Slow render - advice please

Maverick wrote on 11/9/2009, 3:09 PM
In one of my other threads I mentioned that rendering seemed slow.

Just to update...

I have now installed W7 32bit (64 was giving too many issues) and Pro 8.0c.

CPU is AMD Phenom 940 Black 3GHz and 3.25 RAM available.

I am working on a project originally set out under XP. Just tried to render the first 1 min 9 ses and 14 frames for a test. The event (avi) had previously been rendered from 8.0c and now contains no effect, fades, etc. There is one soundtrack added.

I have 'Maximum number of rendering threads' set to 4.

When I check CPU usage in Task Manager I see that one core is using around 20%, one at around 55% and the other two at 30-40% with the Usage at the bottom showing just 25%.

Processes shows the CPU usage shared soley between System Idle and Vegas.

So far 15 % (2 of 8) has taken just over 5 minutes. I would have expected it to be quicker than this and more processor power to be used.

Is there something I need to do in my setup or is the above to be expected?

Any advice, please?

Edit: After 10 minutes it's now showing estimated time of around 50 minutes - jsut for a section a little over 1 minutes long!

Comments

Soniclight wrote on 11/9/2009, 8:50 PM
Sounds like something is way off.
Can't offer much but a few things to consider:

--- First, do you have any other program on your system that could uses a lot of power akin to Vegas to compare with--is it also slow or sluggish, etc.? If so, it's more of a system issue than necessarily a Vegas ><Win7 one.

--- You mentioned you tried 64 bit but switched back to 32. Was the 32 a clean install or upgrade from Vista?

-- Was Vegas 8 installed fresh and/or its program settings migrated/transferred from Vista?

-- I'm still on XP on a Pentium dual-core I built years ago, so I don't know enough about how Windows now handles Services and so on--such as any Sony/Vegas related ones. Are you sure all needed Services, etc. are working as Vegas needs them, i.e. on Auto or Manual or ?

-- When you installed Vegas, did you set the RAM to maximum usage and/or what other performance settings in Vegas or in Win7 need to be addressed?

All that said, some or none of above may not be relevant yet there may be some issue with how Vegas is communicating with your system -- as it is now. If stuff under-the-hood has changed since you last ran Vegas successfully and rendering normally it can have negative effects.

Last, again, I don't know enough about how cores and threads work, but from what I've read it is sometimes not the number of threads allocated that make something work best, but how and what type = more treads is not always necessarily faster. But do some research on this, don't take my word for it.

Hopefully someone can help you out on this.

farss wrote on 11/9/2009, 10:45 PM
Which codec are you rendering to?
Although you say you've applied no FXs by any chance have you moved the track level fader off 100%.

If the CPU's cores are running well below 100% like yours are I'm inclined to think the problem lies outside of Vegas. Maybe your HDD is abnormally slow for some reason. The other possibility is that your AVI file is uncompressed. The file size for that will be HUGE and simply getting the data off the HDD takes so long the CPU will be idling waiting for the disk i/o system to deliver the data.

Bob.

Maverick wrote on 11/10/2009, 2:28 AM
Thanks for the advice

All installs have been clean as my previous OS was XP.

My thoughts were of an issue outside of Vegas. The avi event of just over 1 minutes is 260MB (is that excessively large)?

The projects and it's files are on drive G with Vegas's temp files on D.

The track level fader is 100% and no envelopes at all.

I have just pre-rendered another section of exactly the same length (but all PNG files for slide show) which includes transitions, envelopes, and lots of track motion and this took 38 second using the avi (as before - I always pre-render to avi) with Best set.

I then moved to another section (same size) which was all video captured from Mini DV. There is only one Compiosit Level change in part of an event otherwise, all similar to first above. This, too, rendered fast in just under 40 seconds.

So it seems that it is the avi file.

May I ask what the best method for rendering from one project to add to another so that I don't get the above issue?

Thanks again.

Edit: By setting RAM to maximum usage do you mean Dynamic RAM (currently set at 128M)? I have 4G RAM installed but, obviously, only just over 3 available. I'll probably set Dynamic RAM to 1024 - that sound about OK? Although, in this issue I wouldn't have expected it to make any difference.
farss wrote on 11/10/2009, 6:14 AM
"The avi event of just over 1 minutes is 260MB (is that excessively large)?"

No, in the right ballpark for it to be DV25 i.e. 25Mbps. Vegas should fly through this in better than realtime on most PCs.

" I always pre-render to avi"

Care to explain this in greater detail?

Do you render to a new file, close your current project and bring the AVI file you just rendered into that?

On the other hand if you prerender to a new track something else maybe going on.

"So it seems that it is the avi file"

I seriously doubt this. The time it takes to render DV File A to DV file B is irrelevalant of the content of the file.

[i"May I ask what the best method for rendering from one project to add to another so that I don't get the above issue?"[/i]

What I do is render to a new file. Then I have a "master" project that I use to assemble the pieces. I close any open instances of Vegas and open a new instance. Just to ensure nothing funky is going on.

Bob.



Maverick wrote on 11/10/2009, 3:16 PM
When I do a selective pre-render (usually to check how a transition looks, etc) I use the avi (DV template).

I seemed to remember reading about doing it this way when I had Vegas 3. Never changed from that since.

What I do is render to a new file. Then I have a "master" project that I use to assemble the pieces. I close any open instances of Vegas and open a new instance. Just to ensure nothing funky is going on.

That's basically how I go about making the final edit.

Thanks.
Soniclight wrote on 11/11/2009, 12:25 AM
Maverick,

Well, good thing others chipped in with more relevant tips :) And hopefully you'll slove this soon. As far as the dynamic RAM thing, as you pointed out, that's not really applicable to your situation.

That said, when replying to you in my first note, I was in Vegas so I checked mine and also found the 128 Mb in there -- I swore I had set it to maximum quite a while ago, maybe it reset when I intalled 8.c. Dunnno. Not 100% sure if higher is better but common sense seems to point that way, so I reset it to the 1024 my XP 32 bit allows.
MPM wrote on 11/11/2009, 10:57 AM
FWIW Maverick, for fastest render times...
The basic setup you have should do fine in 7, 32 or 64... That 64 gave you prob may hint that things aren't all well under the hood so-to-speak. As baseline I'd suggest checking out that end of things -- components, drivers etc -- as well as checkout out how your m/board bios is set up... as you're still at 3 gig, could be it's never been set up properly, & that can have an effect in 7 [only reason to have a phenom black is to o/c, if only slightly, as the 1st extra .2-.3 is free, no hassles involved].

With your PC behaving [& maybe benching] as it should, 1st suggestion would be to duplicate your render conditions in a new project to see if it's the project or what you're doing in the current one. From what you've posted you've more or less done that & it appears to be one avi file. 2nd step IMHO, if it matters [as in you're going to be using that format avi again] would be to determine why -- is that particular avi file screwed up, or is it that you're having problems handling it in 7 &/or Vegas? A known good file in the same format might be the easiest way to confirm a bad file. GSpot, GraphStudio, & Process Explorer [Sysinternals/Microsoft] can help check how the avi is handled in 7 & in Vegas. In my experience so far there are an awful lot of additional files & processes involved in 7 vs XP, just to decode/play most any video. A missing/not installed Direct Show [DS] filter, just like a conflicting one, can drastically effect decoding, & thus (re)encoding performance. Outside of Vegas your graphics card drivers can have an effect, as most of the current crop have some sort of video decoding hardware &/or driver acceleration, but I've had problems there with my ATI & it hasn't been reflected at all in Vegas (knock wood).
Maverick wrote on 11/13/2009, 1:44 PM
Thanks for all the advice.

The same avi entered into a new instance of 8.0c with no transitions, etc. still took just as long. I assume, then, that the file is at fault. As it will be only used the once I'll put up with the slow render for now.

The rest of the project whizzes along nicely so it seems everything else regarding my setup is OK.

Cg=heers.