fadeout wrote on 7/20/2007, 2:07 PM
I'm new to Vegas and I have a few questions about Boris products for Vegas. I have already read an entire thread devoted to this subject but I was unable to find a consensus.

For starters, I can't find sys. req. listed anywhere on the Boris website. Does that mean that the various Boris applications will run within the requirements of the host NLEs for which they have been customized? In other words, will a computer that will run Vegas run Graffiti, FX9, and Red?

I also noticed that Boris is offering a Graffiti/Fx9 bundle for $299, which is even cheaper than academic pricing. What is in Red that is over and above what is already in the Graffiti/Fx9 combo, and does it justify the big bump up in price when compared to the specially priced bundle? And are these programs best run as plug ins or stand alone apps?

Has anyone in the Forum used Blufftitler for titles and such? How does it stack up against Graffiti, and if Graffiti has a few extra features, are they justified by the huge difference in price?

What are Static Generators, and what exactly do they do?

And finally, for the time being, has anyone used the Boris tutorials? I have purchased a number of tutorial DVDs, and have never found one that was remotely worth the money, and that includes the 2 Vegas tutorials that I bought with the software this past winter. They were worthless for a beginner, and I gave up trying to learn Vegas and deleted it from my computer. A few weeks ago I literally stumbled across an online tutorial for Vegas 6.0 at, which opened my eyes. I was able to understand what Vegas was about and I reinstalled it. Unfortunately, doesn't offer any tutorials for Boris at this time so I'm stuck with the Boris DVDs if I choose to buy their programs.

I know that this is a mouthful, but titles/text is an area of weakness in Vegas that I would like to remedy, and it seems that Boris could well be the best option. If there are better choices out there I would appreciate knowing about them. In fact, if anyone knows where I can find a list of first rate plug ins that are compatible with Vegas, that would be great.

Thank you all in advance for your time. It is most appreciated.


Tattoo wrote on 7/20/2007, 3:11 PM
Welcome to Vegas!

I don't think you'll find a consensus on a good titler for Vegas because there isn't a really good solution. There are a number of options, but all have various strengths & weaknesses in the areas of ease of use, cost, quality, features, etc. There have been many, many threads on this topic, though, so you may search/read some more to get a better feel for what may be right for you. Most programs have some kind of demo/trial version option, too, which is probably the only way you'll know if it's right for you.

I've *only* used the Vegas titler, but I'll give a short summary of what I've gathered from this forum over time to get you started (and probably generate some heated arguments ...).

Vegas built-in titler: more options than you realize at first because you can use any of the video effects on it to generate most of the basics. No text on a path option and no good character controls.

Bluff Titler: easiest to use, pretty cheap, lots of features. quality seems a little suspect if you want crystal clear text, but if you like features such as chromed text, 3D extruded letters, or weird hairy/spikey text this is the one for you.

Heroglyph: moderately easy to use, somewhat cheap ($100) or not-so cheap ($300) versions, lots of control, pretty good quality.

Boris Graffiti: pretty hard to use, more expensive, lots of control, very good quality.

Cayman Graphics: no longer supports Vegas

Flash: haven't seen it in a while, but some folks use a flash program to generate text

Not sure if Bluff can be used as a pure plug-in (just like the Vegas titler), but if so it may be the only one. I think everything else you end up working with your video and your text somewhat separately, which is less convenient.

I'm not in the market quite yet, but of these, Heroglyph sounds the most interesting to me. Nice that you can check out the $100 option and then get upgrade pricing if you decide you need the extra control of the more expensive version.

You might want to post what your priorities are and how much $ you're willing to shell out, as that will help frame folks response. Easy, powerful (text control), features (3D text, etc.), cheap, and high quality are not something you can find in package. Usually only two to three of those options per program.


UKAndrewC wrote on 7/20/2007, 3:50 PM
I use all of the apps mentioned, they are all needed because they are all very different.

**quality seems a little suspect if you want crystal clear text**
Bluff uses hardware to draw, the quality depends on your graphics card capabilites and settings.

Here are some points for each

Great for 3D text and objects in 3D space
Easy to create complex 3D
Author is a great help
Standalone only

2D with some great presets for motion and text
Create text on path or routes
Add text on different planes (layers)
Integrates well with Vegas

Boris Grafitti
Good for applying FX to the text
Not so many presets as the others
Good range of options for crafting smooth titles

Boris FX:
Great built in transitions
Can create most 2D and 3D FX
Takes a while to learn because of it's features
Integrates OK with Vegas

Cool3D Studio
Doesn't get mentioned much but I think it's great
Excellent for 3D text, FX and objects
More powerful than Bluff but slower
Create complete 3D environments

If you are doing any professional editing you probably will need them all. However, if you can't justify the outlay then there is a huge amount that you can do by combining effects with Vegas text.

I wish this forum had the ability to upload files, then at times like these, we could upload examples.

Tattoo wrote on 7/20/2007, 11:29 PM

Do you use Heroglyph Rapid or the full version? I'm trying to figure out if the lite version is good enough for me. What do you gain with the full version? They say the full version you can adjust the controls - does that mean that the lite version you are completely limited to their built-in templates or what?

Thanks for adding in your rundown of your experience. Stunning that you use all of those options. That's a lot of different methodologies to keep in your nugget. Glad that Bluff sounds better. I based my opinion partially on the forum reviews and partially on the sample images on the Bluff site. Most of them don't look that great, but I suppose that's because most of them are trying to show off all the 3D features, most which strike me as cheesy. Time & place for everything, though ...

UKAndrewC wrote on 7/21/2007, 3:21 AM

I use the Rapid. I bought it intending to upgrade if necesary but have never had to.

You have full control over the text stye, position and size. It's only the 'fly in' and 'fly out' presets that can't be altered but there are hundreds of them.

Some Bluff examples do look cheesey but that's the design rather than any limitation of the program.

None of these programs fulfills all needs but if I had to pick a 2D and a 3D app that would give me the most flexible titling, it would be Heroglyph and Bluff.

Tech Diver wrote on 7/21/2007, 7:36 AM
Fadeout, here is a pointer to the Boris product comparison chart:

I have Boris Red, and despite its quirks when working with Vegas (a Vegas clip-serving issue for all plugins), I still love it. Red has some distinct advantages over the combination of FX and Grafitti such as, a standalone renderer, cloning one part of a clip to another (make a flock of birds from just one or erase objects with the background), image retouching, seamless integration of FX and Grafitti in one composition, lots more filters, time-based optical flow (for accurate slow motion), true 3D intersection of objects. There are many more. It all boils down to whether or not you need that functionality for the type of productions that you work on.
kentwolf wrote on 7/21/2007, 11:38 AM
I also use Boris Red 4. It is a very powerful program.

I do not use it as a Vegas plug-in even though it can be. The implementation as a pug-in seems very clunky. Red as stand-alone is terrific.

I also have Bluff Titler and it does make some cool-looking titles, and it is very easy, but it is nowhere near the quality of Red. Red does take some getting used to, but if you are willing to pay the price in learning, it is time well spent.

Historically, Boris has not had a very good selection of tutorials but it appears that they are making a concerted effort to correct that. I have seen many more tutorials lately than ever before.

Red is very expensive, but it does give good value for the price. If you don't need it though, then perhaps not.

For home stuff, Red would be a rather extravagent luxury, in my opinion.

Red is excellent...but only if you really need what it does. And it does a lot.