Red Prince wrote on 12/3/2011, 11:50 AM
No, no problems here with color curves.

He who knows does not speak; he who speaks does not know.
                    — Lao Tze in Tao Te Ching

Can you imagine the silence if everyone only said what he knows?
                    — Karel Čapek (The guy who gave us the word “robot” in R.U.R.)

JohnnyRoy wrote on 12/3/2011, 12:11 PM
I use Color Curves on almost every project I do in Vegas Pro 11 and I'm note having any problems with it.

rmack350 wrote on 12/3/2011, 1:44 PM
I double-checked this last week when someone mentioned it and found it to be very reproduceable...wait, that was with the color corrector. Vegas would crash after applying the color corrector to several events.

Okay, just tried it with color curves and the same thing happens. Apply the filter to enough events and Vegas crashes.

I went about it differently this time. I dropped about 10 clips on the timeline, applied a color curve to the first event, and then copied the attributes to all the other events. No problem, but maybe this bears repeating 10-12 times. After that, I opened the filters on each event and changed the color curve. After the 6th or 7th change Vegas crashed.

This behavior is the same as what I was seeing with the color corrector. I'm guessing it's not one specific filter that's the problem. It seems like it maybe isn't related to how many events have a filter applied, but maybe how many times you adjust filters. Or maybe it's just Russian Roulette and Vegas will just crash eventually as you open or close that dialog.

BibbityBoo wrote on 12/3/2011, 3:51 PM
Haven't run into this. Curious, have you also tried color correction (or curves) from the track level? Not that track level would be appropriate for a lot of edits if you haven't locked down the cuts completely, but, given that it's somewhat traditional to leave color grading toward the end of post, it might be worth trying to see if performance and reliability improve at all when you apply the effect to tracks rather than individual clips.

Forgive me in advance if I've just misunderstood what you're describing.
rmack350 wrote on 12/3/2011, 4:37 PM
If you're asking me, I was reproducing what someone else had reported (in another thread, the OP here doesn't say it's an Event FX) as happening at the event level, I wasn't really concerning myself with the desirability of using the effect at the event level. Nor am I putting a lot of time into testing it except to confirm it.

However, I've now found that the problem is the same with two different color correction FX so maybe it happens with more FX than that. It might be worth looking into. It seems that if you're trying to reproduce it you need to tweek Event FX over and over until it happens.

The first time I tried to reproduce it the crash happened on the first application of a color corrector. At the time I was also reading people's accounts of trouble with the mere presence of the NewBlue titler so I uninstalled it and tried again. Subsequent tests usually allowed me to tweek color correctors maybe 5-6 times before a crash but sometimes I'd still get a crash on the first try. I think I should have tested a few more times with the titler still installed because maybe it's irrelevant. Or maybe there's a broader problem with the dialog window, or the OFX system. I don't know.

Sure, things might stabilize if people having the problem use the effect at the track level and then keyframe it throughout their project, but that's not really a fix and you can't rely on people to adopt a workaround. You'd be better off trying to herd cats.

rmack350 wrote on 12/3/2011, 5:07 PM
So, since I also have VP10-64 sitting here I thought I'd open it up and throw some plain old DV on the timeline. I'll go back to VP11-64 and check this with DV there too since if Vegas can work with *anything* it ought to work well with DV avi files.

I was also thinking that Vegas 10 and 11 are doing slightly different things when you apply EventFX and maybe that was an issue.

Turns out not to be an issue. I can apply a color corrector to DV-AVI events one after another and eventually VP10-64 will crash just like VP11-64. I don't know if it did this before VP11 was installed. I have 14 events dropped on the timeline, no transitions, I think I probably applied an Event FX to the first 8 events. I suppose I could install VP9 and see if it's still a problem there.

BibbityBoo wrote on 12/4/2011, 1:05 AM
Agreed on the cat herding. And since I only recently installed V11, I should hold off further comment on the bug aspect until I've had a chance to use it enough to see if it emerges. Since the main reason I went over to the Pro version somewhere around V8 was color grading, this is of more than passing interest to me practically speaking. I'll try to keep checking in, especially as long as the other bugs I'm noticing remain active.

There are often major differences at these transitions, so it's not safe to assume anything is stable, especially not in the first few months. I have used these features pretty heavily in the past, so if it starts cropping up I'm going to suspect strongly that it's due to something from the VP11 install. I suppose I shouldn't be so prejudiced, and maybe I'll put off installing VP11 on the laptop that presently only has VP9 installed until I get a chance to reality test this a fair bit.
rmack350 wrote on 12/4/2011, 2:36 PM
This problem with EventFX crashing Vegas might not be affecting everyone, but when it happens it seems like it's happening at a very fundamental level and I'd really expect it to be fixed in the next build. It's a show stopper.

Given that, I'd make sure you have a fallback to VP9. As I noted, I'm having the problem in both VP10 and VP11 and I didn't notice it until someone pointed it out in VP11. I'm going to assume that it's OFX related and was introduced with VP11.

rmack350 wrote on 12/4/2011, 3:08 PM
After uninstalling and reinstalling VP11. I'm taking a few moments to try some things...

--Apply Median EventFX, Copy, Paste Event Attributes to 11 additional DV.AVI events on the timeline, and then open them one by one to change the effect settings. I get a crash on the fourth event. Crashes occur as soon as the dialog opens, not while making adjustments.

The Median filter is an OFX filter but it's not 32-bit. Most OFX filters are 32-bit. All of them are capable of GPU acceleration. My VP11-64 system isn't capable of GPU acceleration and it's off in prefs.

--Apply "Invert" EventFX, Copy, Paste Event Attributes to 11 additional DV.AVI events on the timeline, and then open them one by one to change the effect settings. It didn't crash after 12 adjustments, which is much farther than I get with OFX effects.

Invert is a DirectX Effect. It's 32-bit but not GPU accelerated.

I'm going to guess that the problem is with OFX effects but it could also lie in the fact that they're all capable of using GPU acceleration.

larry-peter wrote on 12/5/2011, 10:11 AM
Are you suspecting that the install of VP11 may be the origination point? I have purchased 11 but not installed yet. I do recall a few crashes in VP10-64bit when applying just a few event level Color Curves and Color Correction to m2t files captured from a JVC-GY110U, but have several projects in VP10 where I applied over 20 Curves/Correction combos to AVCHD files as event FX without a hiccup. I don't believe I've ever had a crash working with DV/avi in VP10 - and I'm always using the curves FX. If you suspect the 11 install is the cause, I may hold off a bit longer.
rmack350 wrote on 12/5/2011, 11:12 AM
Hi Larry,

I'd hold off installing VP11 if you haven't done so yet. And if you have the time you could do folks a favor and try applying an OFX filter in VP10 to a handful of events, one by one. If it's not crashing after 10 or 20 applications I'd say that VP11 is probably introducing the problem.

It's certainly possible that it's only the 64-bit version of Vegas, or only the newest build. Or even operator error. I haven't really swapped out any of those factors to test the alternatives. :-)

rmack350 wrote on 12/5/2011, 12:20 PM
Okay then...
I'm trying this again on a computer at work also running VP11-64 b.425.

I can't crash the OFX filters on this machine, which is an older Core 2 Duo 8400 with 6 GB RAM and an ATI2400XT card. Still not GPU accelerated. The home machine is an i5 with 8GB and integrated Intel graphics. No acceleration.

So I wouldn't say that the bug is "built in" to VP11-64. No idea how to fix it, though. The fact that the problem, when it exists, affects VP11 and also VP10 makes me think there's a common library that's broken and not being overwritten when I reinstall VP11.

rmack350 wrote on 12/6/2011, 1:23 AM
So, regarding the question of whether VP11 is *safe* to install, I'd say set a restore point, back up your system disk if you can, and make sure you've got the most current builds. If you happen to have downloaded the NewBlue Titler throw it out and download it again. There was an update to it but no way to know if you've got it until you install it. I'm not saying this is a problem but better safe than sorry.

Currently I've got one good install of VP11 and one that crashes. That's 50/50 odds, which ain't good.