Good idea.

There's nothing unusual about my media or what I'm trying to do that I can tell. I'm using an Apple QuickTime MP4 video clip in an MOV wrapper @ 1080p 30fps. Nothing unusual.

The crashes that I can reproduce at will have to do with just alternating between the default display view and my custom display view. He is one of the crashes I just reproduced now for this post:

And here's a really odd bug having to do with the key frames randomly redrawing and erasing by me just moving the cursor left and right in the timeline while having the PiP key frames displayed. I captured a video:

https://1drv.ms/v/s!Av4VAeTyFoYLj8NW6pbq9yCGlEj5Vg?e=bk7gaD

Very frustrating.

Please share MediaInfo for your media. Telling is the container doesn't say what's in it. I linked to how to do this above.

It's probably a GPU decoding issue. Can you share a screenshot of preferences/ file io? (I assume Vegas isn't using the Intel® HD Graphics 4600 as it's not supported any longer but would be good to confirm).

@stevefoobar2 - Yeah, this is most frustrating, when, as you say you not doing anything different.

OK, do what @RogerS asks. Also the next time you get that Error Request to fill in, do check that other box too, “Show Problem Details”:

Since you have started doing more advance work and seeing these issues, Was it that you have recently installed any particular new software or updated anything?.... Because the issues you have described are not normal behavior for VP19 (424).

Please share MediaInfo for your media. Telling is the container doesn't say what's in it. I linked to how to do this above.

It's probably a GPU decoding issue. Can you share a screenshot of preferences/ file io? (I assume Vegas isn't using the Intel® HD Graphics 4600 as it's not supported any longer but would be good to confirm).

Since you have started doing more advance work and seeing these issues, Was it that you have recently installed any particular new software or updated anything?.... Because the issues you have described are not normal behavior for VP19 (424).

Well, certainly good to know this isn't "normal" behavior for VP 19. No, I've not installed anything recently or done any updates. Thanks.

@stevefoobar2 - Have for got QT Checked under “Deprecated” Tab in Preferences?

@stevefoobar2 - Have for got QT Checked under “Deprecated” Tab in Preferences?

I did not. I checked it and it made no difference. Thanks for the tip though. Not sure what this really does anyway.

By the way, I filed a bug for the odd key frame random redrawing issue. I can't imagine what else that could be except a bug. I haven't tested to see if it happens in effects other the PiP yet, but probably will test more tomorrow.

I did not. I checked it and it made no difference.

@stevefoobar2 - Close and reopen VP. Just to ensure it’s taken.

Thanks for the tip though. Not sure what this really does anyway.

@stevefoobar2 - Well, I noticed that that File has QuickTime inside it, not having available under Deprecated could produce an issue. O..K.. Do you even have QT installed on your PC?

@stevefoobar2

 ... or it's just something unique to my computer setup

This may or may not be an issue, but your computer spec (i7-4790) is 2 gens behind the minimum spec for Vegas Pro 19 as per https://www.vegascreativesoftware.com/us/specifications/#productMenu for SD projects.

My previous editing computer was an i7-4770 which was insufficient to run Vegas Pro 18 AI Models at all. However, I vaguely recall that someone commented on the forum at the time that Vegas Pro 18's AI FX worked in their i7-4790.

It might be that the more that you demand from Vegas Pro 19, the possible shortcomings of an almost 8 years old CPU are beginning to show. As Vegas Pro has advanced over the years, minimum system requirements have also equally advanced especially for new or updated features.

Thanks for the screenshots.

This is AVC so it doesn't use Quicktime for decoding. Since you checked enable legacy AVC it should load with compoundreader. (you can look at media properties to see what Vegas uses to decode any clips) Generally that one is pretty foolproof... but in your case...

Try to swap out the media to see if that's the issue- this is a drive recorder? Try software like handbrake to re-encode the AVC (production presets are a good place to start- do the same resolution and framerate). Then in Vegas, right click on a clip in the Project Media bin and choose "Swap Video Files." If that solves it re-encode your media in a similar way going forward.

Beyond that, check your AMD drivers- go to help/driver update in Vegas and if there is a newer one, download it.

You can also uncheck legacy AVC on file i/o and see if it works.
If you have to you can also turn off the GPU under preferences/video just for rendering if that's causing an issue.

This is AVC so it doesn't use Quicktime for decoding.

@RogerS - Ah, righto! I got as far as the QT Format Profile and didn't read AVC.

I was actually going to post on a separate thread that I have been having less crashes with V19 than I did with V18 and V17. So far, I only have a freeze usually every once in a while now, which is great. But I also have my personal mantra, save early, save often, or else the sailor in me comes out. LOL.

I did not. I checked it and it made no difference.

@stevefoobar2 - Close and reopen VP. Just to ensure it’s taken.

Thanks for the tip though. Not sure what this really does anyway.

@stevefoobar2 - Well, I noticed that that File has QuickTime inside it, not having available under Deprecated could produce an issue. O..K.. Do you even have QT installed on your PC?

No. I haven't had QT installed in years and have never had any problem editing these files before.

@stevefoobar2

 ... or it's just something unique to my computer setup

This may or may not be an issue, but your computer spec (i7-4790) is 2 gens behind the minimum spec for Vegas Pro 19 as per https://www.vegascreativesoftware.com/us/specifications/#productMenu for SD projects.

My previous editing computer was an i7-4770 which was insufficient to run Vegas Pro 18 AI Models at all. However, I vaguely recall that someone commented on the forum at the time that Vegas Pro 18's AI FX worked in their i7-4790.

It might be that the more that you demand from Vegas Pro 19, the possible shortcomings of an almost 8 years old CPU are beginning to show. As Vegas Pro has advanced over the years, minimum system requirements have also equally advanced especially for new or updated features.

I would certainly consider this a possibility, yes. As you state, maybe it's me doing the more advanced stuff now. Not sure. I hate discarding hardware when I don't have to (land-fill and all that waste) but I realize Windows 11 won't even run on my PC now.

I was actually going to post on a separate thread that I have been having less crashes with V19 than I did with V18 and V17. So far, I only have a freeze usually every once in a while now, which is great. But I also have my personal mantra, save early, save often, or else the sailor in me comes out. LOL.

Interesting and hopefully good news if this is generally true. Yes, VP19 (and 18 for that matter) are unreliable enough to warrant pretty much constant Ctrl + S as I'm working on my computer.

Thanks for the screenshots.

This is AVC so it doesn't use Quicktime for decoding. Since you checked enable legacy AVC it should load with compoundreader. (you can look at media properties to see what Vegas uses to decode any clips) Generally that one is pretty foolproof... but in your case...

Try to swap out the media to see if that's the issue- this is a drive recorder? Try software like handbrake to re-encode the AVC (production presets are a good place to start- do the same resolution and framerate). Then in Vegas, right click on a clip in the Project Media bin and choose "Swap Video Files." If that solves it re-encode your media in a similar way going forward.

Beyond that, check your AMD drivers- go to help/driver update in Vegas and if there is a newer one, download it.

You can also uncheck legacy AVC on file i/o and see if it works.
If you have to you can also turn off the GPU under preferences/video just for rendering if that's causing an issue.

Roger S, thanks for the great suggestions. I'm going to try a lot of trouble shooting today to see if I can narrow down the root cause.

I've had a bit of a breakthrough already this morning. I went back into a different tracking project (much simpler), with different video (different codec and video wrapper) and was very happy to find that the odd key frames random redraw behavior within the Picture in Picture effect DID NOT OCCUR! This means it's not related to my computer or Vegas settings per se. Still may be some obscure bug but that's for the Vegas team to figure out.

I'll try more experimentation later today. Stay tuned.

It is probably a media issue- Vegas can be picky about what it is able to decode. Let us know what you find!

Well, I must say that I'm still stumped and don't have more hours and hours to keep trying to find the root cause. As best as I can tell, it's only happening on one particular video clip in the project and the odd random redrawing of the key frames seems to be reproducible for that clip. If I add key frames to other video clips in the same file, the random redrawing doesn't seem to occur and the key frame behavior (scrolling, highlighting, selecting) seems perfectly normal. Here's what really weird about this. I'm using only one video file in this entire project! All I'm doing is creating different clips on the timeline from the same single video file!

While doing all this work, I did find what appears to be another bug. I noticed that if I zoom into the key frames to see individual key frames then start to manipulate them is some way, sometimes the zoomed in view snaps back to the full zoomed out view without me doing anything to the zoom.

Also while doing this investigation, VP19 crashed twice more while just switching between the default window view and one of my custom window views.

I'm not sure that even the Vegas development team will be able to figure these issues out.

I would like to thank everyone for your help and suggestions. At least I have somewhat of a work-around now and can also start the project from scratch if I want to, since I haven't done overly complex edits in this project yet. That may get rid of the off problem going forward.

I must be honest though and say I'm not very impressed with these advanced effects that I've started using. They seem very clunky and buggy in general and since there is no Preview Video zoom function, it's impossible to track objects precisely that are small or get small as the video progresses. I guess I'll only use Vegas for the simplest of tracking effects like titles and such. After all, it's not a post production app and an advanced tracking app like Mocha costs more for the plugin than the entire purchase price of Vegas.

I love Vegas for my "normal" straight-ahead type of video editing and I've had no problems in that workflow. And again, I realize my older PC may not be helping matters.

Lesson learned I guess.

Thanks again!

@stevefoobar2

... and an advanced tracking app like Mocha costs more for the plugin than the entire purchase price of Vegas.

There is a reasonably priced alternative. FXHome have a free product called HitFilm Express - https://fxhome.com/product/hitfilm-express - which is a hugely trimmed down version of HitFilm Pro. Vegas Effects is also a trimmed down but fuller featured version of HitFilm Pro. But the advantage is that the HitFilm Express Add-on Store - https://fxhome.com/store/hitfilm-express - allows you to purchase specific add-ons for use in HF Express. One of those add-ons is Mocha Hitfilm - https://fxhome.com/store/hitfilm-express#mocha - which costs just $49.99 USD.

Mocha HitFilm is not Mocha Pro but it does do planar tracking and the like. Fom the add-on webpage re Mocha Hitfilm:

Upgrade to Academy Award-winning technology from Imagineer Systems. Speed up compositing with 3D camera tracking and planar mask tracking. Mocha HitFilm provides accurate mask tracking, massively accelerating your compositing projects.

For many years, it has been possible to link directly from a video event on Vegas Pro's timeline to HitFilm Pro, work on that event in HFP and then save it back to the event on VP's timeline. I am not sure if this convenient to-and-fro works with HF Express, but perhaps somebody on the forum could advise.

For more info, have a look at FXHome's YT video re Mocha HitFilm - . And this one from 2013 - . %There are others on FXHome's YT channel as well.

Did you do the re-encode yet? Handbrake- pick a production preset, uncheck the resolution limit and swap out the files. If you don't have glitches you figured it out.

The non-supported iGPU may cause issues with stability in Vegas- if it's possible to disable the HD Graphics 4600 in bios or device manager to test, consider that as you have a working GPU.