Advice on Historical Documentary

twhitak wrote on 5/12/2004, 4:07 PM
I'll apologize in advance if these are stupid questions, but I'm new at this. I live in a historic town and was thinking about doing a short documentary on the history of the town. If it turns out well, I might even consider selling DVDs of it in the town gift shop.

My question is this: Do I need to get permission from the town to do the documentary and video historic buildings? If I use photos from the library, can I just give credit to the photographers or do I have to get their permission? Do I need to get permission to include information about people who are dead?

If anybody has done this kind of thing before, feel free to answer relevant questions I didn't ask. Thanks for the help.

Comments

Spot|DSE wrote on 5/12/2004, 4:35 PM
First rule of almost any film making...get permission.
You don't need permission from the town to shoot a documentary there, but it's a good idea to ask. You DO need permission if you'll be setting up more than a tripod and camera on the town hall lawn. Some townships require a small fee for shooting in town. My town, population of 432, requires permission before filming, and charges a one-time fee of 10.00 for a permit. They require proof of insurance too. This dates back to "Touched by an Angel" damaging town property.
You DO need permission to use photos from books. Permissions from the publisher AND author are necessary, and if the author is deceased, whomever holds the rights, if anyone. Also be aware that a photographer might hold copyright to the images and they may have only granted limited use to the publisher of the book.
If you are doing a docco and have a historical narration, such as "Jon Wayneski was sheriff from 1910 to 2004, he made over 18,000 arrests" then you need no permission. If you have a historical narration you get from a family member, you need permission/clearance. If you are shooting private buildings, you need permission. If you are shooting town-owned/public buildings, you generally don't need permission.

We just finished shooting a segment on this subject for the Copyright Caveats DVD coming from VASST later this summer, using former prosecutor Kenneth R. Wallentine, Esq. who now is an attorney for the State of Utah, and is also CLO of POST, and president of the Police Officers Association.
filmy wrote on 5/12/2004, 4:48 PM
I have done a few things sort of along these lines. Problem is that the answers to your questions can be very varied.

I guess the first thing would be to figure out exactly what you want to do - something on the entire town? something on a person in that town as it relates to the towns history? One certian historic landmark in the town? And so on. Once you get that figured out you will have a better direction for the other questions.

>>>Do I need to get permission from the town to do the documentary and video historic buildings?<<<

You don't need to get permission to do something - as in just go around and shoot historic landmarks. Overall these are touristy type things anyway so it is almost expected. However to shoot *in* the building or *on* property may be another story. Many buildings and the historic landmarkers are in front of private places. So you probably would not be able to just walk into someones house or yard and start shooting. (There is an historic cemetary behind our house and I can tell you if I saw someone with a video camera walking around outside the house I would call 911) Likewise you should check before going into a public historic place and shoot. It may be ok to do somehting handheld, as you would if you were a tourist, but what you are thinking of doing would require something a bit more - such as tripods and possible lighting. For that you need permission for the building owner, and if that happens to be the town than you would need permission.

I would add that is certianlly would not hurt to go to the town historian and the local historical society first and get them on board and than go to the town and get them on board as well. After that it would be a lot easier to get private people to allow you to shoot as well.

>>>If I use photos from the library, can I just give credit to the photographers or do I have to get their permission?<<<

If it is in a book that book and material in it would be copyrighted most likely. Obviously it would also depend on the area - a photo of "bobs house" as it looked 50 years ago may not be as big of a deal as a photo of the pentagon from the air. Either way - check copyright, contact the publisher. Having said that - go back to what I said above about the town historian and the historical society.

>>>Do I need to get permission to include information about people who are dead?<<<

Well let me tell you what happened to me - someone started doing press about a book they were supposedly doing. This book was about a local author who died a long time ago. As an historical figure all was well - however one day in the newspaper a rather long "preview" of the book was published and the story made all these claims about the authors property and further more said the information came from interview with my father...who died in 1984. This story in the paper, as well as the 'book', were done in the late 90's. My father is not a historical figure nor was he interviewed by the books author at any point. One of the claims in the 'book' said my father, as a teenager, stole first editions of some of the authors books from the authors house where my father and his friends would hang out when it was a whorehouse (?!?!?!?!?) Was this info based on any sense of reality? No. My father aside no one was ever interviewed who had knowledge of the subject he was writting about...as in town historian, any member of the historical society, the over 80 crowd who would have had first hand knowledge of the author and so on.

Do you need permission to do a story about someone who is dead? In an historical context no. But I would adivse you to get facts in order and don't quote people you have never interviewed.

overall what you want to do is a great idea. I would say just go for it , but cover your bases if you plan on selling it. Get release forms from both people interviewed and property owners. Get permission for any images you use.
filmy wrote on 5/12/2004, 4:50 PM
Dag nabbit Spot - will you stop following me around. ;)
BrianStanding wrote on 5/13/2004, 7:59 AM
I'll second the idea of talking to the local historical society, and add that you may want to talk to your state historical society as well. Many state historical agencies have vast troves of public-domain photographs, correspondence, or even film that's available for the cost of duplication.

Also, there is absolutely no substitute for a good research/archival librarian. These people are specially trained and motivated to help you find exactly what you're seeking. Get them excited about the project, tell them what you're looking for, and I guarantee you, you will find stories you never even dreamed could have happened in your sleepy little town. (If you can, find a copy of "Death-Trip Wisconsin" to get an idea of what I mean!)

Your local college or University may have a history professor who has written a thesis on your town, and would be delighted to do an interview with you.

Who knows, if you get the historical societies and colleges excited enough, they may even help fund it, or help you get it on your local PBS channel.

Once you've exhausted all the publicly available sources, THEN start identifying private sources of information to fill in the gaps. These are the ones for which you'll need permission and releases.

Have fun! Sounds like a great project!
BrianStanding wrote on 5/13/2004, 8:08 AM
In the U.S., most copyrights expire after 73 years. Your librarian/archivist can help you determine whether particular items are still under copyright or are in the public domain.
TorS wrote on 5/13/2004, 8:18 AM
The advise you have got here seems to be sound, even though they seem to take for granted you are in the US. I didn't know there were historical towns in the US. (All right, I'm joking. Even five minutes ago is history.)

I can only add: Find an angle: the history of a person (not neccessarily a famous one), a house, a street, a trade, even the history of an attitude, anything typical for the town. With such an angle it should be even easier to get permissions, and for your subjects to figure out what to say.
Tor
DGrob wrote on 5/13/2004, 9:50 AM
Thomas, I just finished a 45-minute documentary on the history of our local volunteer fire department. Worked with a local "grassroots TV" station, the local historical society (for stills ala Ken Burns). I was able to secure permission from all sources, including a local photographer, via e-mails and such. You'll need those permissions to document the "Intellectual Property Rights" when you go to replicate. E-mail your address to darrylg@ci.aspen.co.us and I'll send you a copy. You can review the credits and such at end to get some idea of the work.
Good luck. I had 250 hours in it, but it was great fun.
Darryl
twhitak wrote on 5/13/2004, 10:31 AM
Thanks for all the great advice guys--I'm more excited about this project now than before!
skibumm101 wrote on 5/13/2004, 10:48 AM
After all of the advice and ideas, i am going to start looking into doing a documentry for my town Logan, utah
BrianStanding wrote on 5/13/2004, 10:52 AM
Oh, man! Mormon Central! Lots of fascinating stories there!

The Church of Latter Day Saints is legendary for their record-keeping and genealogy. You'll have no end of source material!
skibumm101 wrote on 5/13/2004, 11:05 AM
Thats what im am excited about, this small town has old photos plastered in all the city buildings, libriaries yada,yada,yada. I am gong to make a doumentry