urgent FS100 video aspect ratio question

Ivan Lietaert wrote on 11/10/2008, 6:31 AM
I 've been testing the canon fs100. When I open its video files (mpg) in Vegas, they seem squashed together. No matter what I try, I cannot get the correct aspect ratio. Not in the preview screen and not in rendered video.

Edit: the only way to get what I want is to use 'pan and crop', 16x9. Is that the only way to get it to work? Canon's ImageMixer, which comes with the camera, shows the image with the correct aspect ratio.

Comments

Eugenia wrote on 11/10/2008, 9:07 AM
You need to setup the right project properties. Open project properties dialog, and use the yellow icon, match media, to load one of these .m2ts files and let the system set the right properties for your footage.
Ivan Lietaert wrote on 11/10/2008, 9:38 AM
The canon fs100 films in SD. The files on de memory card have the extension .mpg
Setting project properties like you described does not solve the issue. The only way to get it right is using 'pan and crop'; for now...

EDIT: My mistake, the files have het .mod extension
ritsmer wrote on 11/10/2008, 11:37 AM
I just tested a FS100.

The Pixel Aspect Ratio should be set to NTSC DV Widescreen or PAL DV Widescreen in Project- or media properties - as also Eugenia suggests.

When you render - check "Strech video to fill output frame"

BTW: what came out of my testing?: not impressed at all - so I ended up buying a Sony DSC-T500 for its convincing 720p capabilities.
Ivan Lietaert wrote on 11/10/2008, 1:45 PM
Sorry guys, your suggestions don't solve the issue. The preview stays squashed together, and the output also, even if I check' 'stretch video'.
My solution was to film in 4:3 ratio and to use 'pan and crop' to get the 16:9 format, because I was in a hurry to start filming for real.

About testing, well, the non-profit had already bought the camera, so with 'testing' I simply meant to get it to work properly.
I filmed at night, in low light conditions, and I think the grain is too obvious. (It's the same as my canon zr800). The cmos sensor that comes with the hv20/30 or the hg100 does a much better job, but of course, is more than double the price.

Watch my movie here:
http://www.vimeo.com/2206261
Anothe movie, shot with the same camera, shows the 'squashedness', but is mutch better in lighting:http://vimeo.com/2203616
gogiants wrote on 11/10/2008, 11:31 PM
I have to admit I'm curious why it isn't working for you... a couple questions:

1) Open VMS and go to one of the files in the explorer. Single-click on the file, and look at the bottom of the VMS screen. It should show you details of the file format, such as the pixel count (e.g. 640x480) etc. What does it say for files where you film wide with the FS100?

2) Sometimes people miss how to do the match properties thing that Eugenia suggested. Can you describe what you did, and what the project properties were set to afterwards?
Eugenia wrote on 11/11/2008, 2:36 AM
Ivan, I am sure you do something wrong here. Please record in 16:9, load the files on Vegas, and then use the PAL Widescreen project properties template.

If this still doesn't work, please record 3 seconds in widescreen, and upload the original file somewhere so I can download it and check it out here. Not re-encoded.
Ivan Lietaert wrote on 11/11/2008, 5:10 AM
Ok, so here are the properties that Vegas shows:
720x576x32; 25fps, interlaced, (duration of the clip) MPEG-2
The file has a .mod extension and is recognised both by wmp and vms instantly.

I did match the project properties to this clip, like Eugenia described.

The preview screen shows the squashedness. Both 'simulate device aspect ratio' and 'scale video to fit preview window' are ticked off.

I'm using VMS8d Plat build 139.

You can download sample video here:
http://www.vimeo.com/2213586

Ivan Lietaert wrote on 11/11/2008, 6:21 AM
PROBLEM SOLVED

I finally got it right. This is the workflow:
1) Using Canon's Imagemixer 3 software, copy movies from camera FS100 to pc.
2) Watch, view, select movies in Imagemixer 3
3) Export selected clips ONE BY ONE to computer. (Batch export is not possible.)
4) In Vegas, locate the exported file with explorer. Now the clip will have the correct aspect ratio.

It is a sad thing that Imagemixer does not allow batch export. My mistake was to copy the clips from flash card to pc directly, and then accessing them in Vegas, while not 'exporting' in Imagemixer.
Chienworks wrote on 11/11/2008, 7:53 AM
I've never met a piece of software included with a camera that wasn't thoroughly user-hostile.

Another option for one-offs, which may or may not be available in the Studio version ... right-mouse-button click on the clip on the timeline and choose properties / media. There you can tell Vegas what the aspect ratio really should be if Vegas didn't figure it out automatically.
Ivan Lietaert wrote on 11/11/2008, 8:08 AM
You're right, Cin, and it does work for Studio.
Right-clicking on the video event, I can get the correct result by un-ticking 'maintain aspect ratio' or by changing the 'pixel aspect' in the second tab.
The latter also works in the project media tab.
califdon wrote on 11/12/2008, 5:51 PM
Wow! Got my FS100 a week ago, installed VMS yesterday, having the identical problem with aspect ratios, found this forum and this thread just now! I'm sure that this information will be enormously useful to me. I will post some other questions later, but this is great!
califdon wrote on 11/13/2008, 10:58 AM
Eugenia: "You need to setup the right project properties. Open project properties dialog, and use the yellow icon, match media, to load one of these .m2ts files and let the system set the right properties for your footage."

I'm a brand new user of VMS 9.0b and cannot find the "yellow icon". Also I don't understand what .m2ts files are.

I'm having exactly the same problem Ivan123 described, using Canon FS100 and the .mpeg files it generates.

Any guidance will be much appreciated.
Ivan Lietaert wrote on 11/13/2008, 11:35 AM
Eugenia made a mistake, I think, 'cause the fs100 generates .mod files (in standard defininition) and not .m2ts files (which are high definition files). For matching the project properties to the file propterties, hit 'file'<properties. Next to the 'template' description, there are three icons. The yellow one allows to browse to a video file. Locate that file, and Vegas will automatically match your project properties with the file properties.

I posted the solution to the aspect ratio issue earlier in this thread. You can set the pixel ratio in Vegas, so that is what I do.

califdon wrote on 11/13/2008, 8:08 PM
Thanks, Ivan123. Actually, I now have the aspect ratio working, thanks to YOUR comments about exporting clips from ImageMixer 3! I knew about the settings in Vegas, but it just didn't work until I followed your process. And thanks for the clarification of the yellow icon.

I'm still confused about the .mod or .m2ts files. I have never seen anything except .mpeg files from my Canon.

I do have another question, though. I'm disappointed that apparently I can't connect my Canon directly to Vegas and transfer the clips. When I try to do that, it just tells me to connect a video device (which I have already done and it's viewable in ImageMixer, but not detected by Vegas).

I'm really struggling with all this, since I'm new to video editing, and since I am interested at this time in creating Flash videos for use on my web sites, I currently have to use 3 different pieces of software: ImageMixer 3 to get the clips onto the computer, Vegas 9 to create the movie as an .mpeg, and Wondershare to convert the .mpeg to .flv for my web pages. Surely there's a more direct way to do this...??
Ivan Lietaert wrote on 11/13/2008, 9:44 PM
From what you describe, I think you launch the capture program that comes to Vegas. That step can be skipped! Simply use Vegas' explorer window to locate the directory (or even the sd-card) where the filmclips are stored and drag them to the timeline!

About .flv files: services like YouTube and Vimeo convert a video file to .flv on their server. There's no need to do it yourself (unless you have your own server, I guess). Just render your video to a progressive scan mp4 or wmv, and vimeo/youtube will take care of the rest!
califdon wrote on 11/15/2008, 8:19 PM
Yeah, I want to display these on my own web pages, of which I have quite a few. I used to host them on my own server, but now I use a hosting service, but I still have to write all the code. So I am now able to get the aspect ratio correct. I am having another problem about which I'll make a new post.