actually I'm pretty sure that the 5Dii is actually a bit more than 30pfs like 30.xxx fps

Dave

"actually I'm pretty sure that the 5Dii is actually a bit more than 30pfs like 30.xxx fps"


How can I see this?

Neo Scene defaults to converting the camera's 30.0 fps to 29.97 fps. This helps your post as most tools and output formats are 29.97 (DVD, BluRay.) The "Convert 24p" control is for cameras that have pulldown, real 24 on 60i. If you only have a 60i (regular HDV) or 30p source (Canon 5D) the 24p results will have field/frame blending. For 60i sources the results are quite good (I use this will my HDV sources) but 30p source to 24p, that is not so nice.

David Newman
CTO, CineForm

David, to understand the 30 > 29.97 done in NeoScene fully, please explain:


If I:

1. Start a new project in Vegas
2. Set properties to 1920x1080 and 29.97
3. Bring in a 5D2 original 30 fps clip/event on the time line and then change properties of this clip to to "undersample rate" of 0.999 which then results in 29.97 fps and select "disable resample". So that the 30 fps footage now plays back at 29.97.
4. Then render this event out to Cineform AVI 1920x1080 29.97 fps

QUESTION:

Do I then have the exact same result as if I would use NeoScene and have it automatically convert my 5D2 30 fps footage to new 29.97 Cineform AV files?

(except of course the level change that NeoScene does.)


Best & thanks in advance for clarifying this
Lars

Neo Scene does all that, and adds the audio pitch correction (in addtion to the time stretch) -- I don't know if Vegas is doing that.

David, so having NeoScene do that 30 fps > 29.97 would be quicker and more convenient right?

"How can I see this?"

Very difficult to see this. You'd need a lot of numbered frames in the source and then check frame by frame. You can easily see what Vegas believes the frame rate of the media to be by RClicking the media and checnking its properties.

The difference between 30fps and 29.9xxx is is so minor that you can simply run the source at the target frame rate. It's impossible to detect a 4% change in frame rate and this is WAY less than that. Even the minor shift in audio pitch will go unnoticed.


30p to 24p is a real nightmare. The only real solution is optical processing such as After Effects pixel by pixel method. Even that without care can break. Example , watch towards the end. There's similar techniques available for free in VDub but hard to drive. Using either of those expect very long render times in HD.

One way out suggestion, simply play the 30fps at 24fps. If most / all of your motion is camera moves of static objects no one will notice. Even if you do have people walking / cars driving past then the slomo look is not that horrid. Nothing you can do about the audio of course, anything more than a 10% pitch shift is inviting problems.

Bob.