Thanks alot CHien.

If I may dig a little depeer - how do these white spaces appear - excuse my ignorance.

Bit

Well, i'm not one of the programmers who created Vegas, so i'm not sure of the exact logic behind the display. But this is what i've observed ....

If the space on the timeline is too small to show a whole thumbnail then Vegas shows a small portion of the thumbnail, trimming it to just the middle of the image, and fills the event with that trimmed image.

If the space is exactly as wide as the thumbnail then the thumbnail fills the space.

If the space is wider than the thumbnail but narrower than twice the width, then it centers the thumbnail in the space, with empty white areas on either side.

If the space is twice the width of the thumbnail or more, then Vegas draws as many thumbnails in the event as it can fit, spreading them out evenly across the space and inserting white space inbetween as necessary so that the first thumbnail touches the left edge of the event and the last one touches the right edge.

You can see this in action by zooming in (up arrow) or zooming out (down arrow) and watching what happens.

Once again, it's the width of the rectangular area of the event that is significant. This is what defines the start, duration, and end of the event on the timeline. The thumbnails are only there to help you know which events are which. If you wish, you can turn off the thumbnails and then all you'll see is empty white rectangles.

Why white? *shrug* Dunno. but it's not always white. Selected events will show blue instead of white. Events out of sync will show pink. Muted tracks will show grey. White i guess means that everything is normal.

Many thanks Chien. Very interesting.

Can you assist my understanding of opeing up rendered files to proceed with further editing?

My rendered file (.avi) is 47MB. When I open this this file - nothing but when I open the .veg file - it appears.

What is the process I follow to open up rendered files?

Bit

Well, before we get lost in too many directions, let me ask why you want to open up the rendered file for further editing. What do you want to accomplish by working on the rendered file that you can't do by continuing to work on the original project?

In a post early in this thread, Peter Wright said i had to render file to save my cut version.

All i want to do is save my 6 hours of work (cut from 80 mins down to 20 mins).

These are his words..
"The veg file, which is what you Save, is simply a list of instructions detailing how you have arranged the media and what you have done in the project. It is NOT the media itself. If you want to make a new clip out of your edited project, use Render as...."


Am i going about it wrong way?

Bit

Pardon my comment if it appears out of line.... But... Mr. Bit "cam herd" you've been posting comments on this forum since 2005. I find it odd that your questions in this thread would lead one to believe you are STILL a total newbie.

You've posted questions in the past that have raised questions as to who you really are and why some one with in depth knowledge in some topics is asking such rudimentary questions like "what are these black lines?" Have you used Vegas at all since then? What's the deal Bit? You use terms like "scrub" yet you don't know the difference between saving a project and rendering a video? Give me a break.

Here's just one clip from a 2005 thread:
http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?Forum=4&MessageID=406885Curious Thread[/link]

Does anyone else find this odd? Here's another insight from a previous thread from Mr. Bit where he was "learning heaps":
-------------------------------------------
Subject: RE: Matching of source data to project data
Reply by: Liam_Vegas
Date: 8/12/2005 1:17:29 PM

Er..... what part of the world are you from? I seem to recall you are from Australia? If so... then you ARE in PAL land. Not NTSC.

Certainly if you have 25fps video... then that is pretty much guaranteed to be PAL. So that's what you should be using.

USA = NTSC

I'm beginning to wonder if you are maybe playing a joke on us? It would be quite funny actually.

Some of your posts have been borderline "weird" (in my opinion) and either comes from someone who is genuinely new to all this and cannot be bothered to read even the barest of information that is available anywhere - or someone who is just having a nice time playing with us. I can't decide which one you are.

I certainly don't mean to offend.... but wanted to share this "creepy" feeling I am having. Maybe I just need to go and lie down.

All i want to do is save my 6 hours of work (cut from 80 mins down to 20 mins).

By "save" do you mean that you want create a new AVI (video) file or save your project ("work")?

If new video file, use File>Make Movie>Save it to your hard drive and choose the appropriate file type. Deselect "Render loop region only" to render everything on the timeline. To use this new file, open a new project (veg file) and drag the file to the timeline from the Explorer tab (

If new .veg file, use File>Save As. While it's good practice to save (ctrl-s) frequently, it's also good to do a Save As to create a new version of your project (projectname1, projectname 2, etc). Then if you need to, you can go back to a prior version of your project.

If you haven't already, I suggest you go through the Show Me How tutorials. (Help > Show Me How). I have Movie Studio which has them but I don't know if the full Vegas version has it. They're very good at "walking" you through the basics of how Vegas operates.

ADDED: Jim, you posted while I was composing mine. I too thought that Bit's posts were of the newbie type. However in his/her defense, there's almost a year gap between previous posts and the more recent ones. So my guess is that Bit *IS* a novice editor and just hasn't gotten it yet. We all know Vegas has a steep learning curve and if don't use it frequently, it can be daunting.

Bit, we don't mean to offend, but it would be good to find some tutorials and give them a look see. Do a Search and look for "tutorial" and read through some of those threads. Gaining a better understanding of Vegas will help you in the long run. As I said, Vegas can be daunting to learn, but once you do, it all makes sense.

Keep those questions coming.

Am i going about it wrong way?

In a word, yes.
If you had bothered to follow up on either of the links I provided in this thread, you wouldn't be asking such basic questions.
Sorry for being abrupt but Jim H is right.
You would thing that someone who joined this group on 4/18/2005 would at least have the basics down by now.

Mike

Thanks MSmart, CHienworks and others for providing very constructive advice - aside from the sometimes vague Vegas Manual - relaly appreciated.

MSmart :
When i "save as" - the .veg extension appears.
When I want to open this file again, should I open the .veg file up?
Why is this .veg file so small (70kb) for a 20min clip?

Good on you Jim for being observant. .... If you care to look deeper into my history - I only reached capture stage back in 2005 - never got into the editing bit as I am now... Work, babies, moving interstate, saving my marriage all some how got in the way of sitting behind a computer for a few hours playing with Vegas - Sorry I am not as lucky as you guys....

I was waiting for these comments to bubble up again. I could have easily signed up as a new Foum user (with a new user ID) a few days ago and you wouldn't have known - but I chose not to.

Yes, I ask too many questions and yes, I choose to minimise my time into vague user manuals/tutorials. No-one is forcing you to assist with my queries...

Bit of Byte.

Hi Bit, I knew there had to be a reason for the gap in posts. Hopefully things are getting sorted out.

When i "save as" - the .veg extension appears.
Correct, you're saving a new version of the project.

When I want to open this file again, should I open the .veg file up?
Yes.

Why is this .veg file so small (70kb) for a 20min clip?
Because the veg file is basically just a bunch of pointers to your video file telling Vegas where your edit points are so it doesn't have to be very big.

Your video file on the hard drive hasn't been altered in any way even though you've "cut" most of it out on the timeline. To create a new file that only contains your edits, you have to do a Make Movie.

Thanks MSmart.

I initially captured my video through ScenAnalyzer that contained around 50 avi files. Am I correct in saying that the veg file I created 'talks' to all these avi files? And, if so, am I then not allowed to delete any of these avi files form my HDD?

Must the veg file always lie in the same HDD folder as the original captured avi files?

I am now a bit confused, sorry.

Earlier in this thread 'PeterWright' indicated I have to render to save my edited version. And, you state I need to 'Make Movie' to create a new file that contains my edits.....

Can i re-edit a 'Make Movie' version?

Bit

If you have the 50 avi files in the timeline, then yes, the veg file "talks" to them. No, you can't delete these files until you have created a new file from them.

No, the veg file can be located anywhere. For organizational purposes, I create a separate folder for each project and locate the veg files there. The captured video files go into a sub-folder and the output video files go into a different sub-folder.

PeterWright and I are basically saying the same thing, "rendering" is what's done with you do the Make Movie.

Yes, you can re-edit the Make Movie version. This new AVI file can be brought into a new projects timeline and additional effects can be added. However, explain what you're want to do when you say "re-edit". I ask because, if you don't like how the new file looks, you can make changes in the timeline of the original project and "render" a new (second) AVI file. I sometimes have to re-render if I find errors in the newly created file.

Think of your captured files as "inputs" and the rendered files as "outputs". You use the inputs in your project, edit them as needed and create one or more outputs. When you have the output file you like, you're done.

Well, not quite done, exactly, because what will you ultimately do with the file? Burn it to a DVD? That's for later, let's not get too far ahead of ourselves just yet.

Hopefully you are now clear about the difference between a project file (.veg) and a media file (avi, wav, jpg etc etc)

You don't have to have the veg file on the same HD as the media. The veg will know where you sourced the media from, and if you move it it will detect this when being opened and offer to either search for new location, allow you to tell it the new location, or you can tell it to leave that clip offline and continue.

Now, having finished editing, you may well want to free up some space by getting rid of your source media files. Once agian, you have options how to do this.

1. You can Render the timeline into a new single file (this is the same as Make Movie - but Make Movie is Adobe speak, not Vegas. After making this new clip, you can delete all your original media if you're sure you don't want it for anything else.

2. You can Save As, but this time you can tick the box "Copy and Trim Media with Project".
This will create new shortened versions of all your media, consisting purely of the edited portions you have used in your timeline. If you want to be able to make final "tweaks" later you can choose to add "handles" - maybe a second before and a second after each of your cuts. You need to have room for Vegas to create all these new media files in your nominated folder, but afterwards you can delete all your original media and get that space back.

hthrtc
(hope this helps rather than confuses)

Wowee! THanks for the dirt!

Will play some more...

For this particualr exercise, I am happy with what I have (20min cut version from the 80min capture) and am willing to permantly delete the captured version (18GB) from my HDD to free up more space now and work (edit further with effects. etc.) with my 20min version.

So, in this case, I have chosen Option 1. "Render As" (avi file name).

But, when I open this 14 MB file in a new timeline, I see a black box with nothing in it that goes for about 3 secs. It seems the veg file was not created either - still a bot confuised - sorry.

Bit

So maybe I'm way off base here. Maybe the helpful folks back in 2005 were too when they raised their concerns. My apologies if I'm wrong. I've found the members of this forum to be the most helpful people on the internets. I'm also guilty of asking first and reaching for the manual as a last resort.

So forgive this one last entry then I'll just observe. You say you "only reached [the] capture stage back in 2005 - never got into the editing bit as I am now... " However, your 3rd post in 2005 asks the same editing question you asked above - I hope you're not still working on the same video?
http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?Forum=4&MessageID=403110Editing Question - Cutting of Unwanted Video[/link]
So maybe you can understand why some question your questions.
I'll give you credit for one thing, you remain polite and forgiving of the many pointed questions people have asked you about your indentity and intentions. One thing this forum does NOT have, is flame wars and it is not my intention to start one. (BTW, what sort of name is "cam berd?") Peace.

Peter, I must have overlooked the "copy and trim" option as I've never used it. However, I think doing so would confuse Bit. The reason is that using it causes the video and audio to get split into two separate files. It would confuse even me.

I think item 1 is best for Bit.

No probs Jimmy.

I know where work emails can end up with these sorts of converstaions when people shoot first and ask later so I find it is always pays to chill for a bit, wait and try to understand the root cause of gaps - not symptoms of gaps.

Anyway, I have not even touched that video back in 2005 - yet - still to be edited from square 1 - just playing and testing the waters..I have been to hell and back over last 2 years.

Often, those who use a product/service intimatley know much more than user manuals - that is why I am here and yes, I have asked similar questions as per 2005 - my fault for not looking back. I am not trying to be someone I ain't, no secret agent or Cremlin man - just a bit lazy.

"Cam Berd" is for my eyes only.

Anyway, how do I move a move a video frame along with it's audio frame along the timeframe simulataneously??

Bit

But, when I open this 14 MB file in a new timeline, I see a black box with nothing in it that goes for about 3 secs. It seems the veg file was not created either

The black indicates gaps in the original projects timeline.To better see where the gaps are, click the "+" plus symbol on the lower right corner of the timeline to zoom in on the timeline. This will make the left/right scroll bar smaller and your events "longer". Turn auto-ripple on and drag the first clip (event) to the left so it's at the very beginning of the timeline. While your zoomed in, slowly scroll to the right to see if you have any other gaps in the time line.

Another veg file won't be created when you rendered your file. Now that you have the new file in a new project's timeline, when you File>Save, then you'll get a new veg file.

Sorry,

I am still missing somehting - I have opened up the new rendered file and expanded it on timeline with auto-ripple on. Still only black squares.

Bit

No, go back to the original veg file with the 50 avi files.

Soory MS.

I thought "Save AS" was veg files.

I want to "Render As" my file.

How do I open up a rendered file ?

Bit

1) Correct

2) Do "Make Movie"

3) File>New (to create new project (veg)), drag file onto timeline from Explorer tab.

But you're wanting to get rid of the black at the front of your video, correct? If so, you have to do a File>Open, to open the veg file that contains your 50 avi files and look for the gap in the timeline there.