V6 integration problem with DVDA3

aspenv wrote on 5/5/2005, 4:17 AM

I mean.....I export two mpeg 29,97 (with 2:3 pulldown)...using the NTSC DVD 24p template

Each file is under 1.5Gb (3 Gb in total)

and DVDA reports:

- A need to recompress video track #2 ....(?).....is under the 4.7Gb limit, right?
- when I go to optimize DVD....files are detected as 29.97..., there is an option to choose 23.976 from a drop down menu. Is DVDA really detecting properly frame rates? How do I know?

On the other hand.... I have:
- a subtitle track (400 subtitles for a 25 minute project)
- a video track (hopefully in 24p)
- an audio ac3 track
- a main menu and a scene selection menu

Ok.....on the timeline....I created 17 chapters....

I link those chapters to the links in the scene selection menu (dvda does it automatically)

When I play the dvd....some subtitles never go away.....they stay above all other subtitles (I have checked timecode overlapping and it is not that)

WHEN.......I delete the chapters......the DVD plays fine....

But....I need both....optional subtitles and chapters.....what can I do?

I delete the subtitle track, and, instead,.....I put two video tracks.....one with subtitles, the other, without subtitles....

as I mentioned above, both video tracks are under 1.4Gb

However, DVDA wants me to recompress......

Sooooo......what do I do? I can't use the subtitle feature of dvda, and I can't put two video tracks....

Also.....exporting subtitles from DVDA3 as Vegas Region List....just plain does not work (I called vegas support for that, and they told me that it was not possible)

I need to turn in a extremely important project, and so far I have only been able to deliver:

-a dvd with subtitles.....with no chapters
-a minidv tape with no subtitles (I created the subtitles in DVDA3 and once there...you can't go anywhere)

So.......come on....that's no flexibility, integration......etc....

Some of these issues are definately bugs.

Can we expect to have them fixed on the next updates?

Comments

gordyboy wrote on 5/5/2005, 4:31 AM

Did you use the generic NTSC DVD templates rather than the NTSC DVD Architect video and audio templates?

The DVDA specific formats work best, in my experience.

Cheers

gb

aspenv wrote on 5/5/2005, 4:42 AM

I've used the NTSC DVD Architect template...

......One would think that it is the one if you're exporting the file into dvda...

And now that you mention.....what's the difference between the NTSC DVD 24p template and the NTSC DVD Architect 24p template.....?

Anyhow, thanks for your suggestion, I'll try that.

gordyboy wrote on 5/5/2005, 5:17 AM

Good question - don't know what the difference in the templates is and haven't got access to Vegas right now to check. Be interested to hear what is different.

Per the DVDA manual, "the precise settings to produce MPEG-2, PCM and AC-3 files that do not require recompression follow.

AC-3 audio (.ac3)

Number of channels: stereo or 5.1 surround
Bit rate: 64kbps to 448 kbps inclusive.

PCM audio (.wav)

Sample size: 16, 20 or 24 bit
Sample rate: 48 or 96 kHz
Numer of channels: Stereo
Compression: uncompressed

NTSC MPEG video (.m2p, .mp2, mpg, mpeg)

If you're using the MainConcept MPEG-2 encoder in the Vegas software, use the DVD Architect NTSC video stream or DVD Architect 24p NTSC video stream template to render your video stream (you'll need to render your audio stream separately according to the parameters listed in the AC-3 audio or PCM audio sections above).

Aspect Ratio Frame size
4:3 720x480
4:3 704x480
4:3 352x240
4:3 352x480
16:9 720x480
16:9 704x480

Frame rate: 29.97 fps or 23.976 fps + 2-3 pulldown
Maximum GOP: 36
Maximum bit rate: 9.8 Mbps
No low delay"

Hope this helps

gb

Spot|DSE wrote on 5/5/2005, 6:22 AM

The difference is that if the template doesn't say DVD Architect in it, the audio is carried over. Which is fine, because you can very quickly replace the MPEG audio with the AC3 audio, you merely need to drag the AC3 audio to the file properties audio field.

ScottW wrote on 5/5/2005, 6:55 AM

Not to disagree or anything, but the difference in the case where it's just an "NTSC DVD" template (without DVDA in the name) you get an elementary stream (an M2V file) so there can't be any audio, in the DVDA template case you get a program stream without audio (an MPG file; since DVDA prefers program streams).

At least that's the way it is in Vegas 5.0.

--Scott

ro_max wrote on 5/5/2005, 6:56 AM

With regard to the subtitle issue (titles remaining on screen indefinately), it sounds like a bug in DVDA 3, because I never experienced anything like this with DVDA 2.

It would also be nice to hear, whether Sony can reproduce this problem.

rmack350 wrote on 5/5/2005, 9:20 AM

Maybe someone would like to take a look at your DAR file. Not me but someone who actually knows something.

As far as exporting the subtitles, I haven't yet found anything that would import the resulting file except for DVDa. It's a little frustrating. I was hoping to import the subtitles into subtitle workshop and then convert to SSA. (I know you found another way to do that. You were way ahead of me in the last thread).

Here's a sample of what I see in editpad:

·
·
·
·0·0·0·2· · ·0·0·:·0·0·:·0·5·:·9·3· · ·0·0·:·0·0·:·0·8·:·8·7· · ·W·e· ·a·r·e· ·a· ·v·o·l·u·n·t·e·e·r· ·b·a·s·e·d· ·o·r·g·a·n·i·z·a·t·i·o·n·,· ·
·
·
·

The exported file looks fine in notepad but shows up with extra characters in editpad. Editpad normally isn't a problem for me so I think it's exposing something weird about the exported text. Cleaning that up at least allowed me to import as regions into Vegas. While that turned out not to be useful, it suggests that there's something not right with the text exports from DVDa.

Is there really an integration problem with V6? I don't see it. You can render perfectly good files for DVDa from V6. Seems like your problems are largely with DVDa3, aside from the need to make a subtitle burn into an AVI file, which Virtualdub supposedly handles If you could just convert the subtitle output from DVDA to SSA.

This is not to discount your problems. They're big and they're frustrating and you're out of time. I hope someone here would be willing to take a look at your DAR file.

Rob Mack

aspenv wrote on 5/5/2005, 10:31 AM

I'm more than happy to send the DAR file no anyone if that can help me.

About the integration thing....I have been encountering problems each time I moved forward in my project and I just able to overcome those problems using third pary sofware:

-virtuadub
-subtitle ripper
-subtitle workshop

Also, it's a shame that Vegas and/or DVDA can't read other subtitles formats. Also, the options for subtitles in DVDA is limited, no outline control, shadow, etc...

I have just learned that adding a new video track in DVDA, need always a recompression. It is not a matter of compliant mpeg files, but that's the way DVDA works.

Apparently, it does it so both video files can be combined into a new MPEG-2 file....but does not want I want. I want two different video streams if the dvd has enough space for them.

Think about a non multiangle DVD, but a DVD with xtras.

aspenv wrote on 5/5/2005, 11:01 AM

More limitations:

I was trying to include the video as an extra...but it has it limitations:

-can not exceed 1gb
-can only be accessed in a computer

Also.....I can't add a more video at the end of the master video event

Ok, at the end it seems that the only option I have is to rerender both versions of the video (with subtitles and without subtitles) in vegas
and import it as a single video into dvda and then send different in and out points for both versions.

I can see another problem coming: Scene selection...

this never ends

rmack350 wrote on 5/5/2005, 11:38 AM

Well, before I started the last project-the only one I've used subtitles on-I was looking at DVDLab Pro. It seems to have a lot of features and there's a demo available.

The decision was pretty close but since DVDA would accept a plain text file for the subtitles (without times), and I already had that file, DVDA was the best choice.

The fact that I can't use the subtitle output anywhere else is awkward and can make DVDA a bit of a dead end. I'm sure with a bit of stubborn persistance I could make the DVDA sub files work.

Some of the limitations may be with DVD authoring standards, some may be with DVDA. The standards are deep enough that I'm not surprised that DVDA has limits. Almost all authoring tools do, it seems.

Some of your problems are based in your workarounds-you wouldn't need two streams if you could get the subtitles to work right. Since what you initially started out to do seems pretty basic I'd be surprised if someone here couldn't help you fix it.

Rob Mack

aspenv wrote on 5/5/2005, 11:41 AM

Exactly Rob...I'm doing all this because I can't have a simple dvd with chapters and subtitles at the same time.

But...it has helped me be aware of the limitations of DVDA, and some are a drag.

ro_max wrote on 5/5/2005, 11:53 AM

With the exception of the subtitle probably, which is probably a bug that was not in DVDA 2, DVDA 3 seems to work fine. The limitations are sometimes simply due to DVD specs.

Aspenv, are you familiar with any DVDA version prior to DVDA 3? If you have DVDA 2, I would suggest you use that one. It will do the things you want. If you don't, I'am afraid you either are going to have to wait for a fix in a software update (as do I) or use other software tools, if you can't wait that long. Me, I can always go back to DVDA 2 (or even to DVDA 1, if that were required).