Are you EU people shooting in 30P if it's a purely youtube project?

Mindmatter wrote on 7/17/2025, 3:33 PM

Hi all

some judder / stutter issues with my DJI Air 2 s drone in slow sideways pans / "travelings" made me get into the 25p / 30p rabbit hole.I never really bothered with the 30p issue, but I read several articles and watched YT videos favouring 30p, even in EU countries, for general smoothness.It definitely seems an advantage in my drone pan issues, but that aside, are you all mainly shooting 30p for internet content?

Apparently some people even shoot and export 50p respectively 60p.

Any thoughts?

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Reyfox wrote on 7/18/2025, 1:55 AM

50P if there is a lot of action, otherwise, 25P, even for the drone. When panning with the drone, the pans, like with the camera are slow. Doing them is painful to me because of my pacing in life is fairly rapid. I have to force myself to pan slowly, or resort to using the gimbal, which does it for me. So all my pans are smooth no matter the frame rate.

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3POINT wrote on 7/18/2025, 4:33 AM

Higher framerate less stutter. For EU viewing it doesn't matter which framerate is used, 25/30fps or 50/60fps are usable and viewable. I use 30fps for phone and drone and 50fps for my osmo pocket.

bitman wrote on 7/18/2025, 7:05 AM

It depends, personally, I am in a European country and I try to stick to 25P. As 3POINT said, most modern viewing devices such as television and monitors can handle 25P, 30P and 50P, 60P.

That said however, I find it a pain I have to mix sometimes my Samsung phone source 30P/60P with camera 25P for 25P projects. Phones in Europe are notorious not being able to film in 25P or 50P without divine intervention. I have no clue how to change the default to Europe filming, probably you need to dive into advanced settings (if it it is even possible) or download "third party" apps, I tried briefly to change this without success, I have not bothered to waste further time on this.

Panning is favorable at higher framerates, but do not forget pretty much all movie films (even recent ones) are historically 24P, and they use panning as well, but with velvet gloves.

Filming in Europe inside a lit space can be devastating if not using the proper 25P or 50P framerate, I had once used my phone to film inside a Dutch pub and afterwards in post I had terrible light flash flickering due to the mismatch of 30P framerate and 50Hz based electricity mains for light or LED bulbs. On another occasion, this time in China, I was filming with my phone (I had left my camera in the hotel) a traditional Chinese theater with a huge supporting television background, and it was utterly unusable due to flickering as the Chinese grid also is using 50Hz.

Apart from the disadvantages of a lower framerate for panning and moving objects, there is like in all things in life also advantages of using 25P vs 30P:

1) With equal bitrate the quality can be made higher in 25P, but if the quality is kept equal by the codex, the bitrate will rise and so will editing be more taxing for your host and file size will increase.

2) Your camera battery will last longer filming in 25P

3) Shooting at 30fps generally requires more light than 25fps. This is because at higher frame rates, the camera needs to capture more images per second, and each image needs to be exposed for a shorter amount of time to avoid motion blur. Therefore, to achieve the same brightness (exposure) when shooting at 30fps, you need to either increase the amount of light available or open the lens aperture wider, which can affect depth of field.

 

Last changed by bitman on 7/18/2025, 7:07 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

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Dexcon wrote on 7/18/2025, 7:48 AM

@bitman ... " Phones in Europe are notorious not being able to film in 25P or 50P ..."

Too true. I've had many video capable mobile phones in Australia (50 HZ power - 25 fps TV) over the years - mostly Samsung - and they just don't allow for 25/50 fps PAL-based video recording. I've never found a Samsung phone setting that enables 25/50 fps unless there is some secret Internal Preferences setting to make that change.

I could well be wrong, but my understanding is that the default fps setting for a country's TV system is based on the electricity frequency used by that country - 60Hz = 30/60 fps (or the drop-down variances); 50 Hz = 25/50 fps. Most of the world's electricity frequency is 50 Hz meaning that most of the world's default TV fps is 25/50.

https://swiftequipment.com/list-voltages-country/

I have long been disappointed that phone companies ignore 25/50 fps countries for their cameras. Perhaps its because Samsung is based in South Korea (a 60 HZ country) and Apple is based in the USA (a 60 HZ country) and both companies are blind to the needs of the majority of the world.

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relaxvideo wrote on 7/18/2025, 8:30 AM

"light flash flickering due to the mismatch of 30P framerate "

No, that wasn't the problem. Your problem was the actual shutter speed.

"Your camera battery will last longer filming in 25P"

You can always buy spare batteries, but the main problem today highend but small
milc cams overheat much quicker in 50p than 25p.

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3POINT wrote on 7/18/2025, 9:12 AM

I can film with my Samsung S24 also at 24, 25 and 50fps framerates with the free Blackmagic Camera app.

Stuttering with pans and fast movements at low framerates is the result of not using the 180 degrees shutter rule. This happens especially when filming in bright situations without using a ND Filter to prevent a higher shutter speed.

3POINT wrote on 7/18/2025, 9:24 AM

@Dexcon Today's TV'S and PC monitors are not depending on the 50/60Hz electricity frequency of the local network. My UHDTVyplayes every framerate (except 48) between 24 and 60fps.

Dexcon wrote on 7/18/2025, 6:37 PM

@3POINT ...

Today's TV'S and PC monitors are not depending on the 50/60Hz electricity frequency of the local network.

I completely and fully understand that, but the video in my projects is substantially sourced from other cameras which are 25/50-based, phone-sourced video content representing probably 5-10% of the projects. While I could change the GoPro to an NTSC frame rate to match the phone, the Sony camera - the primary source of video - is fixed at 25 fps. So if I were to cave-in to the weakest link in the chain - the phone - all the video from the Sony camera would end up being transcoded from 25 fps to 24/29.97/30 or whatever in Vegas Pro at some stage in the production process because Vegas Pro can only have one frame rate for the entire project. Far from ideal.

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3POINT wrote on 7/19/2025, 1:01 AM

I usually do not combine different framerates from different video sources into one project. The only exception is my drone footage which is only 30fps and which I use together with 50fps of my osmo pocket. I use optical flow resampling from Davinci Resolve to resample the 30fps drone footage to 50fps, which works very good for pans and is done much faster than the optical flow resampling in Vegas. I also could change the framerate of my osmo pocket to 30 or 60 fps, but I'm used also to European standard of 50fps.

set wrote on 7/20/2025, 11:16 PM

South East Asian user here that still follow EU PAL 25p format...:

I still in 25p as has been used to it since a long time ago.

But, if my sources are totally 30p or 29.97p (usually cellphone media), I'm okay to adapt to it.

 

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Gid wrote on 7/21/2025, 5:07 AM

Hi, just to add my bit. I've always filmed with my phone & a GoPro, at the moment that is a Samsung S23 Ultra & a GoPro11. (UHD HEVC)

They both come preset at 30p & I want both to match as close as poss so that's what I use, + I can't change the phone without using a third party app, but when I remember I use & set the GoPro to 50p for filming in my shed to avoid flickering from the fluorescent lights, I quite often forget tho as the phone is easier to use, to see what I'm filming & better for hand held shots that are often shaky with the GoPro.

 

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relaxvideo wrote on 7/21/2025, 5:12 AM

Flickering is depend on actual shutter speed.
I'm in Europe and lot of places use cheap, chineese, modern led light, which works at 60 hz (or multiple of this).

So i often cannot use the regular 1/50..1/100 shutters.

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bitman wrote on 7/22/2025, 3:42 AM

I can film with my Samsung S24 also at 24, 25 and 50fps framerates with the free Blackmagic Camera app.

Thanks, I may install that Blackmagic app for my Samsung S22 Ultra to force 25P...

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3POINT wrote on 7/22/2025, 6:29 AM

I can film with my Samsung S24 also at 24, 25 and 50fps framerates with the free Blackmagic Camera app.

Thanks, I may install that Blackmagic app for my Samsung S22 Ultra to force 25P...

But I still use the Samsung Camera app with 2160p30, which is sufficient for my needs.

johnny-s wrote on 7/22/2025, 11:05 AM

The Samsung S24 ultra has a built in Pro Video option. This allows for a 24 fps frame rate.

Last changed by johnny-s on 7/22/2025, 11:07 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

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3POINT wrote on 7/22/2025, 2:59 PM

The Samsung S24 ultra has a built in Pro Video option. This allows for a 24 fps frame rate.

The here discussed missing modes are 25fps and 50fps, which are available in camera apps like Blackmagic for Samsung. 24fps is indeed also available in the Pro-video mode. In the normal video mode only 30fps and 60fps.

johnny-s wrote on 7/22/2025, 6:39 PM

The here discussed missing modes are 25fps and 50fps

I find that converting/mixing 24 —>> 25 is no biggie. Im also in PAL region. I should have explicitly tagged @bitman with my post and hope its of use to him. Not sure if s22 Ultra also has Pro video option.

Last changed by johnny-s on 7/22/2025, 6:43 PM, changed a total of 3 times.

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Gid wrote on 7/22/2025, 7:22 PM

............. . Not sure if s22 Ultra also has Pro video option.

@johnny-s I'm on S23 now which has it & this pic is from S21 Ultra, so I'm sure S22 will have it.

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johnny-s wrote on 7/23/2025, 3:42 AM

Indeed. If so it's another way to go.

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Reyfox wrote on 7/23/2025, 6:06 AM

I will be renewing my cellphone contract. Those that have the Blackmagic app, I'm curious as to the performance and the video quality. Thanks!

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bitman wrote on 7/24/2025, 3:31 AM

About the Pro setting on Samsung with 24P: converting to 25P in post is indeed not such big problem and not that noticeable, at least not frame wise by adding a duplicate frame once every ... , but there is still the issue of sound which is not that easily sped up without pitch change or sync issues...

When using 30P footage in a 25P project I found that the most visually pleasing convert is not to drop frames, but to slow down to 25P which has a sort of micro slow motion effect (and obviously extend the length). The drawback is sound which is desynced. So best not use it on scenes with lips of people talking 😀

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3POINT wrote on 7/24/2025, 5:09 AM

Duplicating a frame to change a 24fps recording to 25fps is very noticeable especially with moving objects, resulting in annoying stuttering. You can also speedup 24fps to 25fps like you do with slowdown 30fps to 25fps. The best is to record in the framerate you prefer or in the framerate your camera prefers. There's no need anymore to produce in a framerate depending on your region or to change to a framerate depending on your region. So actually there's no need to do framerate conversions anymore. Important is that, when filming with several cameras, that they all record with the same framerate when you want to combine the footage later in one project.

johnny-s wrote on 7/24/2025, 5:47 AM

#1. About the Pro setting on Samsung with 24P: converting to 25P in post is indeed not such big problem and not that noticeable, at least not frame wise by adding a duplicate frame once every ... , but there is still the issue of sound which is not that easily sped up without pitch change or sync issues...

#2. When using 30P footage in a 25P project I found that the most visually pleasing convert is not to drop frames, but to slow down to 25P which has a sort of micro slow motion effect (and obviously extend the length). The drawback is sound which is desynced. So best not use it on scenes with lips of people talking 😀

 

@bitman

#1. It can be done (24 to 25) either externally using ffmpeg without any quality loss or using VP. As far as I remember there was a free happy otter tool to do this.

#2. I had reason to do that and sure enough it works kind of, people sound a little drunk.

Last changed by johnny-s on 7/24/2025, 5:54 AM, changed a total of 2 times.

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johnny-s wrote on 7/24/2025, 1:59 PM

@bitman

There's no need to settle for any duplicate frames.

"by adding a duplicate frame once every ... "

With VP PP's set to 25 fps and a 24 fps clip loaded ...

#1. If you right click the timeline event and select properties then conform to project frame rate then no duplicate frames are added to the rendered output file.

#2. If you don't do that (conform to project frame rate) then a single frame is added each second to the output rendered file.

Both output files (conformed or not) have the same duration. I assume that the PTS (Presentation Time Stamps) within VP are modified when using #1 method.

#1. Can be done external to VP using ffmpeg as previously mentioned. Both VP and ffmpeg AFAIK produce similar quality output.

I tested this using the Samsung Pro Video set to 24 fps and on bypassing cars so very easy to see any duplicates. Note that the Pro Video still produces variable frame rate.

Last changed by johnny-s on 7/24/2025, 2:12 PM, changed a total of 3 times.

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64 GB Ram

Nvidia RTX 3080 GPU

Win 10