Drop Frame?

Chienworks wrote on 12/23/2005, 7:37 PM

Everything will work much better once you throw away that USB cable and use firewire instead.

khersee wrote on 12/25/2005, 5:08 PM

Well, ... I have a Sony DCR-HC21 Digital Camcorder. No firewire here. I should have added a detail, also, to the post. The rendered movie file (.MOV) became over 24 Gigs in size when complete. Is that normal for an 11 minute movie? I'm pretty sure not! Also, USB? No audio coming in from there. Is this normal? And, so anyways, this drop frame thing ... how is this handled? Please and thanks you. Kirk

rustier wrote on 12/27/2005, 11:53 AM

I have a Sony hc21, spent the 7 bucks I think for the firewire and use firewire to capture with the Vegas capture software. No problems for me other than I occasionally have to turn the camera off then back on so the computer recognizes it. I would say its a safe bet you are capturing with some other software and Vegas software is upset by that - they mention that other programs can give Vegas "issues" in the manual (It wants to be your one and only). It might be time to do some uninstallin, recheckin, installin. You may want to note that I had to boot my computer in the safe mode to pry the claws of a pinnacle program out of my computer (manually deleting a process that couldnt be done in normal mode and was not unistalled by the normal uninstall process.) do you need a pinnnectomy? hehe

khersee wrote on 12/27/2005, 3:00 PM

I figured out the USB deal. I hadn't plugged my audio out of the camcorder into my computer. Apparently that's what they mean by "video" capture. Sometimes my computer also lets me know that it has found new hardware when I plug the camcorder in. What is involved with this firewire deal, as far as our similar camcorders go?
What would I need? Thanks, Kirk

rustier wrote on 12/28/2005, 5:54 AM

There is a place on the side of the HC21 (under the oval plastic tab)where you can plug in a firewire. All you need is a firewire (get them at any electronics store.)Hopefully your computer has a place to plug a firewire into. If not you will have to use the usb or invest in a firewire accessory card (or a multimedia card which has the firewire plug built in.) The nice thing about firewire is that you can control the camera with your computer and firewire signals go both ways - so if you want you can send stuff out to the camera ( I haven't really sent much out but that is an option.) Video capture with firewire using the Vegas capture software is the best way to go to have headache free capture in a file format Vegas Studio is "happy" to work with. It has been my experience that other files captured by other means may say they are mpeg or whatever may not work as well (all the time). I am guessing that there are slight differences in how video is processed by different software even though it is called by the same file name.

volzjr wrote on 12/28/2005, 7:30 AM

Just to add to what rustier said... Using firewire to capture will also include the audio portion. There is no need to hook up audio cables to complete a firewire capture.
With the fact that Vegas really "plays well" with firewire, and the added camera control from your PC, it really is the way to go.

khersee wrote on 12/30/2005, 4:55 PM

Would a USB -> Firewire setup work? Or should I go get a card for my computer? Kirk

Chienworks wrote on 12/30/2005, 5:07 PM

Get a firewire interface card for your computer. Avoid touching USB at all.

khersee wrote on 12/31/2005, 6:30 PM

Thanks for the help ... any chance in a lead what/where to start looking? I use tiger direct a lot. I'll check in there. Kirk

well-read-neck wrote on 1/1/2006, 9:03 AM

Here you go. PCI card that adds firewire ports and USB 2 ports to your computer, plus a firewire cable. All bundled for 26 bux.

http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=130103

joem wrote on 1/1/2006, 1:05 PM

khersee, most videocamera manufactures assume a lot about what the consumer knows/understands about videography. The gentlemen in this forum are sharing their wisdom with you now. Most manufactures will not include a firewire cord with your camcorder. A USB costs them zip ( zero ), so they inculde it in the box. USB cable is great for transferring your digital stills from your camcorder- but transferring video from your camcorder requires firewire( video transfers at a higher speed than digital pictures therefore the dropped frames ). Purchase the firewire cord and firecard if you don't have it on your computer. The HC1 is a serious machine, treat it right and it will give you the most spestacular video you've ever seen!

Best of luck --the best of the year to you all---Joe M

khersee wrote on 1/1/2006, 1:18 PM

Thanks so much for all your responses. I was checking my camera for the f/w port, though, and don't seem to have one. I even cheked the book and nothing. The only mention of something other than USB is an iLink. What's up? Also, joem, maybe the problem is I have a DCR-HC21 and not an HC1? Help thanks. Kirk

dcrandall wrote on 1/1/2006, 1:22 PM

iLink is Sony's name for Firewire or EEE1394.

-Dan

well-read-neck wrote on 1/1/2006, 1:39 PM

Sony may also refer to it as the DV port.

If you're interested, here is a link to a review of your camcorder by Matt Culler at camcorderinfo dot com.

http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/Sony-DCR-HC21-Camcorder-Review.htm

khersee wrote on 1/3/2006, 1:01 PM

I picked up the card ... also, a f/w cable. Are they basically all the same? I purchased this one:
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=788072
... please let me know this is ok. Thanks, Kirk.

PS - how the heck do you insert a URL in a post??

Ptero wrote on 1/3/2006, 1:15 PM

This doesn't look right. I have a Sony DCR-TRV280 which I'm guessing takes the same connector plug, and that connector is a small (6-pin, I think) while the connector on the FireWire card (a.k.a. i.Link, a.k.a. IEEE1394) is a much larger socket - about the same size as a USB socket but with a "pointed" end so that you can only plug it in the right way.

My suggestion would be, first check to see if your computer already has a FireWire connector - some do, some don't. If not, go and buy a FireWire card (I picked up a 4-port card for $30 from MicroCenter and that included the cable!) then look at the DV/FireWire connector plugs on the computer and the camera and locate a cable that'll fit.

I think the cable you've indicated has a small, 6-pin connector at both ends, and that won't fit any FireWire card I've seen.

[CORRECTION - I just checked and it looks like the 6-pin connector *is* the type that goes into the card. The camera end probably takes a 4-pin connector (much smaller). In other words, I still think you have the wrong cable, just not the way I explained it :)]

Chienworks wrote on 1/3/2006, 1:30 PM

To insert a URL you must use the appropriate HTML code. Type in

<a href=http://www.url.com>description</a>

to end up with a link that looks like description (wherever the heck that goes ...)

So for your TigerDirect link you would type in

<a href=http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=788072>TigerDirect firewire cable</a>

to get TigerDirect firewire cable

Note that the "http://" part is required. If you leave it out you'll get a bad link to the sonymediasoftware.com website.

Chienworks wrote on 1/3/2006, 1:42 PM

This is a typical cable used to connect the camera to the computer:

4 pin to 6 pin

khersee wrote on 1/3/2006, 1:47 PM

Typical. OK. Ummm before I just up and order anything (again) ... who else is f/w'ing the DCR-HC21? And what cable are you using?
Is a 4 to 6-pin the same as a 6 to 4-pin? Please and thank you. Kirk

Chienworks wrote on 1/3/2006, 2:09 PM

The manual for your camcorder doesn't specify which connector it has. However, i have never seen a "palm-sized" camcorder that had a 6 pin connector. You can tell by the size. A 4 pin jack is about 1/8" by 1/4" with a ridge along the middle of one of the wider sides. A 6 pin jack is about 1/4" by 1/2" and contains a flat post in the middle with 6 visible conductors, 3 to a side, and one end of the opening has the corners cut off. You can determine which one your camcorder has by eye.

Yes, 4 to 6 pin is the same as 6 to 4 pin. You should also check your computer to see which size connector it has. Once again, *most* computers have a 6 pin connector, but not all.

khersee wrote on 1/3/2006, 2:16 PM

At this point there is no f/w on my computer. I went to order it and got a couple other things I need, but forgot the card (the one recommended in this post). I am on hold w/ Tiger Direct now so I can edit the order (if I buy the card I get the f/w cable with it). Waiting .... at least there's no muzak. I'll follow up asap. Kirk

rustier wrote on 1/4/2006, 9:10 AM

I have a Sony DCR-HC21 digital video camera and a Sony Vaio desktop computer which came with "i-link" and multimedia input. For my camera and computer it is a 4pin to 4pin firewire connector. Honestly I don't know what the differences are with the six pin connector (for your computer) other than it has two more pins - which I assume you won't be using with the 4 pin output of the camera (unless there is some sort of wierd crossover thing going on) I am not sure if this will answer your question or thoroughly confuse you, but I hope it helps. Perhaps there is someone in the forum that can explain the difference between a 4 and 6 pin firewire. Good luck with it!

Ptero wrote on 1/4/2006, 9:25 AM

The two extra pins on the 6-pin connector carry power. Desktop systems generally have 6-pin connectors while laptops and camcorders mostly use the 4-pin connector because of space.

rustier wrote on 1/4/2006, 9:26 AM

I found an explanation of the differences:

firewire explained

Hope that helps