Many thanks wwaaq! That really helps. Like you said, I'm missing the basics, actually, I missing a lot more than that. :)

I set everything up to render my video in the best quality period and I figured I could then compress the video to fit on a DVD. I see that didn't work. :)

I've been trying to use an MP4 container but I couldn't figure out how to get VP11 to render my video into that format. VP11 crashed and said it couldn't do it and that it didn't know why. PLUS, there were so many different choices, (like: Sony tablet, Apple iPad/pod, Internet HD 1080, 720...). Oh! AND there is ... what should my "Project Properties" be?

So, let me ask you what you would recommend for 3 different project outputs: be specific.
How do I set my "Project Properties" (PP) and "rendering" to do the following?

1) Edit my video and make a DVD to watch on a DVD player.
2) Edit my video and keep the best quality I can to give to people as a file to watch on their computer, however large that my be.
3) Edit my video and prepare it to be watched on something like YouTube.

Now I know VP11 has a "button" to upload to YouTube and a button to burn to DVD. So, I imagine that what I have to learn is how to properly create my project properties (PP). Yes? Because if I had the right PP I would guess I could have just asked VP11 to burn the DVD. But since I didn't, I ended up with a project that was too big.

BTW I've used the setting that I have now to get video upload to YouTube. And I've been able to push the button to burn a DVD before for videos I made that were only 30 mins long. When I push the button for a DVD it does both the video and the audio in the process. It can't do it now since the file is too big, or maybe more correctly, it tells me it will take more than one DVD.

Thanks in advance
Arahant

This is how I work.

I set my Project Settings to "Match" the majority of the Media I am using. Examples: If I am using the output from my Canon XF300 I allow Vegas Pro 13 Project Settings Match my media - see the Icon I point to?:



This FORCES VP13 to make the best Editing option for you and me. It will allow you and me to edit nicely without Vegas having to do too much heavy lifting in doing the background maths.

Once I have done that, I do my editing and start to examine just where my output would go to. Actually, prior to editing I would have had a discussion with myself and my client or family member, I would have a pretty good idea in what format I want my output.

OK . . . .

"1) Edit my video and make a DVD to watch on a DVD player." - I finish my editing, then produce or render TWO separate files of the edited work:

i] For the Video "stream", I render a Mainconcept MPEG2 video file.

ii] For Audio "stream", I render a Dolby AC3 audio file.

Both of these render "engines" come with the VegasPro package. You will have them too

I then import these two files into SONY DVD Architect (DVDA) and produce a finished DVD with all the Menus and graphics I want. Do you own DVDA?

In this way I can easily produce an excellent +2 hour program, definitely 2hours 30 minutes. But this WILL be Standard Definition. Why? Because that's what the DVD process was designed for.

"2) Edit my video and keep the best quality I can to give to people as a file to watch on their computer, however large that my be." - Here I use MP4 (I've been using the Vegas2Handbrake for my MP4 stuff) and at a stretch maybe Windows Media Player.


"3) Edit my video and prepare it to be watched on something like YouTube." - This has been discussed many a time here on the Forum.

So, to recap:

A] Getting Setup: Match your Project to majority of your.

B] Burn DVD from within VP13:You will not get sufficient control from the Burn to DVD from within VP to be happy. You WILL need some extra help from "another" DVD creation s/w - here for me that is DVDA.

C] Delivery Platform: Determine, as much as you can, your final delivery option prior to editing and research what that is you need.

I've skated-over much you may need to understand, but this is the basics I use and hope this will direct you to ask "other" questions or better yet, get you going! And remember we ALL, without exception, had to start somewhere . . all of us.

Grazie

Read this forum thread carefully, noting especially the chart by John Meyer. It tells you everything you'll need to know.

mp2 (widescreen) for the video, Dolby Studio for the audio, being careful to keep the same name for both files.

Jack

First... Grazie and JackW, thank you for your responses. :)

This is ONLY dealing with part 1 - Making a DVD.

I'm sorry I think a lot went over my head. :(

I did the "Match" thing and I edited my video and I've got what I have. I don't remember how I did it but I remember doing something like that.

I have DVDA and Dolby Digital Professional encoder (I have no clue what that does). I've never used it and I have not yet downloaded it on my computer. But that's still steps ahead of me.

There is sooo much I need to ask.

I'm still stuck on PP (Project Properties). My template is HD 1080-60i @ 29.970 fps. If I'm going to render to MainConcept MPEG-2 DVD Arch NTSC widescreen video stream do I have to match my PP to that?

Next, some graphics I made (stills out of MS Paint) went from really good quality to crap!, unusable crap. And... now they don't even fill the whole screen! I tried changing the properties of the graphic and was ALWAYs left with some part of the screen still showing video (either the sides or the top/bottom).

What can I do about the graphic destruction of quality?

This is why I'm asking specifically what to set in PP and Rendering.

My video is just video with title graphics made in MS Paint that fade in and out full screen, as necessary.

Before you get mad, read my third sentence again. :) and then read the first line again and again. :)

Arahant

UPDATE

The video and graphic were not as "crappy" as I thought they were going to be. They're fine, for TV. :)

I have rendered the video as you suggested. I now have an Audio file and a video file.

I have to figure out what to do now with just VP11. It will be a day or so before I'll try DVDA. I have to install it and then figure it out.

Couple things:

"I set everything up to render my video in the best quality period and I figured I could then compress the video to fit on a DVD. I see that didn't work. :)"

That last "compress to fit" step is going to rob a lot of the quality away. Always think of compression as the opposite of quality. But, don't let this stop you. DVD is only standard definition so the absolute best quality you can put in something compressed that small is going to be lower quality than HD. That's the whole reason we have HD!

The size of the output file is determined by two, and only two things: duration and bitrate. You want a smaller file, use a lower bitrate. Most HD material is 16 to 25Mbps while most SD material is 4 to 8Mbps. This is why DVD files tend to take up about 1/4 the space of BluRay files. Of course, being 1/6 the number of pixels, SD material can stand being that much lower a bitrate without suffering too much quality loss.

Don't sweat project properties. They're really not very important at all. With the single exception of deinterlace method, Vegas actually ignores them when rendering. Probably the only thing you should really worry about is whether you're aiming for widescreen 16:9 or standard 4:3 output. Since you're starting with 1080p material you are probably going to produce widescreen DVDs. I tend to match my project properties to the desired output format so that i can see what the finished output will look like while i'm editing. Yes, you'll see dire warnings from other folks that this can slow down the preview speed and editing process and this is true ... but, really not by much to worry about.

If you want to burn good DVDs/BluRays you will need to install DVDA. The disc burning function built into Vegas is excruciatingly primitive and doesn't even allow for menus. Also, the Dolby encoder for making the preferred AC3 audio for discs is included with DVDA, so it won't be available in Vegas until DVDA is installed.

Pictures: when you're working with standard definition video 720x480, note that the 4:3 format uses pixels that are narrower than they are tall while widescreen format uses pixels that are wider than they are tall. If you make an image that is 720x480 then it's going to leave gaps on the top and bottom in 4:3 and on the sides in widescreen. The proper sizes are 655x480 for standard and 873x480 for widescreen.

Grazie, wonderful diplomacy.
I'm a fan of yours all over again, and using "I" as an example rather than "you"as the target, is a masterful teachers' technique. Well done.

@Gazie-
At the risk of sounding over patronizing, I have to say your explanation and directives are off the chart valuable.
While I was reading your reply there were several inspiring "light bulbs" appearing above my head.
You are an absolute credit to this form.

@wwaag-

At the risk of sounding over patronizing, I have to say your explanation and directives are off the chart valuable.
While I was reading your reply there were several inspiring "light bulbs" appearing above my head.
You are an absolute credit to this form.

@ Chienworks

Thanks for your feedback. And thanks again to the others who offered help.

I've come a long way from just a few days ago. I did not "get" what all the rendering options were for or how they worked. I can't believe I never understood the big deal about blu-ray. I NEVER realized that DVDs were SD and blu-ray was HD. Duhhh. I though you could just put any quality into a DVD and you were limited to 4.7 G.

So, at this point I'm learning DVDA. (I had it and it came with VP11). So, I have to do my homework and learn the basics of this program and then make the DVD (with menus).

I'm sure I'll come back with more questions, but for now I'm working with the information Grazie offered and the new understanding I have of DVDs and rendering I learned from wwaaq.

Thank you all for your help!

Arahant

Here's another question.. If I have to make a DVD, and I have the option to use my old 4:3 camcorder that I used to shoot with for DVD, or I can use my AVCHD camcorder that shoots 1080i, which would be better to use if the end product is DVD?

@MikeLV

I personally find HD converted to DVD better. Aside from that, I prefer to keep the highest quality archived regardless of the delivery format. Maybe a customer or relative has access to better playback in the future?

MikeLV,

'4:3 camcorder', 4:3 only defines its aspect ratio, what kind of camera is it? Resolution, bitrate and codec, hardware?

Shoot using both of them beside each other, render out both of their files in SD.
See for yourself which is better.

There is much more to a camera than its software format when it comes to recording quality.

The EOS cameras from Canon for example all shoot with a 4K sensor, even the HD one, that gives a better defined image than a standard HD sensor.

VMP

" I though you could just put any quality into a DVD and you were limited to 4.7 G. "

Well ... slight clarification. You *CAN* put anything on a DVD disc. You can put web videos, SD, MP4, WMV, AVI, HD, 4K, still pictures, PDF files, Excel spreadsheets, ... whatever, as long as it's under the size limit. However, you're not necessarily making a disc that anyone can play when you do this. These discs can be used in computers just like any other storage medium.

A DVD Video disc, that you can play in any DVD player, only accepts SD MPEG2.

Re: Using the old 4:3 (SD) camera for DVDs...

I have a good, smart, non-tech client who runs a ballet studio. She puts on 2 big shows a year in the local high school's well-equipped theater (2200 seats).

She complains every year that DVDs from the HD-recorded performances do not look as good as the old SD camera they used (before I knew her.) So I asked her for some of the old DVDs that were made from the SD material, and indeed, the images looked excellent.

BUT, what I was seeing in the SD-sourced DVD was a much smaller portion of the stage than what I have been recording recently with the 16:9 HD camera. IOW, the available aspect ratio was influencing (or even driving) the videographer's framing and zooming. And zoomed-in SD footage (in her case a Canon XL2 mini-DV, 20x optical zoom, 3 chips, etc., a good camera) looks really good.

Lesson learned for me: the client likes zoomed in material more than full width views of the stage. Aha!

As has been said in an earlier post, you can put most anything on a DVD (which stands for Digital Versatile Disk, not Digital Video Disk). BUT, to have something you can play in a set top DVD player, you must use MPEG 2 video, at less than 9800 Mb/Sec, at 720 x 480 pixels (approximately, NTSC).

When you do a visual comparison between a DVD video made from SD material with one made from HD material, you have to consider the entire scenario, there is more to the comparison than simple resolution differences.

I see I see.. Well the old camcorder is a Panasonic DVC80, it's mainly a talking head type shoot. I know DVD has to be 720x480 which is of course what that camcorder's native resolution is. The other camcorder is a Canon XA10, which shoots AVCHD. What I was trying to determine was if it's better to shoot with the old camcorder and not have to do any resizing at encode time to MPEG2, or shoot it in HD, and size it down to the correct res for DVD.

There are very good chances that the newer camcorder has better optics, better sensors, better encoding, and better data storage than the old one. I'm currently on my 4th camcorder at approximately 7 year intervals. While each one has been about 1/2 the price of the previous one, i'd say the quality is about 4 times better each time. Of course, this is entirely based on the relative merits of your camcorders. If the old SD one was $35,000 pro quality and the new HD one is a $40 toy, that may alter the comparison.

The other advantage of shooting with the newer HD one is that at some point if someone wants an HD version, they can get it. You don't have that advantage if you shoot SD. Also, shooting in HD allows you to crop in during editing while still maintaining full SD resolution. I've found this very useful for the few friends' weddings i've gotten roped into doing. I'll set up the HD cam unattended in the back, zoomed out to get the entire wedding party. Then while editing i can crop down to just the couple during the vows and such.