Editing video from DVD camcorder

VanLazarus wrote on 8/5/2005, 4:38 AM
Until now I have been very pleased with Vegas 6's flexibility in editing a multitude of file types. Can anyone explain why Sony would leave out the ability in Vegas to edit video data created by a DVD camcorder? Yes, yes, I've read others say that real professionals don't use MPEG source media... but unfortunately not all video source comes from 'professionals'.

I've been given the task to edit a wedding video for a friend. Some of the video provided was from a miniDV camcorder (no problem) and some was from a DVD camcorder on a DVD. When I drag the VOB files into the trackview, Vegas is confused. It seems to only recognize the first scene in the file and when previewed there are flashes of later scenes mingled in with the first scene. Obviously this is unacceptable. Renaming the VOB file to MPG does not improve anything.

Also, of note, the audio track is completely missing. To my displeasure I have read through hundreds of posts covering Vegas's inability to read AC3 audio streams.... and yet software packages costing a fraction of Vegas can do this?!?!

I can use the MPEG2 enabled version of VirtualDub 1.6.9 (nice work fccHandler!) to read these DVD VOB files with AC3 and regenerate an AVI that Vegas can use.... but.... if I chose to generate an AVI based on the DV format (Panasonic DV codec), the interlacing seems terrible compared to DV files generated by a normal DV camcorder. Is this just a viewer problem? Rendering an uncompressed AVI makes a clean output, but I don't have a 500 GB harddrive free to store 2 hours of uncompressed wedding video for editing purposes!!

Vegas 6 is a great product, but I must say that this inability disappoints. I've spent a considerable amount on buying Vegas 5 and then more to upgrade to Vegas 6 and DVD Architect. Editing DVD camcorder output should be a possibility with this expensive, professional package. Can anyone from Sony explain the reasoning behind why Vegas is missing this ability?

Comments

Laurence wrote on 8/5/2005, 8:11 AM
You could always just capture the DVD video from a firewire capture box like a Canopus ADVC-110.
farss wrote on 8/5/2005, 8:21 AM
I searched far and wide and was unable to find anything at any price that'd reliably edit stuff recorded on these DVD disasters.
I got close but the results were still pretty bad. To deal with the audio you need to extract the ac3 stream, then run that through ac3fix as it contains non standard data blocks will upset most ac3 converters like BeSweet, finally you can get the audio back as .wav.
There's also something screwy with the mpeg-2 data, mostly it looked OK converted to DV but not 100% perfect, it still at times had something odd with the motion.
I think in your case you might have the field order reversed, try swaping it and see how you go.
As to the suggestion of playing it back in the camera and recording that, yeah fine idea until the client gets the camera stolen before they've finalised the disk!
Bob.
Chienworks wrote on 8/5/2005, 8:32 AM
Is it possible to use something like Nero to finalize the disc in those situations?
JohnnyRoy wrote on 8/5/2005, 8:34 AM
> Can anyone explain why Sony would leave out the ability in Vegas to edit video data created by a DVD camcorder?

It’s a case of the right tool for the right job. Vegas is squarely aimed and professionals who shoots DV or HDV. Nothing is stopping hobbyists from buying it, but don’t expect hobbyist features. That’s why Sony makes Vegas Movie Studio. That’s where I would expect a feature like this to show up.

I realize that occasionally you may be asked to edit someone else’s footage that may have been shot on a consumer device but that is an exception and its not a big deal to work around. IMHO, there are more important features that Vegas needs and Sony should be focusing on.

> Also, of note, the audio track is completely missing.

Type “AC3 to WAVE” into Google, download any of the free AC3 to WAV file converters and extract a WAV file from the VOB. Drop the VOB on one track and the WAV file on the other, group them together, and you’re all set edit.

Yes, AC3 import would be a big convenience in Vegas, but it’s not a big deal to work around.

~jr
birdcat wrote on 8/5/2005, 8:58 AM
I had a similar situation - A friend had another friend who made a DVD slideshow of her brother's memorial service and she wanted it on a website. I used Roxio Easy Media Creator 7 (very buggy and slow but sometimes does just what you need) to capture directly from the DVD to AVI and used Screenblast Movie Studio (what I had at the time) to create both SWF and WMV versions for web viewing which worked great - Soundtrack and all.
VanLazarus wrote on 8/9/2005, 10:28 AM
JohnnyRoy,

When one tool can do many tasks, it is more helpful than a tool that can only do a few tasks. You feel that the line of functionality focus should be drawn between professional and hobbyist... perhaps.... but DVD camcorder data does not fall only under the 'hobbyist' category. If I was a professional editor working for a news station and had to edit amateur video taken by someone near the scene of a news story, then I would hope that my professional video editing software could handle the data from the amateur's DVD camcorder (which, to my knowledge, are not uncommon).

And I do not feel that pre-processing the data is convienent.... possible, but not convienent.

BTW, I was able to use the MPEG2 enabled version of VirtualDub 1.6.9 to read the VOB files (with AC3 audio) and output uncompressed AVI files with MP3 audio. Then, using Vegas, I converted these to great quality PAL DV AVI files for editing. By doing one VOB file at a time, I had enough hard-drive space to store the massive uncompressed AVI files generated by VirtualDub. After about 4 hours of processing, I now have reasonably sized PAL DV files with which to edit.
VanLazarus wrote on 8/9/2005, 10:31 AM
Birdcat,

Thanks for the tip about Roxio Media Creator 7.0. I have to agree, Media Creator is buggy, but sometimes very helpful. I'll have to try this feature next time.
Lawrence wrote on 8/9/2005, 11:09 AM
download the demo of Vegas Moviestudio 6. It's has the feature of import media
from DVD camcorder. You should see the video and ac3 on timeline.
Jay Gladwell wrote on 8/9/2005, 11:48 AM

When one tool can do many tasks, it is more helpful than a tool that can only do a few tasks.

Funny, I've never heard a carpenter bemoan this fact. "It's a shame I can't hammer nails with a screwdriver." Guess they aren't professional enough.


VideJoe wrote on 8/9/2005, 12:57 PM
I tried to use MPG files with VirtualDub but get error message all the time:

MPEG Import Filter Invalid Pack at Position 3: Marker Bit Not Set; Possibly MPEG-2 Stream

I can only use AVI files with VirtualDub.

Do you have a possible solution?

Thanks, Dries.
VanLazarus wrote on 8/10/2005, 6:15 AM
Jay Gladwell,

Your comment is comparing apples and oranges. I'm not expecting Vegas 6 to bake some bread for me. :)

I just feel that reading DVD camcorder data is not outside the world of video editing and would be a useful feature.

If Movie Studio has this ability, perhaps Sony can integrate it easily into the next version of Vegas.
VanLazarus wrote on 8/10/2005, 6:19 AM
DKE,

You need to download the MPEG enabled version.

Try getting it from here: http://fcchandler.home.comcast.net/stable/

You will also need the AC3 ACM Decompressor from the same page.

With both of these installed, I was able to read the VOB files from a DVD camcorder.
farss wrote on 8/10/2005, 6:58 AM
VanLazarus,
I've got about as far as you have after many hours of trials and tribulations. Mostly things looked OK however at times we were noting wierd motion atrifacts, always looked like the field order was wrong but it certainly wasn't consistent and simply swapping the field order threw everything else way out.
Of course the real trap is there's more than one manufacturer of DVD camcorders and they seem to record quite differently. Also each one has different recording modes, ULead media StudioPro is supposed to work with these beasts but that was so unbelievably slow as to be really useless.
Needless to say we cut our losses and got rid of our DVD camcorders, the bigger question isn't why doesn't Vegas work with these things, rather it's how could anyone sell such a useless and expensive piece of technology.
BTW, you'd be pretty surprised at just how many videotape formats most TV stations cannot ingest.They send the tapes out to a dub shop and get them dubbed to a format they can handle.
Bob.
VideJoe wrote on 8/10/2005, 9:55 AM
Thanks for the help "Lazarus'. I found the files and encounter no more problems opening MPEG & VOB filesn VirtualDub.

~Dries.