Sony DHR-1000 deck can't read DVCAM format ?

Kalevi wrote on 12/18/2006, 12:58 PM
I can't capture miniDV tapes in DVCAM format with Vegas and DHR-1000. DHR-1000 is runing in DV speed, so the footage looks like slowmotion and Vegas capture won't work. MiniDV format works fine and also DVCAM when I use large cassette. Is it so that the deck does not support DVCAM format in the case of miniDV cassette?

If so has anybody tried to use large cassette adapter (minDV to DVCAM)?

I am working in PAL environment.

Thanks!

Comments

monoparadox wrote on 12/18/2006, 3:05 PM
There were two versions of this deck if I remember correctly. They will both read DV or DVCAM, but each only wrote to DV or DVCAM. The DV version has a builtin tuner, the DVCAM version did not.
farss wrote on 12/18/2006, 9:49 PM
The HDR-1000 is the domestic variant I think, the DSR-30 the Pro one.
They'll only write DVCAM but will read DV or DVCAM.
However both those decks have very early firewire chips in them, make certain they are the only firewire device connected. Apart from that I've used the DSR-30 (in PAL) with Vegas to read both DV and DVCAM tapes, both sized shells work identically, the only difference is the amount of tape that fits in the cassette.

Bob.
Kalevi wrote on 12/20/2006, 2:13 AM
More information:

It seems that DHR-1000 NP video deck only can't read Sony's small miniDV cassettes which have beend recorded with SONY HVRZ1 camcorder in DVCAM format (PAL, 16:9, anam.). This is odd because, miniDV cassette recorded with sony 500 series pro camcorder in DVCAM format runs OK. Does this mean that HVRZ1 is not compatible with DHR-1000 NP video deck?

I have asked this also from Sony - waiting their reply. Please answer if you have same experiences.
farss wrote on 12/20/2006, 4:16 AM
If by "I have asked this also from Sony" mean you Madison Media Software, the division that writes Vegas I think you're asking the wrong people, they've got about as much information on this as you or I.
I don't have any experience with this as we very rarely use Z1s to record anything other than HDV, recording DV or DVCAM seems counter intuitive to us. Worst case we downconvert in the camera / VCR, best case we do it in Vegas if we're going for SD delivery.

All that aside though what happens when you simply try to play the tape out in the deck with a analogue monitor connected to the deck?
Have you tried another more recent design VCR, say the DSR-11?

Does the tape contain ONLY DVCAM material?
We've certainly found mixing HDV and DV / DVCAM on the one tape to be a good way to confuse everything. On our test bench we have one tape for testing DV camcorders and one for testing HDV camcorders and woe betide anyone who mixes them up.

I don't have a DHR-1000, we sold ours off long ago but we still have a DSR-30 which is basically the same deck, I can try this out for you in the next few days if you need further assistance.
My email address is in my profile if you need any direct assistance.

Bob.
peteros wrote on 12/20/2006, 12:58 PM
I used to have a PAL DHR-1000 for a few years. The story is very simple: up to certain revision of its firmware the deck WAS able to play back DvCam-recorded tapes smoothly. The upgraded models (still DHR-1000, not DRS-30) have this "hidden" option blocked. No need to explain why...
farss wrote on 12/20/2006, 2:05 PM
Are you sure?
I thought it was the ability to record DV that was hidden.
Back then DV was not supported by Sony from memory.

All this is a long time ago and I wasn't that much interested back then.

In any case this guys deck does playback DVCAM quite happily, the issue isn't getting it to play DVCAM, he's only having an issue with DVCAM tapes from the Z1, he reports that it works fine with other DVCAM tapes.

Bob.
Kalevi wrote on 12/20/2006, 2:53 PM
Yes, only MiniDV cassette recorded by HVRZ1 camcorder in DVCAM format seems to be the problem. And there is no HD footage in the same tape. I have tried about 5 different cassettes shooted with HVRZ1 in different locations and non of them plays as they should. MiniDV cassette recorded by DSR-570 camcorder in DVCAM format works fine and also large cassette (normal) recorded by DSR-570 in DVCAM format (or DV).

Every now and then deck finds the right speed (faster for DVCAM) for above mentioned cassettes but I can't find any reason for that. Anyhow the playback won't continue long - only few minutes.

Cassettes I'm talking about have been captured previously by DSR11 deck and also by HVRZ1 camcorder it self and everything went fine.

Also the problem is not in the capture program or in the pc because I monitor the deck directly from analog outputs of the deck and I can see immediately if the playback is ok or not.

I would appreciate if you, Bob, could try your DSR-30 deck with tapes recorded by HVRZ1, in DVCAM, sd-resolution, anamorphic and - well - I am in PAL area if that matters.

Kalevi
peteros wrote on 12/20/2006, 3:17 PM
I never had any z1-recorded taped in those old times, of course. However, I remember that I happened to experienced some palyback problems with tapes recorded on some top of the line broadcast DvCam recoders. DHR used to chew of on them for a few minutes before "catching on".
Kalevi wrote on 12/20/2006, 4:40 PM
Yes Peteros, that seems to bee the same problem. Did you find any workaround?

Kalevi
farss wrote on 12/20/2006, 6:33 PM
OK,
just had a talk to one of the old hands.
I'd got it all backwards, just for the record.

The DHR-1000 was a DV deck although it could, sometimes, handle DVCAM but could choke on fast motion. Certainly from what I've been told Sony never claimed it'd handle DVCAM, good luck if it did. We've found that many non DVCAM speced devices will playout DVCAM but again that's just by good luck / accident.

The DSR-30 is / was a DVCAM deck that'll play DVCAM and DV. It can be coaxed into recording DV via a 'secret' trick, technically it'll only records in DVCAM.

Bob.

peteros wrote on 12/21/2006, 1:51 AM
Bob: that's 100% true, but my old hands add this: older PAL DHRs handled DVCam more stably than those with newer firmware
No workaround, unfortunately. As this model's been discontinued for years, don't expect any changes.
farss wrote on 12/21/2006, 3:06 AM
We're in PAL land and sold off our DHR-1000 a few years ago, we only hang onto the DSR-30 as there's still a few people who use it for online or is it linear editing. I've only tried doing that kind of editing once and well, once you get the hang of it it's kind of neat, and quick.

Bob.
Kalevi wrote on 12/21/2006, 3:55 AM
Thank you for the answers, it seems that I sould not trust DHR-1000 too much in the case of DVCAM format. Anyhow I bought it resently mainly for backup purposes for multicam live projects. I also capture those live shoots directly to harddrive so this recorder is only for extra security and I can use DV format. Of cource I hoped I could use it as a basic edit palyer also but that seems to be too much.

In an other forum one fellow said his DHR worked well (PAL) until he got it serviced and after that the player behaved as I described. I quess they did the firmware update.

And yes, maybe I should try linear editing - just for fun - have never tried. There is a nice control panel in DHR.

Thank You

Kalevi