I didn't realize that when you edit and save the trimmed media that it would split them, but apparently you're exactly right because I just proved it to myself. I also tried to drag several separated clips onto the timeline and it doesn't line up the audio with the video...in fact it staggers them one after the other.
Is there a workaround or do I have to align each one (or run Excalibur's Gap Wizard) after placing on the timeline?
Update: I just opened a bunch of these clips and it invariably puts the last .w64 in front of everything else...what the...? Anyway, it will probably be worh my while to render all of them back to .avi. I guess I'll go look for a script.

Thanks,
Randy

Randy,

"Rendering" a project and "Saving" a project are two different things. If you save a Vegas project, it creates a .veg file that associates events & properties with media on your hard drive (or several hard drives). The reason to save a .veg file "with trimmed media" is if 1) you want to move the project to another computer, or 2) if you "might" want to do some tweaking in the future, and perhaps the reference media files that the project events are drawn from are gone or have been moved, or 3) if you want to archive the project, but don't want to waste space on media you didn't use.

If you own Acid Pro, it's the same as saving a project as an acd-zip. It simply means that the trimmed media is saved with the prject and that the .veg file doesn't have to "look" for the source media. It would make no sense for this function to combine audio & video into a single file -- that's what "rendering" does. If I want to bring it all together, I render it. If I want to "save the project," and be able to tweak it later if necessary, saving with "trimmed media" allows me to open the .veg file with my 4 video tracks and 6 audio tracks -- SEPARATED -- so I can add a transition to video track 3, lower the volume of audio track 2 & boost the high end of audio track 4 -- all of which would be impossible if they were combined.

That's why saving a project and rendering are two different things. Saving "with trimmed media" is just an option, not a different way of rendering.

HTH

Believe it or not HTH, I can relate to everything you just mentioned (except that I don't have Acid and would compare Sonar's .bun file instead of acd-zip). I had no intention of using the .veg file anyway (1 video/audio track with .AVIs strewn across it) I just wanted to save the edited "keepers" to another folder (and import later into the main project) and delete the old Capture folder to free up space.
So it would be nice if there is a way to keep V4 from separating them as I am now having a hell of a time using these clips (details upon request). It's probably user error since I've never heard anyone complaining about this but here's my problem:
Okay, I import these files back into V4 and drag onto the timeline and the video and audio are pefectly staggered on the video and audio tracks. So I have to pull all of the audio over to sync with the video.
I'll leave it at that for now, because I feel sure I've done something wrong here.
TIA,
Randy

I think I should go ahead and elaborate on those details because if I can't get this issue resolved I'll have to re-capture/edit several hours of hundreds of clips (or sync hundreds of clips) :
As I mentioned, when I drag these files onto the timeline they are staggered on the video/audio tracks. Seems there would be no problem, I could just "select to end" with the audio and drag them over to sync with the first video and they should all be synced, right?! The problem is the video AVIs and the w64s are different durations! On some, the video is longer, some the audio is longer and on some they are exactly the same.
I just know you guys are going to show me a simple solution, right?
TIA,
Randy

If you turn off Auto-Ripple (Ctrl-L, or Options --> Auto-Ripple), does this still happen?

Pheew!! Thanks John!
Yes sir, auto ripple is turned off.
Randy

It would be a nice option for Vegas to be able to notice if the only audio & video on the timeline for a certain event are both from the same original clip and generate a single .avi file containing both audio & video when doing the "save trimmed media" thingie. For that matter, it would also be very nice if we could select WAV instead of W64 in order to retain compatability with other non-SONY software. But, both of these issues have been hashed in the past.

What might be more of a help is a way to render each clip into a separate .avi file. I seem to recall that there is a script that individually renders each section between markers all at a swoop. Perhaps someone here knows which script that is and where it is. You could start at the beginning and type M, Ctrl-Alt-rightarrow, M, Ctrl-Alt-rightarrow, .... etc. through the entire timeline to place the markers at the beginning of each clip, then run this rendering script. For that matter, there's probably already a script available to insert the markers automatically. But, even if you have to place the markers manually it would still seem to be less work than you're doing now, and it would keep the audio in the same file with the video.

Thank you Kelly,
This being the case, maybe my smooth process ain't so smooth after all eh? Armed with this info I can see I have a lot of work ahead but it could be lessened tenfold if I could figure out a way to throw them on the timeline and have them line up. As I mentioned earlier the video length is just slightly different than the audio, so each one will have to be manually adjusted to sync before rendering...really?
Thanks again Kelly,
Randy

>As I mentioned earlier the video length is just slightly different than the audio

Can I just pull out this sentence and ask you to verify it in isolation?

Your avi file was ok before the save-as-trimmed. Afterwards, the resulting avi and w64 files had different lengths. Is this correct?

I've not seen this. I use save-as-trimmed in all my projects, simply because I'm going to archive them and don't want to archive the chaff. But then I continue to work with the same veg project that was save-as-trimmed; I don't create a new project and attempt to reuse the separated files. Perhaps this is why I've never noticed the problem with file lengths. Most disconcerting if true.

Pheew!! Thanks John! Yes sir, auto ripple is turned off.

Just so I am sure, did this fix the problem?

Thanks guys,
>>Your avi file was ok before the save-as-trimmed. Afterwards, the resulting avi and w64 files had different lengths. Is this correct?<<
Absolutely correct.
>>Just so I am sure, did this fix the problem? <<
No John, I just meant Pheew, I'm (VERY) glad you're here trying to help and the answer to your question is auto ripple was already turned off ( I only toggle it on temporarily under certain situations). Any other suggestions?
Thanks again guys,
Randy

Can someone please just tell me why and if I can change the fact that every time I select the AVI (in the media pool) then ctrl select the w64 (that goes with it) and drag it to the timeline, it staggers them one after the other? I must have something (not Auto-Ripple) selected, right?
TIA,
Randy

Don't know, Randy I really don't use the Media pool much.

Well I guess it's not a Media Pool problem BB because it does the same thing from the V4 Explorer. Have you not had this issue dragging from the V4 Explorer?....anyone?
Thanks BB,
Randy

I haven't seen it, at least I don't think I have, but maybe I'm not getting exactly what you describing. Can you break it down more, I'm having one of those "duh" moments. <wink>

It happens because they are two separate files. If you select any two (or more files) and drop them on the timeline, they're added sequentially. This is just the way Vegas works. In this case it seems odd because they are supposed to be the same event, and the placement looks odd because one is on the video track and one is on the audio track. However, if you were to select two video clips then they would get added one after the other. This is the same thing that is happening when you select an audio clip and a video clip.

Sorry, this wasn't very helpful, but hopefully it at least explains what is happening. I think what i would do is drag the video file onto the timeline and it will auto-snap to the end of the previous video event when you get close enough. Then drag the audio file onto the timeline and it will also autosnap to the end of the previous audio event. That's probably about the easiest it will get.

As far as them not being the same length, how much different are they? Remember that the video files come in 0.033366666 second increments (frame lengths) and audio files come in 0.000022675736 second increments (sample lengths). It's very rare that any multiples of these lengths will exactly match each other. For that matter, audio is often grouped in bunches of samples so that the nearest length the audio file can be to the video file could be off my a large number of samples. If the lengths are different by less than a frame then this is probably a normal result of the difference between frame rates and sample rates.

I think Kelly beat me to it BB (except he also explained why).

Well that makes (perfect) sense Kelly. I just checked a few clips and the most difference I ran across was .021 seconds.
The project is High School Volleyball highlights that I was shooting up to 100 feet away....need I say more? I'm embarrassed to say that I thought this was more of an issue because I was seeing/hearing the natural latency of the ball smack. When zoomed in on the timeline, .021 can look huge. I was thinking I was going to have to sync every video/audio but like Kelly said (implied), it's an insignificant amount. I think if I drag them each on the timeine while reasonably zoomed, it shouldn't be too big of a deal to line them up.

So thank you very much Kelly, you've not only satisfied my curiousity but also shown me it wasn't worth fretting over. My apologies for making a big deal out of it.

Thanks everyone,
Randy

Randy,

Sorry I didn't get the gist of what you were saying. I thought you were seeing big offsets between the audio and video.

The light/sound difference can definitely be a killer. I ran into it when doing track and field video last spring. The puff of smoke from the starter gun and the resulting gunshot audio were sometimes 3-4 frames apart.

I just finished my volleyball music video. When you finish yours, upload it so we can see it. Here's mine: Volleyball Music Video