Right - click on the surround panner -> Pan Type
You have a number of options which are explained in the help manual under "Audio Panning Modes."

Thanks for the pointer, but I'm afraid I don't really understand it. What mode should I be in to avoid cuts or gain in my situation? is it the 0db centre balance one?

Having read the "5.1 LFE question" thread, I am now getting even more confused. Can anybody steer me towards a sample project that is all set up to simply drop in the mixed separate surround tracks in their correct positions and at their correct levels? Can that be done in Vegas with the certainty that it is not changing anything or filtering anything, or crossing over anything?

And as my surround track was mixed in a proper studio, should I be using the LFE filter option in the project properties menu, or should i just switch it off?

So much confusion!

The impression I'm getting, is that unless you have some special effects that require lots of LFE, that you should probably leave the LFE off. From what I've read, the 5 regular channels are full frequency, normal channels and DVD players will automatically send some of the low-end bass to the LFE.
If you create your own LFE, this is where I get confused, I'm not sure what happens on playback. Am I just adding in special Low frequency noises (explosions, earthquakes etc) to the LFE and the other 5 work as if encoded with no LFE and automatically dump some of the bass to the playback LFE or if those 5 channels have the lows cut out because during encoding the cut-off frequency was recorded to each of the 5 tracks and you need to then add everything below the cut-off point back to the LFE during encoding (so the regular part of the audio doesn't lose its bass).
I still haven't rendered anything, but in my 5.1 timeline, I had to lower the levels of my premixed tracks by 6dB in order to keep my master VU meters under the red. This is with each of my 4 tracks panned 100% to it's own corner. Each track was completely fine, when I was in regular stereo mode, but as soon as I switched to 5.1, that changed.
Unfortunately, we are both probably at a point where we have to experiment with DVD RWs to make sure of what we're getting.
I can see that a lot of people don't understand this at all. Dolby sure knows how to BS.

Actually, I don't need to do any testing, all I want is Vegas to pass an existing mix straight through to the AC3 codec. It has all already been mixed, including the LFE, in a studio by my engineer. So all I need is to get the surround track into my project and correctly panned into it's relevant channel and then mix it down.

When I switch Vegas to 5.1 mode, all my tracks are too loud with the 'default panner'
Try this. Right click on the 5.1 window in the track header and choose 'Pan type', then choose 'Film'
A new type of diagram for 5.1 will show up, more consistent with what the pros say is better for surround. Now right click the 5.1 window again and choose "Surround Panner" to open an individual panner window. This will now say this speaker track is -6.0, but when you play them back, the VU meters move just like they should. (mine did) I had trouble getting every other speaker to say '-inf ', usually one speaker on either left or right side of the speaker you're assigning, would say -68 or something. It is very hard to center 100%, but you can. But this looks like the type of Panner to be used to convert directly to ac3. When I was setting up the front speakers and couldn't get it to be 100% positioned, it was slightly leaking into center channel, of which I have no center channel, but it was showing up in the Center VU meter. The only bad thing I see with this mixer, is getting all the other speakers to say -inf at the same time. It's hard. Or I need a more sensitive mouse. It's beyond me, why they didn't design a snapping feature to make this easy.

Well, I won't exaggerate, this seems like the right panner to use, but positioning it exactly in the speaker is near impossible. I've only gotten one of the five to sit just right, so far. I guess I need to find some more info. I tried both the mouse and also tried the directional arrows with the Ctrl button, but am having a hell of a time getting the other four positioned perfectly.

I don't think Dolby Digital is all it's hyped up to be. Just another lossy format to help save space. But 6 channel, 24bit/48Khz waves probably take up a lot of space. So you gotta compromise. Dolby Digital is not bad, but I don't think any ac3 I've made has ever sounded as good as the wav.

UPDATE: The secret to getting a tad more control on moving the icon directly in the center of the speaker is to grab the edges of the "Surround Panner" window and make it as big as your screen. I now have all 5 regular channels exactly centered in their specified space with a -6 and -inf in the other four speakers in the "Film" panner. It's still not easy, but I did it. The directional arrows with the Ctrl button worked easier than the mouse. It took a little while.
Time to conk out.

**Thanks for the pointer, but I'm afraid I don't really understand it. What mode should I be in to avoid cuts or gain in my situation? is it the 0db centre balance one?**

It depends on what you want to do with your pan. The "Add Channels" setting works like a traditional stereo balance control -- as you move to the left, the sound in the right channel (and center) is gradually cut until it disappears. The center channel gain can cut the center channel.

In "Balance" mode, the stereo image is panned left or right, so that when panned full left, you hear both channels from the left and center speakers. In this mode the -3db and -6db settings actually cut the side speakers, giving the impression of a center channel boost.

With the L-R balance set dead center, I don't believe there is any difference between the two.

The film and constant power modes are mostly used for a series of mono sources.

It's worth pointing out that combining channels boosts the gain additively, which would be undesirable in a center surround channel, so part of the surround process is to compensate the center volume to the average of the left and right channels.

It's easy enough to drop a test tone into your tracks to test the effects of the different settings on the surround meters and at the listening level.

Hi Musicvid,

I did a test today where I positioned each channel, rendered it out as a 6 channel wav64 and then phased each channel against the original channels of the source mix. Then I normalized the resulting empty track to make sure there was no signal. I am now pretty confident that the mix is getting passed through correctly. Thanks for your assistance.

TGS, if it helps, I have a file set up for mixing 5.1. Drop me a line on the email at adjustableproductions.com and I shall forward it to you.

Don't forget that clicking on a speaker icon in the surround panner toggles it off and on, so it's a quick way to completely mute the output channels you don't want (blue icon = on, gray icon = off).

Double-clicking on the pan control 'diamond' will re-center it.

Tony

Hey Robert, Thanks for the offer.
Actually, I'm having pretty good luck with the Film panner. I'm actually remixing my front 3 channels now for real 5.1
Once I set my film panner with each speaker set dead on, all I had to do was drop my tracks in and render them. I had only the front & rear left & rights. The lows are played thru the sub, even though there is no LFE channel.
The 'Film panner', to me, seems like it would have been what you needed to simply transfer the tracks, as you said. But the positioning of the panners in exactly the center of the speaker is necessary to prevent bleed-thru.
I would've needed to send you a .veg to keep you from going thru the hassle.

I gotta say, these 5.1 systems are a joke. If the 5 speakers are supposed to be full range, full spectrum speakers. Everybody's systems I've heard, if you shut off the Sub woofer, the other speakers are a joke. Including the M-Audio LX4, I sometimes use. Don't get me wrong. I know some people have good systems, probably quite a few here, but I'm talking about Joe average.
It doesn't fool me, I know exactly where the sub woofer is.
I know I'm going to end up with 5 good sized speakers. No more Bose Kool-aid for me.