Comments

Kevin R wrote on 5/13/2010, 12:14 AM
Do you mean rendering the audio on the Vegas timeline?

Same as rendering the video:
File --> Render
Instead of picking a video format, choose an audio format (wav/wma/mp3/etc...)

Or, do you mean capturing audio playing from another program on your computer?
fultronix wrote on 5/13/2010, 12:27 AM
No not rendering - -
And no - not from another app
Record into a track of Vegas with FX on the track or on an Assignable FX buss the output of which is recorded directly to disc - not just a recorded dry signal that has to be rendered later with the intended FX to get the performed audio.

In other words - Record with FX in Vegas and then play it back in another Media Player as I originally heard it without having to render in Vegas with the FX first
Kevin R wrote on 5/13/2010, 12:40 AM
I am more confused. Can you more clearly explain?

You mentioned "as I originally heard it". Heard what? Is this live audio? Is it coming from the computer or from a live band?

Please try to clarify where the audio is originating from, where are the FX you talk about "originally" hearing (on your computer? Vegas? on an outboard sound system?). Is Vegas already part of this setup? Is the audio already coming through your computer?
farss wrote on 5/13/2010, 2:44 AM
As far as I know no, you can only record the dry input in Vegas. You cannot add say Eq or Compression into the signal as it is recorded.

You can add the FXs into the monitoring chain but not put them into the recording chain. There are a few ways you could achieve the same outcome.

Use outboard gear.
Use another app and then Rewire its output into Vegas. I believe Vegas will run as a Rewire master but not as a slave so you cannot Rewire two instances of Vegas.

Bob.
richard-amirault wrote on 5/13/2010, 5:58 AM
Record into a track of Vegas with FX on the track or on an Assignable FX buss the output of which is recorded directly to disc - not just a recorded dry signal that has to be rendered later with the intended FX to get the performed audio.

You can record with FX in Vegas. You can PLAY the recording off the Vegas timeline. You can record that playback with another app, or even Vegas itself, while it is playing on your computer speakers .. but why bother?

Rendering what you have recorded is much faster to get to the end product .. a file you can play in another media player.
Bob Greaves wrote on 5/13/2010, 10:29 AM
Rendering just audio does not take too long. Generally speaking it is thought unwise to record dry material WITH added effects in case you later develop a better effects setting or chain. This is especially true if there will be additional editing afterwards and you discover a different effects setting would actually work better. There is no undo once effects are applied to the file itself.

I often record audio in SONAR which has a neat little option to select a clip and to apply the effects. SONAR then applies the effects to the raw file and then substitutes the new clip with effects already applied. When SONAR bounces clips around like this it is very very fast. But even then, in SONAR you would have to export the audio or locate the new clip on the disc and copy it out.
fultronix wrote on 5/13/2010, 7:42 PM
Thanks everyone for all the ideas . .
Though I appreciate the flexibility of rendering the effects after the recording has been made sometimes I am still an old school performer type - Gtr in this case - and want to be able to just get a sound with my plugins and wail away for a while and then perhaps change some of the FX parametrs and continue with as little interruption as possible - no stopping and starting of the recording - just a quick break to reinvigorate with a tweak of the plug sound - all the while capturing the exact performance to be edited later. As I am changing FX settings during performance there is no way I can remember how to restore them to the respective sections later for mixdown / render (personal memory issues). Sometimes I just don't want any more options after a performance other than some edits. Vegas has been great to me as an editor for audio and video for years now, but I am now realizing its limitations as a performance app....

@ farss - I have come to this same conclusion - but I have no outboard gear that will do what some of my software does . . .

I am now wondering if Sound Forge would do this - I could upgrade if necessary

Again - thanks to all
musicvid10 wrote on 5/13/2010, 8:11 PM
What you are looking for is a software equivalent to those portable digital recorders like the Boss with all the punchable effects built in so you can jam and record at the same time.

I'm sure there are apps like that out there for guitarists -- but Vegas and Sound Forge are not the right ones for you. In fact, a hardware solution may be your best bet.
farss wrote on 5/13/2010, 9:19 PM
"In fact, a hardware solution may be your best bet"

Maybe, maybe not.

Keep in mind that you can apply the FXs in the monitoring chain on the busses. So you hear back the audio as it will sound with the FXs applied. With a HUI you can probably even tweak them on the fly via automation.
Now they are not recorded with the FXs applied however when you render them out they will be. This workflow can take a bit of getting setup as you need to understand buss routing. Also latency can be an issue, nothing worse than hearing yourself back with too much delay but I think once you get the hang of it you'll be flying along.

Bob.
TheHappyFriar wrote on 5/13/2010, 9:26 PM
you can also put FX on the track level & hear that w/o rendering. A littler simpler then using buses.
farss wrote on 5/13/2010, 9:31 PM
You're right!.
Last time I did this I had different monitoring mixes so things were a bit more complicated than they need to be for a simple setup.

One thing to keep in mind though is the signal paths, putting a compressor on a buss can be very different to putting it on a track.

Bob.
fultronix wrote on 5/13/2010, 10:34 PM
sorry farss I don't see how using the busses will solve my problem of remembering FX parameter changes that I do on the fly during recording (even if I use an HUI)
But - someone brings up another issue I have found regarding using busses and even Assignable FX sends/returns. I have noticed a very slight latency when using these - even with the effexts in that chain disabled - anyone else notice this? In other words adding busses or assignable effects is not transparent (it adds a very slight but noticeable ambient effect on its own).
farss wrote on 5/14/2010, 1:29 AM
"sorry farss I don't see how using the busses will solve my problem of remembering FX parameter changes that I do on the fly during recording (even if I use an HUI)"

I'd really need to test this unless someone else knows.

You can control FXs using envelopes and you can control those envelopes using automation. I'm not certain though if you can write automation envelopes while in record. If you can your problem is solved, well to a certain extent.

Even if automation write does work during recording you've still got to setup everything before you start recording.

"even with the effexts in that chain disabled - anyone else notice this? In other words adding busses or assignable effects is not transparent (it adds a very slight but noticeable ambient effect on its own). "

As you add more things into the signal path latency (delay) must increase. If you were monitoring that as you record it would sound like an ambience had been added. It should not be there in the actual recording.

Bob.
fultronix wrote on 5/16/2010, 12:31 AM
thanks to everyone for input here - For anyone interested I have been tweaking ASIO4ALL for optimum monitoring latency. I am getting a very acceptable sound to perform with while also getting the actual recorded sound that I want. One has to know his limitations and I have discovered how to work with at least one of them. . .

Now let's all hope that BP caps our poor bleeding earth before it is too late to ponder my monumentally important latency issues . . .
deusx wrote on 5/16/2010, 3:20 AM
You need something like this ( if you are serious about it ):

http://www.tcelectronic.com/g-force.asp

Microphone in front of your cabinet .> into your sound card/interface > mix that guitar sound with effects from that link and then record that with vegas ( or you could use those effects within your guitar amp's effects loop so Vegas records everything as it comes in via microphone, but you lose stereo effects that way ).

Easiest and by far best sounding way of doing it. It's not worth fiddling around with Vegas, latencies and ASIO especially since those were not designed for this kind of a thing.