Title/Text, Protype. NetBlue - What to Use?

Profiler wrote on 3/13/2012, 5:55 PM

Hello everyone,

I'm been pulling my hair out (what little is left) for the past couple of weeks trying to figure out which text generator I should use.

Here is what I'm wanting to accomplish - it's fairly simple. I need the easiest and most direct way of adding text some animated text over a "talking head" video. Basically I want the bullet points to appear at the relevant times in the clip. In some cases, I want each word to show up as they are spoken by the talent.

At first I thought ProType would be the best solution, but I just can't seem to get used to the interface. (While I never worked with the previous version of Protype, based on some YouTube videos that I've watched the interface seemed much easier to work with - especially when working with preset animations.) In addition, I can't seem to locate a fee or free training resource for the new Protype.

While the Netblue plug in is way cool for creating fancy text graphics, I think its probably overkill for simple text needs.

So that brings me back to the simple Title/Text option. The issue I have here is that I end up having to create a separate clip for each item on a bulleted list.

I'm thinking that there must be an easier way. The key is (no pun intended) that I want to be able to precisely keyframe when a certain line of text animates in.

Any and all suggestions are very much appreciated.

Thanks!!!

Comments

videoITguy wrote on 3/13/2012, 9:55 PM

any of the above will work....
What I have chosen to do -- is spend the time to learn ProType Titler within Vegas - IT IS NOT that difficult, and when you come right down to brass tacks - it can lay down just about anything the ordinary person needs for good titling management. Take the time to learn it.

[r]Evolution wrote on 3/13/2012, 10:07 PM

When it comes to text builds the way you're describing, I prefer to use Photoshop.

I build my text using the correct frame size in Photoshop with my various texts on different layers. Import the psd into Vegas and animate them with transitions scooting the different layers to time them accordingly.

You can either Nest a .veg or use the Track Folders to make a Folder of .psd Layers for organization.

For me, this is just far simpler than any of the titlers with their various quirks for alignment and such. Seems less taxing on my machine as well.

ps - NewBlue Titler Pro in its current state is CRAP!

Profiler wrote on 3/13/2012, 11:40 PM

@videoITguy, I believe I agree with you. It seems like it will address the bulk of my needs. Do you have any training resources that you can recommend for the ProType? I've called Sony and they don't sell one and the documentation is very sparse. This could be an opportunity for any ProType experts out there to create and sell a niche online training course.

Where I seem to keep getting my #*($ kicked is applying animations. It seems that you can't apply them to existing text, you have to select a collection first then change the default text. When I attempt this, the animation gets messed up, so I'm obviously doing something incorrectly.

@[r]Evolution - I know enough about PS to be considered dangerous :) For the record, I'm by no means a professional video producer/editor - just the point person in my company for getting some videos online. I do appreciate your suggestion though.

videoITguy wrote on 3/13/2012, 11:58 PM

The only title released for Training in ProType Titler that I know is the
Volume 9 DVD from Vasst.com. Which is a good place to start.

More to the point that you raise...whether anyone will ever make a title to show mastery of the software - WELL, I doubt that it will ever happen...the conclusion of the software industry has been for a very long time - the cost to produce far outweighs the gain to profit from such an endeavor. Sad, but that is really the state of things as we know it.

Steve Mann wrote on 3/14/2012, 12:17 AM

What's wrong with the Sony Titler? This sample took me about 15-minutes to create.
(Used Sony Vegas 11 and Photoshop 5.0)

Grazie wrote on 3/14/2012, 12:22 AM

(very good Steve - lol!)

xberk wrote on 3/14/2012, 12:46 AM

>>Basically I want the bullet points to appear at the relevant times in the clip. In some cases, I want each word to show up as they are spoken by the talent.
......I want to be able to precisely keyframe when a certain line of text animates in.

Sounds like you want to do some precise timing. Sort of "title lip-sync" ProType is weak in this department. No sync cursor to match the ProType preview window with the timeline.. Likely you can use any titler you are familiar with --- but -- you may have to put each word or bullet point on a different video track. This way you can precisely control the timing. No titler I know about can do timing in sync with speech. You have to do it the old fashion way .. one step at a time.

I'd like to see how this comes out.

Rory Cooper wrote on 3/14/2012, 4:26 AM

I use a few titlers because each one is different and is strong in different areas.

For your clip use standard text create makers at the relevant points and line the text up to markers.

Pro type Titler is awesome for text animation if you create an animation then save it. Now you can drop AS MANY on the PTT time line.

Sqeeze the animation on the left or right = grey slider and then drop in as many as you need and edit individually . You will have to watch your timing no SYNC TO CURSOR….!!!!!!!!
So set your TL TO SECONDS and match numbers/seconds in PTT. This will change to match the TL.

Rory Cooper wrote on 3/14/2012, 6:06 AM

Some tips for PTT

When using the Pro type titler start with the text block xy functions activate even if you are not going to use them
Once you setup the character xy you cannot activate text block xy afterward.
Start with the text block then work your way down to word and then character box.

Set up your TL to seconds the PTT TL will match time to Help sync.

Rory Cooper wrote on 3/14/2012, 8:31 AM

When saving a text block animation save it with the time ie slide_3.6seconds
When creating a new block sequence of say 33 seconds using the saved animation then squeeze each section back to 3.6 seconds original as the sequence will be dropped on the timeline stretched to 33 seconds

Guy S. wrote on 3/14/2012, 5:30 PM

<<Some tips for PTT>>

These were either great demos of ProType and your skills with it... Or a not-so-subtle way of giving it the finger. ;)

Guy

xberk wrote on 3/14/2012, 6:46 PM

>>Set up your TL to seconds the PTT TL will match time to Help sync.

Great advice Rory. You certainly have shown us in those clips how ProType can perform in the "hands" of a Pro.

Paul

Profiler wrote on 3/15/2012, 1:09 AM

Much thanks for everyone's input and suggestions - much appreciated!

For this short project, I ended up going "old school" and used the Title/Text generator and simply put each of the words on a separate track exactly where I wanted them to appear. Not real fancy I know, but it got the job done.

For those who may be interested, here is a link to the final product on YouTube:

Remember, I don't hold myself out to be a pro editor - so go easy on me :)

Rory Cooper wrote on 3/15/2012, 4:22 AM

Working with text for video can be a real challenge the two areas that can make a huge difference is color and type face, some rules like not mixing seraph and san seraph and not using too many type faces can guide you to getting better results.

Some things on color that can help

1. Your talking head has a serious blue tie ….seems to be a part of his brand image. So by using text with a light tone of that blue with a grey outline like suit would look more appealing and more importantly tie the speaker to the text.
Color in type on video is a matter of taste but I find setting type color and tone from the vid or talking head helps a lot
For example the text = “Overall work quality” is in a color/tone that is set the same as the background and looked more appealing than the yellow.

2. Use panels. For multiple text same as lower third binds elements together panels for text does the same so a light grey gradient panel behind- fonts – format etc would help.
3. Watch your neg and positive spacing between your elements the text is way over left. Make the text a little smaller

Steve Mann wrote on 3/15/2012, 9:08 AM

Profiler - Real Name: (hidden),
Your video is pretty good - your decision to use the more simple tool tells me that you were overthinking the problem. Many editors tend to forget that time is money and try to amaze the client with the latest and most expensive solutions to what is an otherwise simple problem. (Avid, Adobe and Apple come to mind).

To what Rory said:
"3. Watch your neg and positive spacing between your elements the text is way over left. Make the text a little smaller"

You have too much "dead air" to the presenter's left. Put something there. A graphic, a logo or something.

xberk wrote on 3/15/2012, 2:10 PM

Hey. Came out fine. But I agree, titles are a bit large. Rory's really giving good advice on fonts and color .. but the main thing was syncing the titles and you did it well I'd say ... so often I forget the idea of using mulitple vidoe tracks to isolate and time things. Vegas handles that so well.

We lost a bit of his hand at 1:15 into the matte .. nothing big but I noticed it ...

Worthwhile discussion here!

Profiler wrote on 3/16/2012, 3:47 AM

This is a great discussion and I'm learning lots!

Truth be told the "talent" in the video and the "editor" are one in the same - me!!! :)

I realy appreciate the insights on font size, type, color, and spacing. Having no formal graphic art background, I tend to struggle with these elements in most projects. Most of the time I take a trial and error approach until I get a combination that looks decent at best and at worst, readable. Rory, I'll be applying your suggestions in future projects.

@xberk, the track method worked for me and was quite easy to implement. I set the font color, size, etc as an element on one track. I then duplicated the track a few times and simply changed the text and position for what I needed and - bam - I was in business.

Leee wrote on 3/16/2012, 4:32 AM

I'm not sure if this was mentioned already, (I didn't carefully read EVERYTHING that was posted above, so I apologize if I missed it), but this is how I would have done it.

Instead of using separate tracks for each new line of text, I would have created several clips on the same track. Starting with the first clip, with the first line of text. Line it up with the section of audio track to match just where he starts speaking the first "cue" word. Then copy and paste that clip, and paste the second clip right after the first while adding the second line of text to the newly created clip. Paste a third clip for the third line, etc. etc. That way if you are using any effects on the text, they will be copied to the next clip as well.

As I've said before, there are a lot of folks here that have way more professional experience with Vegas and with Videography (is that a word?) in general, so maybe this seems like an obvious way of doing it, or perhaps I'm missing something about doing it this way. But I just thought I'd throw that idea out, just in case it might be helpful to someone. That's usually how I do that kind of text work, if there's an easier way, I don't really know what it could be.