Surely Sony can read Sony's formats!

AC3 is not a Sony format and very few NLE's can read this format.
You need to get an AC3 to wave converter such as BeSweet or Ac3Tool to do the conversion from AC3 to WAV.

Mike

The point is: Vegas does not support AC3 import, neither AC3 stereo nor AC3 5.1

There are some NLEs that supports that - some Ulead products or simple womble.

It could be supported if Sony chose to support it. So far, they have chosen not to support it (to import it, that is). Too bad. A lot of people have asked for this.

couple 'o points - DVDA reads, almost requires ac3! Why doesn't Vegas, which creates it. Is this just another Sony doesn't give a .... hoot?

as to why I don't copy the DVD - well they have been shipped to the four corners of the world and I want a SVHS quality compilation - OK?

Simply idiotic that Vegas can read/import the mpg2 file but not its companion ac3 file. Anyone from sony monitor these boards???

What is the reason, other than the just don't give a ... hoot? Guess I expect too much from a $1000 package and don't want to mess with the multitude of $30 packages to rip/convert etc....

Jeesh!

It's a legal issue I think.

Marco

AC3 is a distribution format. Decoding AC3 files will generally create .wav filre inferior to the originals, so you would probably not want those to edit with those anyway ... come to think of it, an MPEG encode is nowhere near the quality of the master as well.

Why don't you hook up a vhs machine to a DVD player and make the copy that way?

Cheers!

AC3 is a distribution format. Decoding AC3 files will generally create .wav files inferior to the originals, so you would probably not want those to edit with those anyway ... come to think of it, an MPEG encode is nowhere near the quality of the master as well.

True but, using other products, you can cut both MPEG and AC-3 and reassemble with zero loss in quality (e.g., Womble's products).

What so many of us want to do is create compilations from bits and pieces of existing DVDs we've already created, without having to go back and re-capture and re-edit the original tapes. For instance, I spent several months capturing all my VHS and S-VHS tapes from the past twenty years. I spent hundreds of computer hours cleaning this video, using various VirtualDub and AVISynth scripts and plug-ins. I then edited out the bad stuff, added titles and overlays, etc. Finally, I used some fairly exotic MPEG-2 encoding, using custom matrices, and finally created lots of DVDs. This resulted in thirty separate DVDs, each 60-90 minutes long.

Now, for various "clients" (friends, family, etc.), I want to take 3-5 minutes each from perhaps as many as a dozen of these DVDs, and create a new DVD, with just the footage each person wants.

Does Sony think I'm going to go back to fifty separate tapes, re-capture the segments I want, do all the cleaning, editing, and overlays?

Are they nuts ????

Fortunately, with Womble's MPEG Wizard, I can do what I want, simply cutting the MPEG and AC-3 audio, and then reassembling the results in DVDA. Zero loss in quality compared to re-capturing, re-cleaning, and re-editing, and it takes about 2% of the time it would take to do all of that unnecessary work.

However, Vegas should be able to do this. There is absolutely no reason (legal or technical) that it cannot be done, and the benefit -- to me, and to many, many other Vegas users -- would be immense (because Womble's products are pretty crude).

Sometimes, I really don't understand where Sony is going with this product line. It isn't just a matter of them not addressing MY specific interests; I just don't see the logic in refusing to keep up with the competition which offers not only MPEG cutting, but also motion stabilization, advanced filtering to improve capture from analog sources, and much more.

The last release was the "HDV" release, and clearly Sony addressed that need. I just hope that future releases will once again address the clear requirement to improve features and functions that the vast majority of users use on a daily basis, and which the competition already provides (HDV is still a pretty small market, although growing). So far they just don't seem to understand how fundamentally DVD authoring has changed everything. I think this is probably because they are blinded by the (incorrect) notion that DVD is simply a delivery format, and that no one would ever need to re-use the content on a DVD they've already created. I hope I've sufficiently described at least one common scenario (above) so that everyone at Sony, and elsewhere, can understand the crying need to be able to read and edit MPEG-2 and AC-3, without re-compressing the results.

"as to why I don't copy the DVD - well they have been shipped to the four corners of the world and I want a SVHS quality compilation - OK?"

So burn another DVD. This takes no time at all compared to futzing around importing the VOB files and working with them. In fact, working with the VOB files in Vegas is painfully slow.

So you want to preserve quality? Then you do *NOT* want to import the VOB files and re-render them to something else. You will lose more quality doing that than going direct from DVD to tape.

Yes, there are times when it would be nice and useful to bring VOB files back into Vegas and work with them. This is not one of those times. You're making more work for yourself , wasting a lot of time, and losing quality.

Agree that womble is a terrific application .. I use it for all my vob edit work... though it would be nice if the high-end Vegas platform could do that as well of course.

It's probably to avoid piracy, not to have Vegas dvd pirate-friendly by making vobs/ac3 streams readable. So they're not making Vegas something that pirates can use easily. Just a guess. I wish they'd enable AC3/better vob editing capability though.

It's a topic that's been talked about a lot in the forum here, eg search for keyword "ac3" ...

How's Avid/others when it comes to vob editing?


ken

I think you're right on the money Ken. However it still doesn't make sense. If AC3 functionality were to make Vegas "pirate-friendly" who cares? The people who BOUGHT Vegas aren't going to use it for that purpose. The people who DO use it for that purpose have probably pirated Vegas AS WELL!! Why punish law-abiding customers? It's no different (opening a can of worms) than banning guns to keep criminals from using them. The criminals are just going to get them illegally anyway. That's why they're criminals for Pete's sake. The only people affected are those that would've owned and used them legally. (Accidental shooting and safety issues aside it is a fairly similiar situation....I think...maybe....meh who cares....)

.ac3 import is working for some of us:
http://www.sonymediasoftware.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?ForumID=4&MessageID=402634

For a workaround:
http://www.sonymediasoftware.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?ForumID=4&MessageID=353153

This has all been hashed out on previous threads a mile long. Sony will not make Vegas inport AC-3 as it is a transport stream and it would increase the risk of piracy. That's it. Done deal.

JJK

Sony will not make Vegas import AC-3 as it is a transport stream and it would increase the risk of piracy. That's it. Done deal.

Nothing is ever a done deal. Competition, customer demands, and common sense will eventually force them to change their minds. Piracy exists with, or without, the ability to import AC-3.

Somebody here had suggested using www.ac3dec.com (free) to get wav's from vobs... I've done that, it works most of the time.. though a hassle to strip the wav off, then align it back in Vegas w/video stream manually .. it works.. click downloads link at top bar then d/l 0.8.21

ken

burn another DVD?
1) it takes about 10 min to burn a 1hr dvd
2) I would still have to store, muck and change 26 dvd's instead of 3 svhs tapes
3) quality? not the primary concern here. Clearly moving to svhs isn't a "quality" preservation operation.

Finally, why argue with why I want to do it - others have mentioned even better reasons. I really don't want to bring the vob back - I have the mpg2 and ac3 files and simply want to use them in v6 like I do in DVDA -

Please don't assume know another's requirements, needs, or reasons, rather persumptuous imho.

Might be nice to address the thread than your perception of my needs.

but thanks for the reply, just wish it had added information

Rusty

Piracy! Give us a break. The tool doesn't create piracy, the user does. Sony is terrified of someone copying their precious film/dvd/movie holdings, however, there are MANY other ways to duplicate a DVD etc.

Sony isn't worried about liability, they are just think they know better than their customers. A very near-sighted view.

btw - the gun manufactures still manufacture guns! Let's not get into a NRA battle, here - they have guns :) Point is a bunch of bar-room lawyers suggesting legal reasons for Sony to ignore ac3 do to "Piracy" is simply idiotic.

How about it Sony? How do AVID and the rest to this?

finally - the point that this has been discussed ad naseum doesn't change the fact that Sony should listen. Too bad they didn't make earning this quarter - perhaps this near-sightedness isn't limited to Vegas

10 minutes is short. How long would it take to import or convert files, build new audio proxies and .sfk files, and render the output to a new file you could use for printing to tape? Certainly much longer than 10 minutes!

26 DVDs? I'm lost here. Why so many? How would you fit all that on 3 tapes? How are you storing the project now? If you don't want to store the newly burned DVDs then use DVD-RW discs and recycle them after making the tape. For that matter, whenever i create a project i keep at least one extra copy of the finished DVD(s) for myself. I don't think it was an unreasonable assumption that you had done so too.

You mentioned quality. I merely pointed out that re-rendering from MPEGs (or VOBs, which are MPEG files) will lose more quality than a straight DVD->tape transfer.

Your stated purpose was to get your video onto tape. I don't think i read anything more into that. Being able to use AC3 files was only secondary to your stated goal. I offered you an alternative method that, in my opinion, is faster, easier, and more reliable. I'm sorry if you don't think that was helpful. On the other hand, i think it added quite a bit of information, ie. that there are better methods than importing the DVD files. Most would consider better methods to be good information.

What are your needs? You said you needed to produce an SVHS copy of the video project. I gave you a very good answer to that. The only assumption i made at all was that you still had a DVD of the project lying around. After you corrected that assumption i have you another simple, fast, easy, and cheap answer to that problem.

Yes, there are ways to get audio from AC3 files into Vegas, but you don't need to do that to accomplish what you said you wanted to do.

How do AVID and the rest to this?
They don't.
Ulead allows for AC3 import to their products. I believe Pinnacle Studio does too. But Edition, Premiere, Avid anything, Final Cut Pro 5, don't support import.
The only professional application I'm aware of that imports AC3 is Canopus Edius 3.3, but that was just recently released. They use a direct show decoder that installs with your DVD Authoring application; they don't offer a decoder.
Keep in mind also, decoder licenses cost $$ that someone has to pay for.

*Nothing is ever a done deal. Competition, customer demands, and common sense will eventually force them to change their minds. Piracy exists with, or without, the ability to import AC-3*

I actually own a VHS deck made by Sony. (remember when they refused to make anything but Beta?)

This might allow you to use AC3 files within Vegas:

http://fcchandler.home.comcast.net/AC3ACM/

John

Yes, your right that nothing is a done deal. I still remember something called "Betamax" though that lasted for about 20 years. If they have the same people in power now as then 20 years in the computer industry is like 1000 anywhere else. I personally would like to see them incorporate it in Vegas but It might be up to AC-48 before they make up their minds.

JJK

.ac3 import is working for some of us just fine:
http://www.sonymediasoftware.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?ForumID=4&MessageID=402634

For a workaround:
http://www.sonymediasoftware.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?ForumID=4&MessageID=353153