There is simply nothing true in that first post.

First of all, in Cineframe 24, you cannot select a shutter speed lower than 1/60. But 1/60 is irrelevant to the discussion, as 24P at 1/60 looks just fine on an XL2, DVX, VariCam, CineAlta, or film camera.

Secondly, the VariCam runs at VARIABLE speeds. It doesn't just shoot 60p and then "drop frames"! It runs at 24Hz for 24P. It runs at 30Hz for 30P. It runs at 60Hz for 60p. That's how it works. It samples at the frame rate, and then when recording to tape it duplicates frames to round out the recording to being 60p, since the recording medium requires 60 frames per second. Just like the 24P cameras add 3:2 pulldown to round out their recording to 29.97fps. On capture the editing program removes the duplicate frames, restoring the original, true, 24 frames per second.

CF24 does not do this, or anything like it. CF24 results in uneven motion sampling and variable resolution between frames! In CF24 you get a sequence of five frames where two have about 425 lines of resolution, followed by two with about 475 lines, followed by one at 575 lines, and then the cycle repeats. You don't have to step through it frame-by-frame to see that it's "wrong", you can tell that just by watching the footage. Going through it frame-by-frame lets you see WHAT's wrong.

And if it's any consolation Barry you're not alone in reaching that conclusion.
I'd also challenge the assertion that simply because the Z1 or any camera for that matter does de-interlacing in camera it is a progressive camera. There is no way that any de-interlacing algorithm can achieve the same thing as taking a whole frame at once.
Even Sony understand this, they don't call it progressive scan for a very good reason. Having no interest myself in anything 24p none of this excites me one way or the the other but lets at least get the facts straight.
What I am interested in would be true 50p or 60p or better still 100p but I think that'll be a long time coming.
Bob.

Deinterlaced 1080i in the CF25 mode and 720/24-25p output of the frame converter of Varicam footage is basically the same image quality.

HDV, can you post EVIDENCE of this rather than statements? I've shown you mine, now you show me yours.

Basically it's like this. With Varicam you can shoot 24p or 60p and convert to 24p via the Panasonic rate converter. Either way you end up with the same image quality, with the difference that in the converted image you have this uneven motion that you can see during slow motion analysis, same as in the CF24p mode, and the shutter's lowest speed is 1/60 sec., same as in CF24.

Completely untrue.

If you shoot 24p on the VariCam, you will have motion rendition that exactly matches that of film shot at 24fps, or that of the CineAlta shot at 24psf, or the DVX or XL2 or IMX cameras running at 24p. It runs its CCD at 24hz, and images frames at equal spaces in time. Split-screen it with film, you'll see it exactly, exactly matches film motion.

The FX1 in CF24, on the other hand, can only run its CCD at 60hz (not 24). So its motion is made up of dropping and combining 60i fields. The result is uneven motion rendition, where a constant-speed object will render about 1/3 of its motion in one frame, and 2/3 in the next, then 1/3, then 2/3, etc.

You should read my posts properly. You can shoot straight 24p and have the perfect motion or 60p and after the variable frame converter pass end up with uneven motion.

Okay, granted -- I guess I misread that. Sorry.

But why would anyone shoot 60p and try to convert it down? The camera does native 24 (and, actually, native ANY frame rate from 1 to 33, plus 40 and 60). Converting from 60 down to 24 is something you just wouldn't do.

HDV,

You have misunderstood this, and I think I understand why.

There is *no pulldown* when shooting 60p slow motion with the Varicam.

Its CCDs record 60 progressive frames per second, and these are recorded as 60 progressive frames per second on the tape. All at perfectly even motion.

On playback at 24 progressive frames per second, you get exactly the same perfectly smooth slow motion as you would have gotten with an overcranked film camera.

Again, there is no pulldown, and the 60p on this camera is for overcranking only.

Well, yes that's true, but in relation to this statement:"the 60p on this camera is for overcranking only", no, that's not necessarily true. It is true in the context of a 24P timeline that 60p would be useful for slow motion, but you can also use this camera unrelated to 24p. You can use it as a full 60p production camera. Shooting sports for 720/60p broadcast, for example.