key curves(smooth,fast,hold etc...)seem to lack the precision I need and require too much trial and error to get desired effect.Perhaps a window to edit these with more options and parameters?

Also,I would like to see the cursor in the keyframe window follow the playback cursor motion of the track window(update it's position in real time during track playback).

Most aggravating is why vegas won't allow the saving of keyframing sequences with fx PRESETS.If I spend several hours creating complex 3D w/Satish's cool plug or wild track motion sequences,I want to be able to save these to use again sometime without the same agony again and again.(yes,I know saving the entire veg as a workaround).

I don't claim to know vegas inside -out,so help me understand if I have missed it or can see a better way.
Thanks!
jj

Comments

BillyBoy wrote on 5/24/2003, 9:49 PM
Maybe I'm misreading what you said or want to do...

Have you tried clicking on the properties icon in the FX window? For example you can rotate a 1/10th a degree of arc which should be plenty for even demandiing projects. So too with placement you can size to 1/10th a pixel.

You can also save a preset FX. Just give it a name, open a new file it the actons apply to the new file. I haven't done it for a long time, so just tired again and it worked with me using a small test file where I set five key frames one zoomed way in, others rotating. I saved the custom setting as a preset, opened a new file, opend pan/copy applied the custom preset it did the same thing.
jj_joseph wrote on 5/24/2003, 11:55 PM
OK,I know the precision in the track motion is 1/10 as you say.
but I was speaking more of the possibility to edit envelopes(sorry,I come from audio background)which control key status(hold,linear,slow,fast,etc...)and the transition between them on a keyframe timeline.I know that I experienced far too much trial/error /rage while keyframing a moderately complex sequence in 3dLE.I suppose I will need to zoom in moch more and apply many more keyframes to smooth out the motion to my satisfaction,too bad the key cursor won't chase the track cursor in playback... I have no practical experience in other video software,so maybe vegas' keyframe engine is slick-as-a-whistle compared to the other stuff..I wonder..
Not sure what is the deal w/presets, your's seems to work as it should.Here is what happens:
1.Add a slice of video to the timeline
2.Open 3DLE on that clip
3.Create a rotation effect w/3 keyframes
4.Name it and save as a preset
5.Close the Plug window
6.Choose a different clip,open 3DLE on it
7.From the dropdown,pick your preset
8.Only first keyframe is there
What is my error?Perhaps my install is corrupted?
jj
philfort wrote on 5/25/2003, 12:29 AM
The key cursor follows the track cursor for me, not as its playing, but once it stops. Are you sure you have sync cursor on?
stormstereo wrote on 5/25/2003, 5:16 AM
Try selecting all keyframes and copy them (ctrl+c). Then paste them (ctrl+v) into the other effect keyframe window. Works here.

Best/Tommy
www.stormstereo.com
BillyBoy wrote on 5/25/2003, 9:11 AM
I think you may have stumbled on a bug JJ...

Lets see if others can duplicate this.

Take a 60 second vid and split into two. Drag and drop the PluginPac 3D filter on the first event. Using only the Scaling X-Y feature set the first key frame to 25% add a second key frame 10 seconds down at 50%, a third a 15 seconds at 100% and the last keyframe at 200%. Play. As expected the video should start out at 1/4 size, then grow to half size, 3/4 size and finally end up at double size. Now save the preset. Drop the filter on the second event, select the preset you just made and surprise, instead of there being 4 keyframes there are only two. For me the 1st and 3rd.

I next tried this with one of the Vegas other filters. One of my favorites Color Corrector. I again set four key frames just sweeping the gain from a high value to a very low one. again as you'd expect it slowly darkened the image over time. Again I saved this preset, then dropped on the 2nd event and surprise only two of the four key frames were there.

Interesting.
kameronj wrote on 5/25/2003, 9:31 AM
Can't speak about saving the preset (haven't tried that one yet) - but the tracking seems to work very well for me. As far as having the control....I don't see how much more control someone can have when you can zoom in and do keyframing framexframe.

Yes...it is time consuming. It took me two or three days to keyframe a ten minute short I did (my X-Men spoof). Granted, I was just playing around with the video and keying...but had I spent just a little more time to get my placements more precise, it would have flowed like butter.

So I'm a little confussed as to what you are looking for the FX to do. I was able (on the timeline and keying line) to zoom all the way in and place the keys frameXframe...follow the action on the screen...and make minute modifications to the action at will.

Do you perhaps have an example of what you have done posted some place we can take a peek at and see what you see? Or point to another example of something you are trying to go for?
FuTz wrote on 5/25/2003, 10:01 AM


A Bezier curves option would be nice on key's paths in the Pan/Crop engine...
Udi wrote on 5/25/2003, 11:22 AM
Billy, In my test the save preset save only the current information on the dialog and not the key frames. So, depending where you are on the timeline, the actual values that are displayed in the dialog are saved.

When you droped an efect on an event and selected the preset, it added a keyframe at the current position (if none exists) with the preset information, it does not create multiple keyframes.

You can, in principal, select each keyframe and save that keyframe information as preset1, preset2 etc.. And later add keyframes and reload the corresponding keyframe data. It will not keep the timimg of the keyframes.

A tool for saving keyframes might be nice, in my case, I just copy and paset event attributes when I need this type of functionality.

Udi
stormstereo wrote on 5/26/2003, 9:10 AM
fUtZ, I agree!
/Tommy
ocean wrote on 5/26/2003, 11:28 AM
Glad to see the issue of not being able to accurately save presets addressed here. I was working with lots of complex keyframing on my last project and found it impossible to accurately save the presets. I posted the question here and was told that stting presets *did* work. Now I see that it's not just me. This is definetly something that needs to be fixed.