Camera to Resolve, and Resolve to Vegas

astar wrote on 8/31/2015, 9:38 PM
The new releases of Resolve seem to support HDCAM.mxf as an intermediate format on par with Prores and DnxHD. However when moving the .mxf files into a Vegas project, my VP13-B453 crashes importing the file. Catalyst Browse and Prepare both play the Resolve exported file with out errors. Media info on the same media exported from resolve, and again from Vegas to HDCAM shows a writing library version mismatch. Resolve and catalyst apparently using newer versions.

Vegas VP13:Sony MXF Development Kit (Win32) 4.0.0.74.1

Resolve: Sony MXF Development Kit (Win32) 4.7.0.107.1

Looks like Vegas is the poor cousin, that is no longer getting updates to even software that Sony is writing. Funny.

Comments

set wrote on 8/31/2015, 10:44 PM
Which setting do you use? Perhaps I can try testing on my system.

I use this following Render setting in Resolve12 and works nicely:
My Video format is MXF OP1A
Codec: XDCAM MPEG2
Field Rendering checked on (because I still work with interlace format)

The result is 50Mbps XDCAM HD422 as read with Mediainfo, with lowerfield interlace format.

The other video format, 'MXF OP-Atom' makes the video unreadable.


Set
astar wrote on 9/1/2015, 12:20 AM
Yep. You were right, I was using Resolve 11, and updated to Resolve 12 and the files XDCAM files load into Vegas fine. HDCAM is still different in media info, but apparently it was a Black Magic issue with there format in 11. The HDCAM formats work great too.

HDCAM from Vegas
Format : MXF
Format version : 1.3
Format profile : OP-1a
Format settings : Closed / Complete
File size : 109 MiB
Duration : 5s 0ms
Overall bit rate : 183 Mbps
Encoded date : 2015-07-16 01:43:10.000
Writing application : Sony HDCAM-SR Vegas Plugin 0.1.0.0.4
Writing library : Sony MXF Development Kit (Win32) 4.0.0.74.1

HDCAM Resolve 11:
Format : MXF
Format version : 1.3
Format profile : OP-1a
Format settings : Closed / Complete
File size : 409 MiB
Duration : 15s 148ms
Overall bit rate : 227 Mbps
Encoded date : 2015-08-31 20:29:02.000
Writing application : Blackmagic Design DaVinci Resolve 11.3.1.0.3
Writing library : Sony MXF Development Kit (Win32) 4.7.0.107.1

HDCAM Resolve 12:
Format : MXF
Format version : 1.3
Format profile : OP-1a
Format settings : Closed / Complete
File size : 288 MiB
Duration : 10s 611ms
Overall bit rate : 227 Mbps
Encoded date : 2015-09-01 05:07:05.000
Writing application : Blackmagic Design DaVinci Resolve 12.0.0.0.3
Writing library : Sony MXF Development Kit (Win32) 4.7.0.107.1

Same writing library but they must not have been writing the structure correctly or something. It is still strange that the Catalyst apps worked fine with the resolve 11 file, but not vegas. hmm. oh well



set wrote on 9/1/2015, 2:46 AM
Here's comparison from my output (only general and Video stream info only):

XDCAM MPEG2

General
Complete name : ...\Final MXF\02 Gereja.mxf
Format : MXF
Commercial name : XDCAM HD422
Format version : 1.2
Format profile : OP-1a
Format settings : Closed / Complete
File size : 16.9 GiB
Duration : 46mn 53s
Overall bit rate : 51.6 Mbps
Encoded date : 2015-08-31 15:52:21.720
Writing application : Blackmagic Design DaVinci Resolve 12.0b

Video
ID : 1
Format : MPEG Video
Commercial name : XDCAM HD422
Format version : Version 2
Format profile : 4:2:2@High
Format settings, BVOP : Yes
Format settings, Matrix : Default
Format settings, GOP : M=3, N=12
Format settings, picture structure : Frame
Format settings, wrapping mode : Frame
Codec ID : 0D01030102046001-0401020201040300
Duration : 46mn 53s
Bit rate : 50.0 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 540 pixels
Original height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Active Format Description : Letterbox 16:9 image, with alternative 4:3 center
Frame rate : 25.000 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Interlaced
Scan order : Bottom Field First
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 1.929
Time code of first frame : 00:00:00:00
Time code source : Group of pictures header
GOP, Open/Closed : Open
Stream size : 16.4 GiB (97%)
Title : 02 Gereja_v1
--cut--


and the following is test render using Sony MPEG4 444 450 Mbps codec:
(Forgot to turn on the Field Render)

General
Complete name : ...\Final MXF\Test SonyMPEG4 444 450Mbps.mxf
Format : MXF
Format version : 1.3
Format profile : OP-1a
Format settings : Closed / Complete
File size : 1.32 GiB
Duration : 30s 160ms
Overall bit rate : 375 Mbps
Encoded date : 2015-09-01 07:36:34.000
Writing application : Blackmagic Design DaVinci Resolve 12.0.0.0.3
Writing library : Sony MXF Development Kit (Win32) 4.7.0.107.1

Video
ID : 2
Format : MPEG-4 Visual
Format settings, wrapping mode : Frame
Codec ID : 0D01030102046001-0401020201201002
Duration : 30s 160ms
Bit rate : 375 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 25.000 fps
Color space : RGB
Scan type : Progressive
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 7.238
Stream size : 1.32 GiB (100%)
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
--cut--



And this is a Sony Vegas rendering to prepare my clips to go into Resolve (Trying make full edit using Resolve12b3) :
(My Vegas' writing library is detected different version than yours...)

General
Complete name : ...\X70 1\x70_09061443.mxf
Format : MXF
Commercial name : XDCAM HD 35
Format version : 1.3
Format profile : OP-1a
Format settings : Closed / Complete
File size : 49.1 MiB
Duration : 14s 560ms
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 28.3 Mbps
Encoded date : 2015-08-21 16:29:15.000
Writing application : SONY Vegas 13.0.0.453
Writing library : Sony MXF Development Kit (Win32) 4.0.0.5000.1

Video
ID : 2
Format : MPEG Video
Commercial name : XDCAM HD 35
Format version : Version 2
Format profile : Main@High
Format settings, BVOP : Yes
Format settings, Matrix : Custom
Format settings, GOP : M=3, N=12
Format settings, picture structure : Frame
Format settings, wrapping mode : Frame
Codec ID : 0D01030102046001-0401020201030300
Duration : 14s 560ms
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 35.0 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 25.000 fps
Standard : Component
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Interlaced
Scan order : Top Field First
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.675
Time code of first frame : 00:00:00:00
Time code source : Group of pictures header
GOP, Open/Closed : Open
GOP, Open/Closed of first frame : Closed
Stream size : 60.7 MiB
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709
--cut--


astar wrote on 9/1/2015, 6:30 AM
The difference you are seeing is the XDCAM vs HDCAM.

If you do a lot of XDCAM work, you might try the Sony MPEG4 422 (255Mbs) setting. HDCAM edits smoother and with more layers in Vegas, even though it has a higher bitrate. Assuming your rig has good GPU acceleration, like an AMD card. I know storage is a major concern, but I prefer performance over storage.
set wrote on 9/1/2015, 7:52 AM
Thanks for the tips Astar.
Will try later on shorter project. Need time to mastering Resolve's Color grade Noding.

I'm 'trouble finding' the HDCAM format in Deliver tab, so I decide to test render from Vegas, and I have the following:


General
Complete name : D:\Test\Sony HDCAM SR 444 rendertest.mxf
Format : MXF
Format version : 1.3
Format profile : OP-1a
Format settings : Closed / Complete
File size : 450 MiB
Duration : 10s 0ms
Overall bit rate : 378 Mbps
Encoded date : 2015-09-01 12:42:29.000
Writing application : Sony HDCAM-SR Vegas Plugin 0.1.0.0.4
Writing library : Sony MXF Development Kit (Win32) 4.0.0.74.1

Video
ID : 2
Format : MPEG-4 Visual
Format settings, wrapping mode : Frame
Codec ID : 0D01030102046001-0401020201201002
Duration : 10s 0ms
Bit rate : 375 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 25.000 fps
Color space : RGB
Scan type : Interlaced
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 7.241
Stream size : 447 MiB (99%)
Transfer characteristics : BT.709


Am I right to say 'Sony MPEG4 444 (450Mbit)' is the HDCAM format?
If so, then I have no issue on putting the Sony MPEG4 444 450Mbps MXF file here.

Set
astar wrote on 9/1/2015, 2:49 PM
Resolve profile "Sony MPEG4 444 (450Mbs)" = Vegas HDCAM SR 444 is very high bitrate MPEG-4 intra in an RGB format that can use up to 800Mbs depending on framerate and content. The video format does not seem to be as optimized as SR or SR-Lite in Vegas

Resolve profile "Sony MPEG4 422 (450Mbs)" = Vegas HDCAM SR is MPEG-4 intra in an YUV 10-bit 422 format that can use up to 440Mbs depending on framerate and content. There have been white papers on this format being the Sony's ProRes HQ equivalent.

Resolve profile "Sony MPEG4 422 (255Mbs)" = Vegas HDCAM SR-Lite is MPEG-4 intra in an YUV 10-bit 422 format that can use up to 220Mbs depending on framerate and content. If you are ok with XDCAM422 quality, I would try this level instead of the higher bit rates for storage reasons.

Just by scrubbing back and forth on a clip with the mouse, you can tell how much smoother this format is over MP4, DNxHD, XACV, and XDCAM. The smoothness over xdcam is likely due to the intra frame codec. XDCAM is highly optimized in Vegas as well.