Correct or not, i always render from VMS to an avi file. then i use DVDA to create the files to burn to a DVD. my DV source is a Panny GS400, and i always "film" in WS. i don't have a problem viewing this on my WS front projector.

my problem is, when i'm making a DVD for someone else who i know does not have a ws tv now. when i resize the ws to a 4:3ar, sometimes it formats it correctly, and others it does not. again, i render the 4:3 to an avi file, and then have 2 different titles (one for WS and one for 4:3) in DVDA. hopefull both formats will be available to them, because sooner or later they will have a ws. maybe it is the way DVDA works trying to create 16:9 in one title and a 4:3 in another title. The 4:3 usually looks like a reduced 16:9 with a black border around the outside. so lately i have just been burning the DVD with the 4:3ar and this works fine.

hth, ron

If you filmed in widescreen you should render in widescreen
all the way to the finished product. To convert widescreen to
4:3 you would need to chop off both sides with pan and crop
to keep the aspect correct. I render to widescreen and on my
4:3 tv's it just has black bars above and below, just like a rented or bought dvd.

Thanks for these replies. I produced a short (6 minute) sequence using VMS to produce an AVI and a MPEG file (the apparent VMS preferred format for passing to DVD Architect) to compare the end product. I used Architect to burn the DVD and then gave it to a friend to view on his widescreen TV. His comments were

"The AVI created version uses the full size wide TV screen and is fine. The MPEG created version has a border of 100mm or so all around the picture so that it is much smaller, but arguably slightly more crisp as it has not been stretched so far.." but he adds he is "very happy with the first, larger format."

So, in future, I think I'll get VMS to create an AVI for Architect, even though the VMS programmers think it should be produced in MPEG format for Architect.

Thanks again for your comments.

Philip

That doesn't make any sense at all. Architest and vms use the same exact render to make a dvd. Something else is causing this.
It 's definately full widescreen on my widescreen tv and black bars top and bottom on regular tv. Hmmmmm......

IF you are going to do more editing on your "finished" file, you never want to edit an MPEG file when you could edit an avi file. i know it will take longer for DVDA to render the finished files when you start with an avi file, but you will save it in the highest fidelity you can with VMS.

sorry i can't help with your shrunk WS. when you rendered did you use the correct Template in the Make Movie tab?

hth,ron

Sorry, but I don't agree with that. While you're editing video you should keep things in the highest quality format. The source file isn't changed in DVDAS though, so it's better to work with MPEG and avoid having to re-encode every time you make a change to your menus.

Ian G.

thanks for helping IanG, you and Chienworks always post very helpful replies.

i probably misunderstood some advice i gathered from this forum. it was my understanding that an avi file was a much better file to change/edit/add than was an mpeg file. The .avi is uncompressed, whereas the mpeg file is compressed. i know it is a larger file and does require a render EVERY time a change is made. to me this is a small cost to always have the higher quality file to make changes to maybe 6 months later from an archived file saved on a DVD?

maybe the better way is to use the vf file, created when the editing is done, and the original avi files, then you have the best quality.

please tell me what i am doing wrong,

ron

>it was my understanding that an avi file was a much better file to change/edit/add than was an mpeg file

That's absolutely right! Maybe I misunderstood, but I thought the suggestion was to use avi files in DVDAS. Since DVDAS doesn't make any changes to your video file, there's no reduction in quality by working with MPEG, so it's better to have VMS do the encoding once rather than have DVDAS do it every time the menu is changed.

Ian G.

i hate to keep beating this to death--this will be my last post on this subject. IanG--you did not misunderstand. this was/still is what i would tell someone, and it is what i do. i guess like a lot of things, there are many different ways to skin a cat. mine works for me, and yours no doubt works for you.

i have lots of short clips--less than 2 minutes each. clips of dog trials, some of which are less than 1 minute. using VMS, for a given weekend, they (usually 4 but sometimes 6 clips) are assembled onto the timeline, the begining and ending are shortened to just include the run. i then add text (for the day and type of run and the dog) with transitions and chapter markers at the beginning of each clip. i then render an avi file using VMS. this file is what gets inserted in DVDAS, with title etc. DVDAS then "Prepares" the files to be burned on a DVD. Over time, more avi files are added until i either reach the end of the year or fill the DVD. If there are changes, or additions, like a Title arrives from AKC after a particular run , i then inset a still of a ribbon and a notation at the end of a clip. sometimes it's weeks after the trial that we get notification a title was won. after the chnages i repeat the steps from above.

i just did a test on my puter with an avi clip which is 245mb with NO text or chapter markers.
using VMS it took 4:10 to create mpg file
using VMS it took 7:28 to create wma file
using DVDAS it took :07 to Prepare the files or a total of 11:45

the same avi clip
using VMS it took :36 to create an avi file--wich contains both audio and video
using DVDAS it took 5:10 to prepare the files or a total of 5:46.

clearly on my computer it is quicker to render an avi file in VMS. it is my understanding it is the same MainConcept renderer (correct word??) used in both VMS & DVDAS. so i see no advantage to rendering to mpg in VMS for what i do. AND i see no advantage with larger files--except if i were an edit once and add the chapter markers and text etc in DVDAS. but then maybe this is why i have problems adding 16:9 and 4:3 clips into DVDAS, and not having them look right...

i'm going to "play" with this some more. and many thanks for listening. any suggestions to how i do this are really appreciated. and sorry for stealing the thread. ron

Ron, I think there's still some life in this :-)

>there are many different ways to skin a cat. mine works for me, and yours no doubt works for you.

Yes! If I'm giving the impression that there's a "right" way (my way) then I apologise!

I don't understand why the wma render is taking so long - I've just rendered a 7 minute project to wma and it took 29 seconds! Leaving that aside though, if you get your DVD authoring right first time there shouldn't be much difference in the ammount of time it takes. My problem is that I never do - as soon as I play a DVD on the TV I spot something horrible and have to go back and change things. That's where I get the benefit.

Cheers

Ian G.

Maybe I'm missing something, but what's with the render to .wma for audio? Shouldn't you just render a .wav file (PCM)? This normally is very quick -- less than 30 seconds or so, even for a much longer file. PCM/wav is what DVDAS will put onto the disc.

I'm still on the fence as to whether or not I should render to AVI to send to DVDAS, then let DVDAS render the MPEG2. By doing this, you have the option to "fit to disc" for long projects, and can also manually select the highest bit rate (8 mbps or even higher) for the MPEG2 render for short projects. When rendering from VMS, you don't have any option to select the bit rate -- you're stuck with that "black box" template that doesn't even tell you what the bit-rate is.

I had done an experiment a while ago, and the template in VMS definitely uses a bit rate lower than 8 mbps, but it's hard to pin down. I'm going to guess that maybe it's something like 6 mbps. However, I never burned a dvd of the two approaches -- to compare the results -- so I don't really know if I'd be able to see the difference anyway. At that time, however, I think I'd almost convinced myself that I was wasting my time by rendering to AVI first, and then rendering to MPEG2. A single render to MPEG2 from within VMS was definitely much quicker than rendering first to AVI, and then re-rendering (during the "prepare" step) in DVDAS.

And yet, as I type this, I am rendering a project to AVI in the background. I'm so scared of change :-(

Maybe on my NEXT project I'll summon the courage to just render to MPEG2 from within VMS. Or, maybe not...

Tim L

Could someone please answer Tim L question about render to .wma for audio. Also what is the conclusion on the quality of the video- VMS render to MPG or DVDAS render to MPG from an AVI file. My thought is that they should be the same if the same bit rate is used.